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- - Improvised bulletproof vest...hmmm? (http://goldismoney.info/forums/showthread.php?t=434214)

johndoh | 12-22-2009 03:15 PM
Improvised bulletproof vest...hmmm? I was in a class last week and in between drills, a LEO mentioned this... Gang bangers are cutting steel/kevlar belted tires into sections, and using the tread sections to make bulletproof "vests" that they strap on from waist to neck, before a robbery or home invasion. It kinda cracked me up when I first heard it, but he made it sound like it was actually effective. Any of you guys ever shot a steel or kevlar belted radial tire? If :fan: are we gonna see guys running around in radial tire suits?

TTAZZMAN | 12-22-2009 03:19 PM
Re: Improvised bulletproof vest...hmmm? Quote:
Originally Posted by johndoh (Post 2089369) I was in a class last week and in between drills, a LEO mentioned this... Gang bangers are cutting steel/kevlar belted tires into sections, and using the tread sections to make bulletproof "vests" that they strap on from waist to neck, before a robbery or home invasion. It kinda cracked me up when I first heard it, but he made it sound like it was actually effective. Any of you guys ever shot a steel or kevlar belted radial tire? If :fan: are we gonna see guys running around in radial tire suits?
I have shot the side wall of a uninflated tire before....i do remember 22lr bouncing off.....and a 30-06 going right through I would think the tread side of a truck tire would be the most bullet proof side...sounds very feaseable....maybe we should submit this to the "box o truth" site for testing I know my 7mm rum will go right on through a 1/2" mild steel plate with no issues with a fmj bullet looking like a clean punched hole

Drumblebum | 12-22-2009 03:22 PM
Re: Improvised bulletproof vest...hmmm? http://www.tireproautomotive.com/Ass...ichelinMan.jpg He's waaaay ahead of you...

johndoh | 12-22-2009 03:26 PM
Re: Improvised bulletproof vest...hmmm? Quote:
Originally Posted by Drumblebum (Post 2089380) http://www.tireproautomotive.com/Ass...ichelinMan.jpg He's waaaay ahead of you...
I didn't think about him. That Michelin Man suit would look good with Heimdahl's cherry slippers :rofl:

Ares | 12-22-2009 03:34 PM
Re: Improvised bulletproof vest...hmmm? It would be best to test that with a handgun. Most centerfire rifles will go through a "bulletproof" Kevlar vest like swiss cheese.

Heimdhal | 12-22-2009 04:01 PM
Re: Improvised bulletproof vest...hmmm? Sounds heavy and cumbersom, though that doesnt usualy stop people from improvising. It might work, it might not. However, there are ways to win a fireFIGHT when comfroting an armed and armored intruder. There are many, but heres a few: Remeber you are FIGHTING not shooting. Its not the range, you dont have a nice little paper sillouete to shoot at. This one moves and shoots back, just like you should be doing. FIGHT with your weapon, dont just shoot it. and a 'no-duh' one: If it is obvious said intruder has armor on, and in this situation it may very well be, (but it could also be night time, you're half asleep, etc) AIM FOR OTHER AREAS!!!!! Liver, heart, lungs, they're all protected. What isnt? His arms, head, legs, and most importantly the GROIN! Tons of nerves, blood flow, support bones. Shoot a guy in the leg, you might get lucky and hit his femoral artery. If not, hes got a flesh wound. Will hurt like hell, but hes still in the fight. Shatter the guys pelvis by shooting into groin, hes going down and not getting up. Not to mention other, much more sensitives areas within that region. Dont build into your muscle memory the amazing ability to put bullets in the same hole center of mass. Because when it comes down to it, thats where your body is naturaly going to align itself(because thats what you've trained it to do), on pure instict and if they've got 12 layers of kevlar covering that area, guys still in the fight. Also, and this gets a little iffy IN SOME STATES for self defense shooting is head shots, obviously, as this is another area that is generaly un-protected. They're wearing helmets you say? Good, you shouldnt be putting one in the top of the dome anyways. Right through the tip of the nose is where you want it to go, straight back into the medulla oblongata. Its like flipping a swith, the lights go righ out.

