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Big Country | 06-10-2009 08:00 PM
Gun Store + Coin shop? So I've had my wheels turning lately and I find myself wanting to get out of the "employee" market and get into the "employer" side...Like many capitalistic Americans... But here is what I have been thinking, and even though sharing a business plan isn't always the best Idea, I wanted some advice before I started down this road. I've been thinking of opening a gun store PLUS a bullion store. I know the market for bullion isn't awesome, but I think there is enough for a bullion only store when coupled with a gun store. I would basically have a wet dream every time I walked into "work" if you can call it that...Tons of bullion, tons of guns, can you think of anything better? Do you guys think there is an overlap in this market? Or do you think that there would be two totally different sets of clientele and I'd do better have separate shops (if I pursue this pipe dream)? Do you think this type of "one stop shop" would compliment each other well? I know this is the wrong forum to ask because most people here are into both, but do you think the "general public" would find this combination to be complimentary? Just trying to get ideas here. I'm not into numismatics at all so I'm not really interested in that side of the "coin shop" business. I am very computer savvy and know I could get a web side as well as a brick and mortar side running. My wife would be TOTALLY on board to helping out in the shop because she loves both as much as I do! What do you all think? Possible? Profitable? Pipe dream?

Between The Wheels | 06-10-2009 08:09 PM
Re: Gun Store + Coin shop? IDK where you are located but the biggest brick and mortar gun/coin retailer in the capital of Texas is McBride's. http://www.mcbridesguns.com/index.htm Definitely possible, profitability would depend on overhead, competition, etc.

the toxic avenger | 06-10-2009 08:23 PM
Re: Gun Store + Coin shop? Add long term storage foods to the store like Honeyville, Mountain House, and MRE's and you could nearly be a one stop SHTF store.

Tallships | 06-10-2009 08:28 PM
Re: Gun Store + Coin shop? You should get a liquor license too.

Jaxon | 06-10-2009 08:32 PM
Re: Gun Store + Coin shop? I don't think the two necessarily go together. Not too long ago Jason Hommel set up a bullion table at a gun show, with disappointing results. You might try something similar in your area to see if there's any cross interest. It would be a low-risk way to get your feet wet. I don't run, or even work in a retail store so my thoughts may be way off base. However, if I were to consider opening one my first question would be, "How am I going to get feet in the door?" If you run a brick and mortar establishment, your success will depend on luring as many people as you can into your store so they can buy something. Where are the other gun and bullion stores in the area? Do they adequately meet the needs of the customers in the area? Is it possible to compete with them in either price, selection, or service? How will you advertise so that people know you're open for business? Answering these questions requires research and facts. If it turns out that there's enough demand in the area for guns and bullion to employ you as a middleman, you could consider expanding into a preparedness / self-sufficiency store, adding tools and machinery for food production and preservation.

Big Country | 06-10-2009 08:51 PM
Re: Gun Store + Coin shop? Interesting suggestions. I had no doubt that I wasn't the first to think of a gun/coin shop combo, I was just curious if you guys thought they could work. I would say there definitely isn't a bullion store close that is meeting the needs. The closest store to me is about a 30 minute drive and is nearly all numismatic with a little tiny "bullion bowl" on the counter that never has more then 10-20oz of silver in it and he has a few gold bullion coins. High premiums on the bullion (silver spot + 3.50 and gold spot + 110). As for the Jason Hommel example I read that (I get his newsletter) but I also thought to myself that people go to gun shows looking for guns. I would think in a permanent brick and mortar location that people come to your store to get a gun, see you have bullion, then when they're ready to get bullion they remember where you are. I know I buy in cycles, the months I buy guns I don't have the extra for bullion that month. I know there isn't a 100% overlap in customers, but I think there is some overlap that might not necessarily be in the right frame (or financial) mind at a gun show. I believe that I could foster support with a B&M store as well as an online shop (I'm no computer slouch...my current line of work) to expand the customer base. I believe in "old fashioned" business models about treating the customers right and being friendly (unlike a lot of coin shops I find myself in...mr. 90-yr old man doesn't recognize you so doesn't even want to give you the time of day or help). As for a SHTF store I could see some promise in that. Definitely a niche that one single store isn't filling in the area (as far as I know). Not exactly what I had in mind, but I'll keep thinking about it. Keep up the great comments. Definitely has me thinking about this...

