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- - whats the right Optics for My AR ? (http://goldismoney.info/forums/showthread.php?t=286536)

wille | 07-27-2008 12:38 PM
whats the right Optics for My AR ? With optics ubiquitous on fighting rifles, the old rule that long barrels - with their longer sight radius - are needed for accuracy and longer-range capability is turned on its head. It's possible to get one-moa mechanical accuracy from 18, 16, 14.5, 12.5, and even 10.5-inch barrels, perhaps at a higher cost. Thus, with even short-barreled CQB uppers able to provide pinpoint accuracy to the limit of the 5.56 cartridge's capability- the role differentiation is determined by what optic is mounted on the rail. Put another way- carbine capability is determined by its sights. ... I break down optics in basically three types for fighting carbines: Type I, Type II, and Type III. Type I is basically CQB. Type II is basically DMR. Type III is SPR. ... Type I: 1x or non-magnified red-dot optics, optimized for close-range engagements and effective to the carbine's point-blank range (250-300 yards for a M4/M16 with a 50-yard zero). Type I optics are heads-up, not sensitive to eye position, most are parallax-free. The most common Type I fighting optics are the Aimpoint M2-M4 and the EOTech. No magnification and heads-up binocular sighting provides the fastest sight-picture acquisition and the easiest to maintain while on the move. They are also the easiest to use from weird shoot positions. The downfall of the Type I optic is no magnification which hampers target ID (threat / no-threat). Iron sights still have a place due to bomb-proof mechanical simplicity, and fit in as a Type I sight. ... Type II: low-power magnified optics with reticle features for bullet-drop compensation when engaging targets outside of the cartridge's point-blank range. External and non-capped target knobs/turrets should be avoided to ensure the zero is not lost when the knobs get bumped, hit, or rub on other gear. Type II optics are designed for quickly engaging targets from about 75 yards out to about 400 yards. Many Type II optics are fixed magnification at 3.5x or 4x, however, several variable power 1 - 4x scopes are also in use. The most common is the Trijicon ACOG: 4x (TA31, TA01) or 3.5x (TA11). The US Military realizes many of these needs in the Designated Marksman Rifle (DMR) and Squad Designated Marksman Rifle (SDM-R). ... Type III- the SPR scope. This type of optic has the capability to take the 5.56 cartridge to its ballistic limit and to engage small targets at extended distances. The 18-inch Mk12 Mod 1 SPR uses the Leupold 3-9x36mm M/RT, which was the first scope specifically designed for this role on the M4/M16 platform. The 5.56 cartridge is ballistically limited to 600 - 800 yards at sea level, so the Type III optic needs to be able to engage small targets at this distance. 5.56 has very little energy at this distance, however, 77-grain Mk262 has been used to make kills a over 600 yards. Besides long-range, the Type III optic has the ability to engage very small targets at intermediate ranges, which is a downfall of the Type II optic. When shooting at adversaries who are partially behind cover or wearing armor, being able to place a head-shot several hundred yards away can be key. ... In conclusion- think carefully about your mission and likely engagement requirements, and then pick the type of optic that solves those problems best. The Type I one-power red dot sight is the right choice for the vast majority of fighting with a carbine. The Type II is more specialized yet brings some useful capabilities to the table, whereas the Type III is really a very specialized application. Whatever you choose for your mission- get one of the solid battle-proven optics mentioned here. There's a lot of junk out there that will let you down sooner or later.

ruprick | 07-27-2008 12:54 PM
Re: whats the right Optics for My AR ? Have you ever shot long range rifle? I have experience shooting bone stock, rack grade AR-15 out to 300 yards with open sights.....not a problem to put 40 out of 40 on a man sized target right in the middle of his chest...the size of a dinner plate..... I would not bother with optics....if you can hit men at 300 yards from a prone position...what more do you need? Possibly a 1X red dot.....very pratical...... I prefer a simple set of stock peep sights. Optics are fragile...and not needed. On a sniper rifle...yes, get some optics....but an ar-15 in not the right gun for long range work.....a 308 or 30.06 is a better choice for work beyong 300 yards..... Just stick with the gun as issued. Even an open sighter 30.06 bolt gun or good M1 is very accurate out to 600 yards.....done that as well.....but optice are better for those shots.

