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BarnacleBob | 11-20-2009 12:11 PM
Gun control: Stealth agenda revealed by Attorney General Holder Gun control: Stealth agenda revealed by Attorney General Holder Law Enforcement Examiner friends, the Law Enforcement Alliance of America, yesterday responded to President Barack Obama's Attorney General's US Senate testimony on Wednesday, November 18. According to the 65,000-member LEAA, Attorney General Eric Holder "revealed a stunningly broad and aggressive anti-gun agenda. �The President of the United States asked that politicians not use the Ft. Hood attack to engage in �political theater�. It appears those committed to attacking gun owners and the Second Amendment simply can�t help themselves and are engaged in blaming guns and gun owners on the heels of this terrorist attack. Sadly it looks like �politics as usual�,� said LEAA�s spokesperson, Ted Deeds. After explaining and defending his decision to give enemy combatants constitutional protections and the right to public trial in civilian courts in New York City, Attorney General Holder revealed his support for a national gun owner registration scheme and authorizing the government to ban firearm possession for any person by merely adding that person�s name to the terror watch list, Deeds revealed in a statement. Drawing reasonable conclusions from what Holder publicly said, Deeds points out that: * Holder wants a national, permanent gun registration system administered by law enforcement. A registration of honest citizens that have cleared the federal background check for gun purchases with those records permanently retained by and shared among law enforcement. * Holder wants new federal authority to prohibit any person on the federal watch list (reported to be 400,000 names) from buying guns and supports confiscating guns from those on the list who posses them. General Holder testified: �The position of the Administration is that there should be a basis for law enforcement to share information about gun purchases.� �... [It�s not] inconsistent to allow law enforcement agencies to share that kind of information, for that information to be retained and then to be shared by law enforcement.� �It seems incongruous to me that we would bar certain people from flying on airplanes because they are on the terrorist watch list and yet we would still allow them to posses weapons,� said Holder. LEAA�s Executive Director Jim Fotis replied, �Those behind the badge don�t believe more restrictions on honest gun owners is a reasonable, practical or constitutional response to acts of terrorism. As a retired officer, I know that America�s men and women in blue want to fight terrorism, to stop terrorists; not waste time keeping records on innocent gun owners!� Based in Virginia with over 65,000 members and supporters nationally, the Law Enforcement Alliance of America (LEAA) is the nation�s largest coalition of law enforcement professionals, crime victims, and concerned citizens dedicated to making America safer. Visit the groups web site at www.LEAA.org http://www.examiner.com/x-2684-Law-E...General-Holder

Twisted Avatar | 11-20-2009 12:31 PM
Re: Gun control: Stealth agenda revealed by Attorney General Holder REGISTRATION BEGATS CONFISCATION BEGATS GENONCIDE T

chad | 11-20-2009 12:36 PM
Re: Gun control: Stealth agenda revealed by Attorney General Holder remember back when the yellow sheet foolishness first began? first, it was "going to get thrown away for sure, not kept," after you got called in and checked out okay. then it changed to "we need to keep it on file for awhile." then it changed to "wee need to keep it on file forever." now it's changing to "not only do we need to keep it forever, we need to share it with everybody." frog in the pot indeed.

Doge | 11-20-2009 12:50 PM
Re: Gun control: Stealth agenda revealed by Attorney General Holder Quote:
“Those behind the badge don’t believe more restrictions on honest gun owners is a reasonable, practical or constitutional response to acts of terrorism. As a retired officer, I know that America’s men and women in blue want to fight terrorism, to stop terrorists; not waste time keeping records on innocent gun owners!”
You know I keep looking at the second amendment trying to find where it says that the only "innocent", "honest", or "law abiding" citizens are allowed to bear arms. I just can't find it..... They have created a state of mind among U.S. gun owners now that you have to be a "law abiding" citizen in order to keep you right to bear arms. That is ridiculous. Do we have to keep abiding unconstitutional laws in order to keep some constitutional rights?

moreair | 11-20-2009 02:47 PM
Re: Gun control: Stealth agenda revealed by Attorney General Holder Come n get em!

mick silver | 11-20-2009 02:56 PM
Re: Gun control: Stealth agenda revealed by Attorney General Holder I think the line being draw in the sand . there alot of people that think they have more right then you are me also there alot of other country that think it time we take the arms away from the people in the usa . i would say the UN is the biggest player in this . The NWO cannot control this country till the guns are gone from the hands of freedom loving people .

renegade_01 | 11-20-2009 02:56 PM
Re: Gun control: Stealth agenda revealed by Attorney General Holder The thought of registration makes me laugh. I'd love to see the cowards try it! Bring IT ON. I need something to shoot at.