Bx3 | 12-22-2009 07:23 PM
Re: Improvised bulletproof vest...hmmm? :fight:No shyt, there I was......last summer applying DuraCoat in my backyard to an M-14 build I had just finished (before I sold it). My yard backs up to BLM, so there is always some yahoo shooting too close to the homes. Usually I'll go ask them to shoot a little further away........Anyways, these guys were just over a rise on one of the many dirt roads, just out of LOS but only about 50yds away when they start blasting. One of the rounds bounced and whent up over my house and ended up somewhere in the neighborhood. Thats it....time for another friendly chat....so I go out back and as I get to the top of the rise I see a black SUV driving away from me....just as I am about to head back home the vehicle stops about a hundred yards away and two males exit...I keep walking towards them as they are still too close to be shooting...Both were Mexicans with shaved heads and full sleave/neck tatoos....not good...at about 70 yards I see both of them don body armor vests (one the concealable type and the other tactical)....damn...I stop...one of them turns and sees me and then alerts his buddy...fuk it, I'm committed now...I approach only to within 50yds so that my 10mm will still have some advantage over their 9mills (saw the spent casings from their first shooting location)...they are both carefully watching me...hand in pocket (on pistol) I ask them to "please go shoot somewhere else" as "one of your bullets has already gone into the neighborhood"....this last piece of info is what I think persuaded them to agree...they say "no problem" and move on...whew! I collect some of the spent casings and give them to a LE buddy of mine who informs me that they are looking for a home invasion crew of Mexi males with shaved head, tatoos, wearing BA and driving a dark SUV....Son of a Biatch! My plan was to shoot for the legs. My wife thinks I am crazy! Sometimes that can be a good thing. Bx3

johndoh | 12-22-2009 08:13 PM
Re: Improvised bulletproof vest...hmmm? You're right Heimdahl, but unless you're really good at point shooting, headshots take a little more time. You might be better off with a quick one to the torso, followed by the aimed headshot. Even if they're wearing real armor, you'll at least stun them on the first shot to the body. If you're faced with 2 or 3 armed badguys, you don't want the other one shooting you while you're getting off that first or second headshot. So, you might go for the torso on each, followed by the head on each. See any flaws in that thinking? Bx3, did you get the SUV plate number?

Tallships | 12-22-2009 08:29 PM
Re: Improvised bulletproof vest...hmmm? I remember Simon Pheonix wearing this kind of armour in Demolition man. You Tube
You Tube

Ragnarok | 12-22-2009 08:32 PM
Re: Improvised bulletproof vest...hmmm? If I understand the way bulletproof vests work, they rely on several loose, stitched-together layers of Kevlar instead of a molded-in layer(s) like in a tire. The reason being that the loose fabric can give and stretch, transferring the impact energy along the fibers and across a large area of the protected surface, whereas the molded-in fibers cannot do this and are more easily penetrated. Buying Kevlar cloth and making your own high quality version might be a better option than tire sections? my 2c, R.

mightymanx | 12-22-2009 08:33 PM
Re: Improvised bulletproof vest...hmmm? Bottom line, if you see this on your streets. http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_GhJGoTBwAP...nia%2BLove.JPG Grab the rifle!!

Bx3 | 12-22-2009 11:11 PM
Re: Improvised bulletproof vest...hmmm? Quote:
Originally Posted by johndoh (Post 2089860) You're right Heimdahl, but unless you're really good at point shooting, headshots take a little more time. You might be better off with a quick one to the torso, followed by the aimed headshot. Even if they're wearing real armor, you'll at least stun them on the first shot to the body. If you're faced with 2 or 3 armed badguys, you don't want the other one shooting you while you're getting off that first or second headshot. So, you might go for the torso on each, followed by the head on each. See any flaws in that thinking? Bx3, did you get the SUV plate number?
While most people who have been shot while wearing BA get hammered with blunt force trauma, adrenaline can temporarily compensate for immediate/partial incapacitation due to the pain. Most concealed vests and even tactical vests are however cut at or just below the navel which allows the wearer to sit down. A good target area therefor would be just below the belly button through the pelvic region. Most hits in this area are very capable of taking the fight out of an adversary, at least more so than a center mass hit on a vest that possibly even has a trauma plate installed. Unfortunately, I did not get close enough to the vehicle for already mentioned reasons to get the plates. At that point I was really wishing that the DuraCoat was well and cured.:banghead: Bx3

hoarder | 12-22-2009 11:34 PM
Re: Improvised bulletproof vest...hmmm? Cutting tires, especially steel belted ones is very difficult without specialized equipment.

MetalMoney | 12-22-2009 11:34 PM
Re: Improvised bulletproof vest...hmmm? Bx3, Why would you carry a 10mm to go chat when you have an M14 in front of you? Shoulder that thing nice and casual, but available. Would be much more of a deterrant dont you thing? Even with BA, thats a game changer.

rad | 12-22-2009 11:36 PM
Re: Improvised bulletproof vest...hmmm? The real stuff isn't that expensive. http://www.bulletproofme.com/Body_Ar...cts_LIST.shtml

____hoot____ | 12-23-2009 12:01 AM
Re: Improvised bulletproof vest...hmmm? Go rent a olde[but damned good]Mick Jagger movie from 1970 "Ned Kelly". Nothin new in this world

