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- - Bought rifle, now looking at handgun (http://goldismoney.info/forums/showthread.php?t=388559)

daveman | 07-05-2009 09:19 PM
Bought rifle, now looking at handgun Got the rifle, now looking at the handgun. I've started a thread sometime back about 1st handgun also, but the information was just so overwhelming and the thread soon turned into a war for many. I just need something for self-defense/home defense/carry-in-a-riot. Something that shoots straight, easy to maintain, and has reasonable stopping power would suffice, I will not be confronting a bear with a handgun. Thank you guys in advance for your inputs.

Operation Grief | 07-05-2009 09:21 PM
Re: Bought rifle, now looking at handgun Glock 20 (10mm)

Caligula | 07-05-2009 09:25 PM
Re: Bought rifle, now looking at handgun Quote:
Originally Posted by Operation Grief (Post 1802447) Glock 20 (10mm)
21 or a 30. More common ammo....similar results.

daveman | 07-05-2009 09:33 PM
Re: Bought rifle, now looking at handgun Thanks guys. What's the "accurate" range for these handguns, or just glocks, in particular? Or how accurate are they period?

SilverCity | 07-05-2009 10:25 PM
Re: Bought rifle, now looking at handgun Quote:
Originally Posted by daveman (Post 1802461) Thanks guys. What's the "accurate" range for these handguns, or just glocks, in particular? Or how accurate are they period?
Most self-defense shootings occur at 10 yards or less, so at that distance, you could put all shots into an eyeball. I have easily put five shots into 2 inches or less at ~20 yards with any of the above mentioned pistols and can consistently break clay pigeons against a backstop 50 yards away. Glocks are accurate. Learn to pull the trigger smoothly and not jerk it off target...and you will surprise yourself.

Silvestor | 07-06-2009 03:06 AM
Re: Bought rifle, now looking at handgun Sig 229 in .40 SW

Glass | 07-06-2009 03:50 AM
Re: Bought rifle, now looking at handgun Quote:
Originally Posted by SilverCity (Post 1802535) Glocks are accurate. Learn to pull the trigger smoothly and not jerk it off target...and you will surprise yourself.
I was wondering if you could offer a few pointers in this respect. I am shooting bottom left quadrant which I think is due to anticipating the shot?? I am breaking in a new CZ phantom. I am also improving but at this rate I could end up with 1000's of rounds down range and a nasty habit that I can't break out of. I wonder how I should set up for this? Is left hand (other hand) for steadying or should I be using it for a more forceful presentation on the target? I hope that makes sense? Sort of pushing back type of thing. Does anyone have any tips for the thought process in taking each shot please? thanks Apologies to the OP for taking this slightly OT.

morganchaser | 07-06-2009 03:56 AM
Re: Bought rifle, now looking at handgun Quote:
Originally Posted by daveman (Post 1802446) Got the rifle, now looking at the handgun. I've started a thread sometime back about 1st handgun also, but the information was just so overwhelming and the thread soon turned into a war for many. I just need something for self-defense/home defense/carry-in-a-riot. Something that shoots straight, easy to maintain, and has reasonable stopping power would suffice, I will not be confronting a bear with a handgun. Thank you guys in advance for your inputs.
I really like the erganomics on the Walther P22 and P99.(can train for cheap on the gun you carry if you get one of each) CZ-52 was my first and I gave the issue alot of thought. When it was time to conceal carry: I decided on a CZ-82. My needs for the first were: 1.kevlar, 2.cheap, 3.accurate, 4.durable, 5.reliable, 6.adequate damage. (It was mainly that is was cheap and shot 7.62x25 but the fact that the gun is all steel, thin, and pretty helped) My needs for the second were: easy/comfortable to conceal reliable high capacity accuracy adequate damage This was a more personal choice. The Makarov might be more to your liking depending on how much ammo you want to have. My decision strategy: There's a best gun for any specific combination of needs, and I think narrowing your focus to military surplus gets you the best value. The left overs can be invested in training. In brief? gun you have multiple attackers FTF=dead mozambique Then you need a CCW(use superglue/latex and a laser printer for the fingerprints) Then you need an AK74 and a Sidefolding/bullpup Saiga 12. Then you need a ruger 10/22 Then you need a .22lr pistol Then you need a scope and a bipod for the rifle. Then you need a reloading press & sabots. Then you need the discipline to train on all of them until you're good. Never buy a gun without a cleaning rod to match btw(.17hmr still hasn't been cleaned)