Will work for wine | 11-20-2009 04:07 PM
Re: Gun control: Stealth agenda revealed by Attorney General Holder Right, bring it on, we all need something to shoot at. We all feel the same way until the mod squad shows up wearing flak jackets carrying shields and machine guns and tossing gas grenades at us. This is not a reality show. Who will willing, really, to put their life on the line for our beliefs? I am armed but will I really pull the trigger? I don't know.

madfranks | 11-20-2009 04:17 PM
Re: Gun control: Stealth agenda revealed by Attorney General Holder Quote:
Originally Posted by Will work for wine (Post 2036034) Right, bring it on, we all need something to shoot at. We all feel the same way until the mod squad shows up wearing flak jackets carrying shields and machine guns and tossing gas grenades at us. This is not a reality show. Who will willing, really, to put their life on the line for our beliefs? I am armed but will I really pull the trigger? I don't know.
By the time they start going door to door like that, group resistance will have already formed to the point that their goon squads will not make it past the first few neighborhoods. They can't send SWAT teams to every house in America at once, so trust me, once this starts happening on a large scale, organized resistance will occur. People are pissed right now at the government, so the government better check their heads before they try anything like this because they're gonna get outnumbered by groups of pissed off Americans who will fight back, who will shoot back if they start shooting at us. This stuff breeds revolutions. We will not be disarmed. They are fools if they try it now.

Twisted Avatar | 11-20-2009 04:18 PM
Re: Gun control: Stealth agenda revealed by Attorney General Holder 1 Attachment(s) Quote:
Originally Posted by moreair (Post 2035888) Come n get em!
No, no ....... You gotta tell em like this:

Twisted Avatar | 11-20-2009 04:37 PM
Re: Gun control: Stealth agenda revealed by Attorney General Holder Quote:
Originally Posted by madfranks (Post 2036050) By the time they start going door to door like that, group resistance will have already formed to the point that their goon squads will not make it past the first few neighborhoods. They can't send SWAT teams to every house in America at once, so trust me, once this starts happening on a large scale, organized resistance will occur. People are pissed right now at the government, so the government better check their heads before they try anything like this because they're gonna get outnumbered by groups of pissed off Americans who will fight back, who will shoot back if they start shooting at us. This stuff breeds revolutions. We will not be disarmed. They are fools if they try it now.
THEY ARE NOT RUNNING UP IN THE MANS HOUSE WARNING: EXPLICT LANGUAGE You Tube
You Tube

scottymonger | 11-20-2009 04:41 PM
Re: Gun control: Stealth agenda revealed by Attorney General Holder Me and Mark will be waiting, cleaning our guns. You Tube
You Tube

State of Jefferson | 11-20-2009 04:56 PM
Re: Gun control: Stealth agenda revealed by Attorney General Holder Quote:
Originally Posted by Will work for wine (Post 2036034) am armed but will I really pull the trigger?
They will. You better decide now how you will go. Once the confiscation starts, all gun owners who don't bring them to the "law enforcement" station will be subject to being liquidated in their homes. White flag or flag flying high?

H8T fiat | 11-20-2009 05:56 PM
Re: Gun control: Stealth agenda revealed by Attorney General Holder The goon squads will be on a one way suicide mission and they will also be endangering the lives of ordinary cops as well as putting their own families and loved ones in jeopardy .

renegade_01 | 11-20-2009 07:02 PM
Re: Gun control: Stealth agenda revealed by Attorney General Holder I will fight back...or let me rephrase that, I will throw the first blow in this battle. I can garantee if the cowards come, I will pull the trigger before they do. I have already made my peace and I don't have kids to look after. This is my fight. It is the good fight, and you must fight it if and when it comes. The right to self defense is inherent. You inherit it when you took your first breath. It will be with you till you take the last breath. Don't let anyone ever cow down and tell you to suck up tyranny. F*ck these traitors. They will push and I will PULL. :36_1_30:

Patriotme | 11-20-2009 09:05 PM
Re: Gun control: Stealth agenda revealed by Attorney General Holder Quote:
Originally Posted by Will work for wine (Post 2036034) Right, bring it on, we all need something to shoot at. We all feel the same way until the mod squad shows up wearing flak jackets carrying shields and machine guns and tossing gas grenades at us. This is not a reality show. Who will willing, really, to put their life on the line for our beliefs? I am armed but will I really pull the trigger? I don't know.
It will be many years, probably decades until they actually show up at your door. The slow assault on gun rights will continue. An outright ban on all ownership will not happen immediately. We'll see the "Assault Weapon" Ban and hi capacity mag ban come back. Next will be whatever the flavor of the month is. Perhaps it will be guns in military calibers or anything that will pierce a bulletproof vest. Perhaps it will be those high powered scoped hunting rifles that are really just "Sniper Rifles" that you cannot miss with. The government may have to face insurection if they enacted an outright ban. Even Obama and crew are smart enough to know that. They'll keep a slow steady assault on gun rights. Different gun owning groups will continue to be demonized until they finally come for the "Hunting Rifles" that anti gunners always say they support. In addition to new laws we'll see a demonizing of gun owners in both the government supporitng media (CNN, MSNBC, ABC, CBS and ABC) and Hollywood. All gun owners will be portrayed as stupid, drunk, careless, etc. This already happens to some extent. We'll also likely see property seizure laws. Sure....you are ready to risk your life defending your 2nd Amendment rights but is your spouse ready to risk losing your home because the government starts seizing property with illegal guns located within? How about if your kids are put in foster care because guns were discovered in your home and the enviroment is not "Safe." Remember, Obama and others in his Administration studied behavioral science. They would rather convince you to give up your rights rather than pass an unpopular law. This could be done with the steps listed above or simply pricing guns out of the market. Extremely high taxes on guns, ammo, ownership and shooting could easily price many gun owners out of owning guns. Sure...you reload but I'm talking aobut the masses of sheeple that make up this country. Put most of the ranges out of business with EPA laws and shooting will drop off over a few decades. Perhaps the government will give bonuses to informants that give info about gun owners. Your children will have anti gun indoctrination at the schools (this happens to some extent already) and a constant parade of entertainers will tell them how evil guns are. Lawyers and lawsuits. The government could require a $_________ in homeowners insurance for gun owners. They could encourage lawsuits against individuals when their guns are stolen and used in a crime. The same can be said for gun accidents or the "Stress" of someone that realized they were visiting a home with guns within. The sky is the limit. If you have imagination you can invent a policy or law that will discourage gun ownership. All the while they may say that no one wants to take away your rights. Ka ching, ka ching, ka ching....it just becomes too expensive to own a gun unless you are willing to sacrifice a lot to do so or risk your family and fortune. You will however be able to keep your gun collection. The problem is your gun collection will be banned piece by piece. First the assault weapons go, next the hi capacity mags, next go the concealable guns under a certain size. Next the scoped rifles go. Then the military calibers or those guns that take ammo that will pierce a bulletproof vest (rated for handgun ammo). All the while you'll hear that "No one wants to ban your hunting rifle or shotgun." Oh yeah.....the NRA. Organizations like this may very well end up on terrorist watch lists along with their members. This is a dire prediction. It won't happen overnight or even by 2012. They'll continue their babysteps of building on every anti gun success with another new gun law. That's why we must oppose any and all new bans. Useless laws such as registration also need opposing. Long story short.....get your butt to DC this upcoming spring for the 2nd Amendment march and show your legislators that we will not stand idly by. Vote these anti gun politicians out and finally......Liberals.....stop telling us how pro gun you personally are when you keep sending these useless anti gun politicians to DC to rule over the sheeple.