Bx3 | 12-23-2009 12:54 AM
Re: Improvised bulletproof vest...hmmm? Quote:
Originally Posted by MetalMoney (Post 2090240) Bx3, Why would you carry a 10mm to go chat when you have an M14 in front of you? Shoulder that thing nice and casual, but available. Would be much more of a deterrant dont you thing? Even with BA, thats a game changer.
The M-14 was wet as I was spraying it with DuraCoat which is a permanent enamel coating. The 10mm is my constant companion. Also, this was not the first time I have had to talk to people who were shooting too close. I certainly wasn't expecting potential gang bangers wearing BA or I would have grabbed another long gun or better yet dialed 911. Bx3

Heimdhal | 12-23-2009 01:04 AM
Re: Improvised bulletproof vest...hmmm? BX, THats a crazy story my friend. I guess its a good thing you're just a touch of crazy yourself ;). THough, I'd feel fairly confidant with a 10mm as well! Seeing them don on some level II or IIIA soft body armor would have definitly been a high alert situation for any one. Thats where ALLLL the posibilities start rolling through your mind, particular when you have no armor yourself! We have seen reports, and I feel we see far more, of an increase in multiple perp home invasions with armor being used. Its not hard to get ahold of armor at all, even military armor with ceramic plates isnt all that expensive, all things considered. John Doh brings up a good point. Those soft vest will stop bullets (generaly) but they hurt like a mother! Dont NOT take a shot if you have one available to the chest region. Itll still hurt and could quite possibly knock em down on their butt from the sheer suprise of the hit (and the pain!). But just remeber, you want them out of the fight, not just hindered. Keep in mind a great majority of hand gun victims LIVE, which is why you MUST be able to take them out of the fight QUICK, for your sake. A shot in the leg might hit the femoral artery, and theyll bleed out pretty darned quick, but they could still get, statisticaly speaking, an entire mags worth of ammo at you before they pass out. Also, something to keep in mind, kevlar begins to loose its effectiveness almost exponetialy with every shot. A couple of shots in close proximity will eventualy break enough of the fibers to allow a bullet to pass through. This isnt something to strive for or anything, just an FYI.

Bx3 | 12-23-2009 02:00 AM
Re: Improvised bulletproof vest...hmmm? Quote:
Originally Posted by Heimdhal (Post 2090377) BX, THats a crazy story my friend. I guess its a good thing you're just a touch of crazy yourself ;). THough, I'd feel fairly confidant with a 10mm as well! Seeing them don on some level II or IIIA soft body armor would have definitly been a high alert situation for any one. Thats where ALLLL the posibilities start rolling through your mind, particular when you have no armor yourself! We have seen reports, and I feel we see far more, of an increase in multiple perp home invasions with armor being used. Its not hard to get ahold of armor at all, even military armor with ceramic plates isnt all that expensive, all things considered.
Quote:
Post #19 http://goldismoney.info/forums/showthread.php?t=337594
No doubt. I have had an inexplicable number of violent encounters in my life time and not a single one was sought after. Thats why I always laugh when someone tells me that they only carry a gun when they are going to a bad part of town as if that is the only place that criminals and psychopaths like to hang out. I usually reply that my gun goes everywhere with me 24/7 and that if I am going into a bad part of town I take my body armor. They usually just look at me as if I just farted.:rofl::sheep: Bx3

Heimdhal | 12-23-2009 02:32 AM
Re: Improvised bulletproof vest...hmmm? Bx, I applaud you my friend. I am fortunate enough to not have ever had the need to draw my gun, but there are times I have been very comoforted by the fact I had it and more than once has my hand hovered over the grip, under my shirt or center console of the car, ready for a moment thankfully never came. I carry every where as well. Ill admit I slack sometime, like running to the store thats a 1/4 mile up the road at 6 pm in the summer when I just dont feel like putting a belt on, getting my IWB holster, and a big shirt to cover it for a 5 minute trip, but that is still no excuse and the reason I am getting a new pocket gun this holiday season. My wife works in a shady part of town, running one of the offices of our family business, which happens to be a temp staffing company (labor hall). She works about 2 blocks off one of the richest and busiest areas in that particular town, a major, well known avenue down here in south florida. However, the 'ghetto' starts about 1 block off of said avenue, the rich did a good job and creating an illusion, for sure. Well, I've always worried about her, especialy in the winter where its pitch black by 5:30 there. Shes always brushed it off like no biggie. Turns out last saturday night the little quikie stop in her building was robbed at gun point. And yesterday afternoon a big fight errupted between one of her guys and a passerby right outside the office. Shes coming around to say the least. But she has an aversion, though shes worked on it immensly, to firearms beause of some things that happened when she was a kid. She goes shooting with me, but still isnt 100% comfortable with carrying. Shes coming around though.

State of Jefferson | 12-23-2009 03:14 AM
Re: Improvised bulletproof vest...hmmm? The North Hollywood bank robbers of 1997 purchased Aramid fiber and plating, and constructed their own body armor with home sewing machines and by hand, which worked very well. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/North_Hollywood_shootout

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