Mill Man | 06-10-2009 09:15 PM
Re: Gun Store + Coin shop? Big Country, I'd shop at your store if I was in your area. If you think you could run a successful gun shop in your area then adding other things to the store won't stop people from coming in just for guns. If I had a shop one thing I would try to do is build a community to keep people coming in and hanging around. Organize hunting/fishing/camping trips, have a reloading class every month or whenever enough people sign up. Anyone else please feel free to brainstorm off those ideas. I'd just love to have a place to go hang out and BS with others with similar interests and I know I'd end up spending some dough as well. The biggest place I see local shops around me lacking is in sales after the gun. Ammo prices suck and the selection is limited. Mag prices are high or they just don't sell them. Give that guy that just bought a new gun the ability to pick up 10 mags, 1k rounds and books/videos on cleaning and disassembly/reassembly. Ok, that was a bit of rambling, but if you go through with it best of luck to ya.

leadfoot | 06-10-2009 09:29 PM
Re: Gun Store + Coin shop? What would you call it? The Silver Bullet? Golden Gun or Gold-n-Guns? The Financial & Physical Protection Shop? Bullets & Bullion? Change This! (with logo of a rude gesture)?

Big Country | 06-10-2009 10:48 PM
Re: Gun Store + Coin shop? I wholeheartedly agree with the post about providing more then just the initial gun. My favorite gun shop that I currently go to has magazines out the wazoo! They're all loose and neatly organized into bins so you can pick through the for the good ones, and they generally have plenty for most (decently) common guns. But they also keep them behind the counter to keep people from messing the bins up. Basically you ask for mags for the gun you're looking for and they put the bin up on the counter... I would definitely mimic this in my shop. There are a lot of local gun shops where I live now, but I have short-term plans to leave (West side of Phoenix metro). I.E. as soon as I find a job where there is NATURAL water and in my current line of work I'm out of there. So this will be a plan to find a market where I decide to plop down for good. I would definitely model it as a place to come hang out and BS, not a high client turnover type place. I would definitely offer classes to get customers and if you do it right could generate a lot of business. Say free CCW classes? While it won't guarantee business, it could generate interest in handguns and since they took the class from me they may also be inclined to shop for a hand gun there or even a severely reduced price on the class, say $20 to still make some money for my (or the teachers) time? Just thinking out loud here... As for names, as much as I love the "Change This!" idea I don't think it is a name that would survive more then a few years. People wouldn't get the reference in 10-15 years? Also I want nothing to do with that illegal usurper in the name of my business. My wife suggested this one: "Guns and Gold and silver and General SHTF Store" though it would be hard to abbreviate and make much sense. Maybe something like "The Metal and some polymer Exchange"

gunDriller | 06-11-2009 11:36 AM
Re: Gun Store + Coin shop? Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Country (Post 1763772) I've been thinking of opening a gun store PLUS a bullion store. I know the market for bullion isn't awesome, but I think there is enough for a bullion only store when coupled with a gun store. I would basically have a wet dream every time I walked into "work" if you can call it that...Tons of bullion, tons of guns, can you think of anything better?
a fully-equipped machine shop in the back with fully CNC trained Hooter's waitresses fab'ing your own custom gun designs. profitably, of course. :signs1:

Iptuous | 06-11-2009 11:54 AM
Re: Gun Store + Coin shop? Quote:
Originally Posted by Between The Wheels (Post 1763792) IDK where you are located but the biggest brick and mortar gun/coin retailer in the capital of Texas is McBride's. http://www.mcbridesguns.com/index.htm Definitely possible, profitability would depend on overhead, competition, etc.
They don't have any indication of the coins on their website.....

merc49 | 06-11-2009 12:02 PM
Re: Gun Store + Coin shop? If you are going to open a gun store then adding the coin and bullion side to it is a great idea, wheather the bullion side makes a lot of money or not doesn't matter since it is piggy backing on the gun stores over head, but if you were planning on opening a bullion store anyways and are toying with the idea of adding firearms dealer to it you are adding a lot of fees etc to become a firearms dealer.