Worldmariner | 11-27-2009 02:05 PM
Re: Gun control: Stealth agenda revealed by Attorney General Holder I recently heard a new phrase to describe what is happening here in America... "Liberal Facism". The liberal/socialist agenda being pushed and draconian laws giving The State the power to actually enforce the laws and "policies". I am reminded of Thomas Paine’s book “Common Sense” and also of new version by the same name written by a popular talk show host. I am not a fan of either CNN nor Fox; but I do watch both equally so as to get a better picture of what is happening in out political environment. The only way to combat this Socialist/Fascist agenda and legislation is through politics. We need more people to write to their Member of Congress (that means your elected Representative to the House of Representatives. Their job is to listen to the citizenry) and their Senator. By "more people" I mean **YOU**, the reader. "You" need to register to vote, "You" need to write to your elected officials, "You" need to join pro-second amendment organizations, like the GOA and the NRA. "You" need to go to local government meetings and voice your opinions. Here are the links: www.Congress.org Member of Congress to the House of Representatives: https://writerep.house.gov/writerep/welcome.shtml Your Senator: http://www.senate.gov/pagelayout/senators/f_two_sections_with_teasers/states.htm Your governor: http://www.usa.gov/Contact/Governors.shtml National Rifle Association: www.nra.org Gun Owners of America: www.gunowners.org Many many forum posters seem to be the paranoid wall flower "I don't want my name on a list! I am not even registered to vote!" types... They wring their hands about what is happening, but they want SOMEONE ELSE to do the dirty work and take a chance, speak up, write the letters, cast the votes, and yet reap the rewards. If you are one of these types, (YOU KNOW WHO YOU ARE!!) you need to remember this: If you have ever filled out a Form 4473, trust me, you are in a database. If you are a member of GOA or the NRA, trust me, you are in a database. If you have ever registered to vote, trust me, you are in a database. If you have a driver's license, trust me, you are in a database. If you use your SSN to earn income, trust me, you are in a database. If you ever used your credit card to buy gun parts or ammo, you are in a database. If you were ever in the military... well you get the idea... keyed in on your name and DOB. Cross referenced with your SSN. With the (undeclared and in my opinion unconstitutional) continuing "war" on terror, the Department of Homeland Security and Congress have teamed up and are finishing up the process of making all the local, state, and Federal databases cross-searchable and accessible by ANY agency, NO WARRENT, NO JUDGE, required. If you are too cowardly to stand up and be counted, to make your voice heard, what will you do with your gun when tyranny arrives? I mean, you already know that you are a coward, so what will you do? Take your super secret gun and go shoot someone in a blue helmet or a black Hummer? I think not. We know what you will do. YOU know, deep down, what you will do. You will whisper about the Good Ol Days and hope that "someone else" does something, while you let your super secret gun rust in it's super secret hiding place, and be angry and post angry messages on forums about how somebody "should have done something". (Pardon me a moment whilst I vomit) That "someone" is **YOU**. GET OFF YOUR ASS and start DOING something about it, and posting messages on forums is NOT action! It is talk. Being a member on a website like www.righttokeepandbeararms.com is nice, and well meaning, and a fantastic resource for ideas, BUT it is not TRUE ACTION; it is feel good action. Joining a website WILL NOT cause change. Writing letters and being politically active is what causes change. Best idea: Buy as many firearms as you want. Give them as gifts! Register as many SBR's and suppressors as you can, join EVERY pro gun lobby group you can, and learn how to start grass roots legislation. Urge your friends to get CCW permits and to buy guns, including assault rifles. Take them shooting and let them burn through a box of your ammo. Turn them on to firearms. Get them re-acquainted with personal responsibility. Get them going in the right direction. Turn America BACK INTO a gun culture and freedom culture and personal responsibility culture. THAT is how to beat DHS, Napolitano, Clinton, an increasing militarized police force (anyone else notice that trend??), other anti-firearms groups, and generally "The Fed". The Feds just follow the rules. If the rules change, so do they. They are like the Borg. They are guys, most... smart, but not brilliant. They are working away at a Federal retirement, doing their job. If the rules change tomorrow and allow everyone to own an unregistered suppressor, believe me, the hour the legislation passes, they will stop activity related to suppressors. Most of those ATF guys (that I know anyway) are not rabidly anti-gun. Most all of them own firearms themselves. They are just following the rules. They do not get cash bonuses for finding illegal guns, such as the IRS agents receive for "recovering" "lost" revenue from recalcitrant tax payers. (Everyone here knows that, right? The IRS guys get a slice of the recovered money as an "on the spot cash award". THAT is why the IRS guys are so rabid. They are motivated by greed) If you are offended by reading this post, then YOU are PROBABLY the guy this post is aimed at! Soapbox Rant Complete. Thanks for reading! We now return to our regularly scheduled constitutional programing…