morganchaser | 07-06-2009 04:03 AM
Re: Bought rifle, now looking at handgun Quote:
Originally Posted by Glass (Post 1802900) I was wondering if you could offer a few pointers in this respect. I am shooting bottom left quadrant which I think is due to anticipating the shot?? I am breaking in a new CZ phantom. I am also improving but at this rate I could end up with 1000's of rounds down range and a nasty habit that I can't break out of. I wonder how I should set up for this? Is left hand (other hand) for steadying or should I be using it for a more forceful presentation on the target? I hope that makes sense? Sort of pushing back type of thing. Does anyone have any tips for the thought process in taking each shot please? thanks Apologies to the OP for taking this slightly OT.
I haven't done enough paper with my pistol so I can't help there. tactics: Fire burst step to the side evaluate Fire next burst target: think of the motion of the gun as a descending spiral and pull the trigger when the spiral is tight and on target. BRAS Breathe Relax Aim Squeeze Word on the street: you point shoot or focus on the front side blade in a fire fight. tunnel vision The ones who have survived multiple one's have a reputation for being point shooters.

MilitantOne | 07-06-2009 07:17 AM
Re: Bought rifle, now looking at handgun Quote:
Originally Posted by daveman (Post 1802461) Thanks guys. What's the "accurate" range for these handguns, or just glocks, in particular? Or how accurate are they period?
My glock has been the most accurate out of the box pistol I have ever purchased. I like the 8" balloons :553: at 75yds as a cheap reactionary target.

gbgunner | 07-06-2009 07:54 AM
Re: Bought rifle, now looking at handgun Quote:
I haven't done enough paper with my pistol so I can't help there. tactics: Fire burst step to the side evaluate Fire next burst target: think of the motion of the gun as a descending spiral and pull the trigger when the spiral is tight and on target. BRAS Breathe Relax Aim Squeeze Word on the street: you point shoot or focus on the front side blade in a fire fight. tunnel vision The ones who have survived multiple one's have a reputation for being point shooters.
Ummmm........we should all be careful about the advice we give new shooters. :no_ma:

SilverCity | 07-06-2009 10:34 AM
Re: Bought rifle, now looking at handgun 1 Attachment(s) Quote:
Originally Posted by Glass (Post 1802900) I was wondering if you could offer a few pointers in this respect. I am shooting bottom left quadrant which I think is due to anticipating the shot?? I am breaking in a new CZ phantom. I am also improving but at this rate I could end up with 1000's of rounds down range and a nasty habit that I can't break out of. I wonder how I should set up for this? Is left hand (other hand) for steadying or should I be using it for a more forceful presentation on the target? I hope that makes sense? Sort of pushing back type of thing. Does anyone have any tips for the thought process in taking each shot please? thanks Apologies to the OP for taking this slightly OT.
You may be flinching (anticipating and jerking the trigger) and pulling the shot low and left. I recommend shooting first from a padded rest with both hands and slow deliberate shots. Hold the pistol firmly (not a death grip) and lock your wrists with the left hand supporting the right. If you are still shooting low and left, your sights may need to be adjusted. Also try different ammo. When you can shoot it straight from the rest, then try it without... This (right handed) chart may help you some:

Operation Grief | 07-06-2009 01:49 PM
Re: Bought rifle, now looking at handgun Quote:
Originally Posted by Operation Grief (Post 1802447) Glock 20 (10mm)
Versatile ammo (135gr � 230gr). Outperforms the .40. And you can get all the ammo you want through DoubleTap. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/10mm_Auto

Shasta Gold | 07-06-2009 02:59 PM
Re: Bought rifle, now looking at handgun I thought you bought a Remington 870 shotgun?

morganchaser | 07-06-2009 03:11 PM
Re: Bought rifle, now looking at handgun Quote:
Originally Posted by gbgunner (Post 1803026) Ummmm........we should all be careful about the advice we give new shooters. :no_ma:
Just relaying information I've heard. I'd bite my tongue if there weren't people with more experience watching to dispute any false conceptions. If they're agreed with they stand and save people the trouble of writing. Being corrected is one of the most informative sources of information out there.

TomD | 07-06-2009 04:15 PM
Re: Bought rifle, now looking at handgun Quote:
Originally Posted by Operation Grief (Post 1802447) Glock 20 (10mm)
Dunno bout that, lots of recoil so may not be suitable for someone not very experienced. Plus rare and expensive ammo. I vote for 40 S&W and definitely agree on the Glock.