wille | 07-27-2008 01:06 PM
Re: whats the right Optics for My AR ? Quote:
Originally Posted by ruprick (Post 1211342) Have you ever shot long range rifle? I have experience shooting bone stock, rack grade AR-15 out to 300 yards with open sights.....not a problem to put 40 out of 40 on a man sized target right in the middle of his chest...the size of a dinner plate..... I would not bother with optics....if you can hit men at 300 yards from a prone position...what more do you need? Possibly a 1X red dot.....very pratical...... I prefer a simple set of stock peep sights. Optics are fragile...and not needed. On a sniper rifle...yes, get some optics....but an ar-15 in not the right gun for long range work.....a 308 or 30.06 is a better choice for work beyong 300 yards..... Just stick with the gun as issued. Even an open sighter 30.06 bolt gun or good M1 is very accurate out to 600 yards.....done that as well.....but optice are better for those shots.
10-4 RUAPRICK-- All day long with the M16 at fort Benning ARHHHH. Im pickin up a Armalite AR15 A4 today meetup at the grocery store parkin lot-- never been shot 1000$-- Im surfin for some good fixed sights to mount on the rail, got any recs for me? THX Armalite 223 Remington Semi-Automatic Tactical Rifle The ArmaLite automatic rifles are innovative semi-automatic rifles bearing a unique octagonal receiver bedded into an aluminum stock. They are equipped with a modified M16 type vertical pistol grip and a removable buttstock for ease of transport. SPECIFICATIONS: Mfg Item Num: 15A4TN Category: FIREARMS - RIFLES Action :Semi-Automatic Caliber :223 Remington Barrel Length :24" Heavy Barrel Capacity :30 rd Trigger :National Match Safety :Lever Length :42.4" Weight :9.2 lbs Stock :Green Fiberglass Finish :Stainless Steel

LukeNM | 07-27-2008 01:14 PM
Re: whats the right Optics for My AR ? EOTech Holographic Weapon Sight 557.AR223 http://www.eotech-inc.com/product.php?id=8&cat=1

wille | 07-27-2008 01:38 PM
Re: whats the right Optics for My AR ? Quote:
Originally Posted by wildcard (Post 1211383) http://demigodllc.com/articles/fight...for-the-ar-15/
No Shyte huh? good intel. Id pick another but I buy em all cash-- cant turn the frns into just fod gold and silver ya know----:smokin:

SilverCity | 07-27-2008 01:51 PM
Re: whats the right Optics for My AR ? QUOTE: I would not bother with optics....if you can hit men at 300 yards from a prone position...what more do you need? UNQUOTE Try this concept on for size: URBAN COMBAT If irons were adequate for the m-16 in combat, why do we see so many scopes, red dots, and other junk (?) stacked on the rifles used by U.S. forces in Iraq and Afghanistan. A good scope might allow the possibility of a tight shot on a pair of eyes peeking around a street corner in Fallujah.

wille | 07-27-2008 01:58 PM
Re: whats the right Optics for My AR ? Quote:
Originally Posted by SilverCity (Post 1211415) QUOTE: I would not bother with optics....if you can hit men at 300 yards from a prone position...what more do you need? Try this concept on for size: URBAN COMBAT If irons were adequate for the m-16 in combat, why do we see so many scopes, red dots, and other junk (?) stacked on the rifles used by U.S. forces in Iraq? A good scope might allow the possiblitiy of a tight shot on a pair of eyes peeking around a corner on a street in Falujah.
I think your seeing them on the larger Calibers .

SilverCity | 07-27-2008 02:05 PM
Re: whats the right Optics for My AR ? 4 Attachment(s) Quote:
Originally Posted by wille (Post 1211423) I think your seeing them on the larger Calibers .
Like these?

Elvis | 07-27-2008 11:00 PM
Re: whats the right Optics for My AR ? What do you think you're going to be using it for? Close quarters = quality red dot. Long distance = Trijicon Both = variable system (red dot with magnifier, adjustable -- which I don't like)

electric-amish | 07-27-2008 11:21 PM
Re: whats the right Optics for My AR ? AR15.com has a supporter LaRue Tacticle. E-Mail Mark(I think thats his name) These guys could direct you in 2 seconds. I've never delt with him but have read good things and he was mentioned in a thriller novel---so hes got to be good:D E-A

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