Worldmariner | 11-27-2009 02:10 PM
Re: Gun control: Stealth agenda revealed by Attorney General Holder I recently heard a new phrase to describe what is happening here in America... "Liberal Facism". The liberal/socialist agenda being pushed and draconian laws giving The State the power to actually enforce the laws and "policies". I am reminded of Thomas Paine�s book �Common Sense� and also of new version by the same name written by a popular talk show host. I am not a fan of either CNN nor Fox; but I do watch both equally so as to get a better picture of what is happening in out political environment. The only way to combat this Socialist/Fascist agenda and legislation is through politics. We need more people to write to their Member of Congress (that means your elected Representative to the House of Representatives. Their job is to listen to the citizenry) and their Senator. By "more people" I mean **YOU**, the reader. "You" need to register to vote, "You" need to write to your elected officials, "You" need to join pro-second amendment organizations, like the GOA and the NRA. "You" need to go to local government meetings and voice your opinions. Here are the links: www.Congress.org Member of Congress to the House of Representatives: https://writerep.house.gov/writerep/welcome.shtml Your Senator: http://www.senate.gov/pagelayout/senators/f_two_sections_with_teasers/states.htm Your governor: http://www.usa.gov/Contact/Governors.shtml National Rifle Association: www.nra.org Gun Owners of America: www.gunowners.org Many many forum posters seem to be the paranoid wall flower "I don't want my name on a list! I am not even registered to vote!" types... They wring their hands about what is happening, but they want SOMEONE ELSE to do the dirty work and take a chance, speak up, write the letters, cast the votes, and yet reap the rewards. If you are one of these types, (YOU KNOW WHO YOU ARE!!) you need to remember this: If you have ever filled out a Form 4473, trust me, you are in a database. If you are a member of GOA or the NRA, trust me, you are in a database. If you have ever registered to vote, trust me, you are in a database. If you have a driver's license, trust me, you are in a database. If you use your SSN to earn income, trust me, you are in a database. If you ever used your credit card to buy gun parts or ammo, you are in a database. If you were ever in the military... well you get the idea... keyed in on your name and DOB. Cross referenced with your SSN. With the (undeclared and in my opinion unconstitutional) continuing "war" on terror, the Department of Homeland Security and Congress have teamed up and are finishing up the process of making all the local, state, and Federal databases cross-searchable and accessible by ANY agency, NO WARRENT, NO JUDGE, required. If you are too cowardly to stand up and be counted, to make your voice heard, what will you do with your gun when tyranny arrives? I mean, you already know that you are a coward, so what will you do? Take your super secret gun and go shoot someone in a blue helmet or a black Hummer? I think not. We know what you will do. YOU know, deep down, what you will do. You will whisper about the Good Ol Days and hope that "someone else" does something, while you let your super secret gun rust in it's super secret hiding place, and be angry and post angry messages on forums about how somebody "should have done something". (Pardon me a moment whilst I vomit) That "someone" is **YOU**. GET OFF YOUR ASS and start DOING something about it, and posting messages on forums is NOT action! It is talk. Being a member on a website like www.righttokeepandbeararms.com is nice, and well meaning, and a fantastic resource for ideas, BUT it is not TRUE ACTION; it is feel good action. Joining a website WILL NOT cause change. Writing letters and being politically active is what causes change. Best idea: Buy as many firearms as you want. Give them as gifts! Register as many SBR's and suppressors as you can, join EVERY pro gun lobby group you can, and learn how to start grass roots legislation. Urge your friends to get CCW permits and to buy guns, including assault rifles. Take them shooting and let them burn through a box of your ammo. Turn them on to firearms. Get them re-acquainted with personal responsibility. Get them going in the right direction. Turn America BACK INTO a gun culture and freedom culture and personal responsibility culture. THAT is how to beat DHS, Napolitano, Obama, Pelosi, Biden, an increasingly militarized police force (anyone else notice that trend??), other anti-firearms groups, and generally "The Fed". The Feds just follow the rules. If the rules change, so do they. They are like the Borg. They are guys, most... smart, but not brilliant. They are working away at a Federal retirement, doing their job. If the rules change tomorrow and allow everyone to own an unregistered suppressor, believe me, the hour the legislation passes, they will stop activity related to suppressors. Most of those ATF guys (that I know anyway) are not rabidly anti-gun. Most all of them own firearms themselves. They are just following the rules. They do not get cash bonuses for finding illegal guns, such as the IRS agents receive for "recovering" "lost" revenue from recalcitrant tax payers. (Everyone here knows that, right? The IRS guys get a slice of the recovered money as an "on the spot cash award". THAT is why the IRS guys are so rabid. They are motivated by greed) If you are offended by reading this post, then YOU are PROBABLY the guy this post is aimed at! Soapbox Rant Complete. Thanks for reading! We now return to our regularly scheduled constitutional programing�

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