AurumAg | 07-06-2009 05:40 PM
10mm ammo availability? Quote:
Originally Posted by Operation Grief (Post 1803493) Versatile ammo (135gr � 230gr). Outperforms the .40. And you can get all the ammo you want through DoubleTap. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/10mm_Auto
I like the concept of the 10mm, but I was under the impression that mags, spare parts, and ammo are significantly less available than anything in 9mm or .40. I would recommend a Sig P226 or S&W M&P in .40 caliber. I own both, and although the Sig is more accurate, the M&P is both reliable and accurate enough for 10 yard gun-fight, at half the cost. .40 is the defacto standard caliber for LEOs, so ammo, mags and spare parts are plentiful, and will remain so for quite a while. I am still interested in learning more about the 10mm though.

TomD | 07-06-2009 06:05 PM
Re: Bought rifle, now looking at handgun This quote is from the wikipedia link "Although it (10 MM) was selected by the FBI for use in the field, their Firearms Training Unit "concluded that its recoil was excessive in terms of training for average agent/police officer competency of use and qualification," and the pistols that chambered it were too large for some small-handed individuals.[3] These issues led to the creation and eventual adoption of a shortened version of the 10 mm that would evolve into what is today the .40 S&W."

Operation Grief | 07-06-2009 06:31 PM
Re: Bought rifle, now looking at handgun Quote:
Originally Posted by TomD (Post 1803732) Dunno bout that, lots of recoil so may not be suitable for someone not very experienced.
Yeah, if you're girl. That's why the FBI dropped it. Female agents couldn't handle the recoil. But if you're good with a .357 mag, then 10mm should be no problem. That would be my second pick after the Glock 20—the S&W 620 (7-shot).

Operation Grief | 07-06-2009 06:35 PM
Re: Bought rifle, now looking at handgun Quote:
Originally Posted by TomD (Post 1803852) This quote is from the wikipedia link "Although it (10 MM) was selected by the FBI for use in the field, their Firearms Training Unit "concluded that its recoil was excessive in terms of training for average agent/police officer competency of use and qualification"
Again, they were being PC. The male agents could handle it; the females couldn't.

Operation Grief | 07-06-2009 06:42 PM
Re: Bought rifle, now looking at handgun Here's a chick who can handle a 10mm (Glock 29). http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nt6_EmWxStc
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Nt6_EmWxStc

gbgunner | 07-06-2009 06:50 PM
Re: Bought rifle, now looking at handgun Quote:
Originally Posted by TomD (Post 1803732) Dunno bout that, lots of recoil so may not be suitable for someone not very experienced. Plus rare and expensive ammo. I vote for 40 S&W and definitely agree on the Glock.
Yupper. Nothing wrong with going Glock. The other thing with 10mm is cost. A new shooter may not practice very often when they must find and pay for 10mm.

Operation Grief | 07-06-2009 07:15 PM
Re: 10mm ammo availability? Quote:
Originally Posted by AurumAg (Post 1803828) I am still interested in learning more about the 10mm though.
The FBI also has quite a few MP5s in 10mm. Throw on a suppressor...yeah, definitely somebody's dream gun. http://www.ijag.us/weapons/weap_MP5-10mm.jpg http://www.remtek.com/arms/hk/mil/mp5/mp510/mp510.htm

berkscoin | 07-06-2009 08:45 PM
Re: Bought rifle, now looking at handgun My first handgun purchase was a Sig P220, .45 cal. I love the way it looks, big heavy ammo with tons of knock down power. Got CCP and found it wears me out to carry it. Too big, too heavy, too difficult to conceal. Maybe I thought I was going to be Dirty Harry or something. It's a friggin' cannon. Second purchase was Walther PP. 7,65 mm. 8 round capacity. Thin and light. Extra clips easy to find, easy to carry extra clips in a jacket pockets. Easy to conceal. Bought a vintage 1965, still in original box for $500. Very accurate at close range. Easy to put in back pocket if wearing jeans or shorts. Here is my thought process. If someone is 50 yards away, he is not much of a threat. If I am engaged in a shootout at 40, 50 yards, I should be using a rifle. Cannot imagine a scenario where I am shooting at someone at that range in normal daily life. If he is 20 feet away, and is a threat I can put 8 rounds in him no problem. (Carjacking, home invasion). These are my concerns, not someone a city block away. Why carry this huge Sig when this small Walther can do the job I need to do. Also got my wife a CCP, she carries my back-up, another identical Walther. Now, the Sig lives under the driver's seat of the truck, never carry that one on me.

Irons | 07-06-2009 09:04 PM
Re: 10mm ammo availability? Quote:
Originally Posted by AurumAg (Post 1803828) I like the concept of the 10mm, but I was under the impression that mags, spare parts, and ammo are significantly less available than anything in 9mm or .40. I would recommend a Sig P226 or S&W M&P in .40 caliber. I own both, and although the Sig is more accurate, the M&P is both reliable and accurate enough for 10 yard gun-fight, at half the cost. .40 is the defacto standard caliber for LEOs, so ammo, mags and spare parts are plentiful, and will remain so for quite a while. I am still interested in learning more about the 10mm though.
I have a couple of Colt Delta 10mm's from back in the late 80's when they first came out and yeah, they are fun to shoot and crank some serious FPS for an auto pistol. Ammo is scarce and costly now but some of us still have enough to light up the 10's from time to time, they are hell on bowling pins with light bullets. :RockOn: Mullets and 10mm autos, we were cool back then!:applause_

daveman | 07-07-2009 01:31 AM
Re: Bought rifle, now looking at handgun Quote:
Originally Posted by Shasta Gold (Post 1803593) I thought you bought a Remington 870 shotgun?
Yes I did.

illuminate10 | 07-07-2009 05:29 AM
Re: Bought rifle, now looking at handgun If you have small hands then a glock might not work for you because they tend to have wider grips due to high capacity. Also is capacity high on the list? I ask because in Cali you can only have 10 rounds in any magazine so I opted for a 45 instead of the 9mm. Also what's your budget like? Nice choice in the 870, I can testify to that. Yet, so is the clone in the Hawk 982 with ghost ring sights too. :bear_thumb:

Raymond | 07-07-2009 08:27 PM
Re: Bought rifle, now looking at handgun Daveman, If there's a range in your area which rents handguns to use on the premises, go there and try different pistols. If you have friends who own different guns, ask if you can try them out at the range. We can all recommend our favorites, but only you can determine what fits your hands and can shoot well, and is of a sufficiently effective caliber. As berkscoin mentioned, you also have to consider concealability, weight and carry method.

maximumrebel1 | 07-07-2009 10:03 PM
Re: Bought rifle, now looking at handgun My vote is for a Glock 21, I own one and I love it. .45 is a great caliber, although 1k rounds will set you back 800 bucks on ammoman now.

bwelkk | 07-07-2009 11:59 PM
Re: Bought rifle, now looking at handgun imo, the Glock 19 (9mm) is the pinnacle of value both for the gun and for the ammunition

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Flinch | 07-08-2009 10:36 AM
Re: Bought rifle, now looking at handgun My $.02. Glock fans will tell you to get a glock, 1911 fans will suggest one of JMB's finest creations. Wheelgun fanatics are, well, fanatics. What I've found to be helpfull in selecting a sidearm is going to a rental range (or your local sportsman's club) and firing several different stlyes of handguns, revolvers and semi-auto's. Rule out the ones which do not fit well in your hand and try firing both single and double action firearms. Find one which fits your hand and is concealable with a good holster. - Regardless of caliber - That's an entirely different discussion. If you choose a pistol over a revolver I'd strongly suggest finding a .22lr conversion so you can get some inexpensive pratice in. Pratice, pratice, pratice is how you'll have a handgun which "shoots straight".

.41Dave | 07-08-2009 02:49 PM
Re: Bought rifle, now looking at handgun Quote:
Originally Posted by Flinch (Post 1806842) My $.02. Glock fans will tell you to get a glock, 1911 fans will suggest one of JMB's finest creations. Wheelgun fanatics are, well, fanatics. What I've found to be helpfull in selecting a sidearm is going to a rental range (or your local sportsman's club) and firing several different stlyes of handguns, revolvers and semi-auto's. Rule out the ones which do not fit well in your hand and try firing both single and double action firearms. Find one which fits your hand and is concealable with a good holster. - Regardless of caliber - That's an entirely different discussion. If you choose a pistol over a revolver I'd strongly suggest finding a .22lr conversion so you can get some inexpensive pratice in. Pratice, pratice, pratice is how you'll have a handgun which "shoots straight".
Best advice in this thread thus far.

ToBeSelfEvident | 07-08-2009 03:36 PM
Re: Bought rifle, now looking at handgun If you ever plan to carry it, you should look for something fairly small and light. Maybe the S&W 642, an aluminum snubnose .38 with concealed hammer that will not snag on clothes. http://www.smith-wesson.com/wcsstore...3810_thumb.jpg Not the best stopping power in the world, but it is accurate and reliable.

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