The Argent Dragon | 06-11-2009 12:03 PM
Re: Gun Store + Coin shop? Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallships (Post 1763810) You should get a liquor license too.
:111:.......Good ONE !

horseshoe3 | 06-11-2009 12:14 PM
Re: Gun Store + Coin shop? Quote:
I would definitely model it as a place to come hang out and BS, not a high client turnover type place.
That's good, but you don't want it to be a clique. New customers would be intimidated when the owner spends too much time visiting with the "in crowd". You want everyone to feel welcome and not feel like they are intruding on a private gathering of good old boys.

Fabonz | 06-11-2009 12:27 PM
Re: Gun Store + Coin shop? Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Country (Post 1763772) So I've had my wheels turning lately and I find myself wanting to get out of the "employee" market and get into the "employer" side...Like many capitalistic Americans... But here is what I have been thinking, and even though sharing a business plan isn't always the best Idea, I wanted some advice before I started down this road. I've been thinking of opening a gun store PLUS a bullion store. I know the market for bullion isn't awesome, but I think there is enough for a bullion only store when coupled with a gun store. I would basically have a wet dream every time I walked into "work" if you can call it that...Tons of bullion, tons of guns, can you think of anything better? Do you guys think there is an overlap in this market? Or do you think that there would be two totally different sets of clientele and I'd do better have separate shops (if I pursue this pipe dream)? Do you think this type of "one stop shop" would compliment each other well? I know this is the wrong forum to ask because most people here are into both, but do you think the "general public" would find this combination to be complimentary? Just trying to get ideas here. I'm not into numismatics at all so I'm not really interested in that side of the "coin shop" business. I am very computer savvy and know I could get a web side as well as a brick and mortar side running. My wife would be TOTALLY on board to helping out in the shop because she loves both as much as I do! What do you all think? Possible? Profitable? Pipe dream?
The two areas of my life where I mose value privacy and secrecy are my firearms, and my PM's. Unfortunately, Running a business doesn't really lend itself to that level of privacy. Lots and lots of records with the ATF, lots or transaction reporting, etc. All that in addition to the normal bookkeeping and tax records. Just something to thing about... If you do it you HAVE to comply with all that stuff. They don't mess around.

momopanda | 06-11-2009 12:36 PM
Re: Gun Store + Coin shop? I think it sounds like a good idea. And it sounds like your lady is a keeper too! Good luck to you guys if you do it. Keep us posted.

Fabonz | 06-11-2009 12:38 PM
Re: Gun Store + Coin shop? Quote:
Originally Posted by horseshoe3 (Post 1764689) That's good, but you don't want it to be a clique. New customers would be intimidated when the owner spends too much time visiting with the "in crowd". You want everyone to feel welcome and not feel like they are intruding on a private gathering of good old boys.
When I was "new" to these things I would HATE this sort of thing. You walk in the door and you see four guys shooting the breeze. They all stop talking and look at you... You don't know who works there and who the customers are. You feel like a jerk so you start looking around until one guy says "Can I help you find something...?" So you say "no thanks...just looking" and browse a minute more then leave. It can be VERY intimidating, especially for young people, women, people unfamiliar with Guns or PM's. From a "business" standpoint you would be better off with a somewhat knowledgeable "clerk" at the counter that isn't already involved in a conversations with others. Have a back room to "hang out" if you want. I used to run businesses where a lot of contractors would stop by in the morning to pick up stuff on the way to their job site. They would have a few cups of coffee and hang out for hours if you let them. It chases away the retail trad. You will need to sell small amounts (of PM's or GUN's) to lots of different customers. You can't keep selling guns to the same 15 or 20 guys that think they are your partners because they spend so much time at your shop. They are also the ones that send their friends in looking for a better price because they "know you"

AOW | 06-11-2009 01:16 PM
Re: Gun Store + Coin shop? This seems like a 2008 venture. Hasn't everyone already bought their guns, ammo, and pm's by now (mostly joking)? Gun and ammo prices and scarcity appear to have come down some. I also think anyone that still hasn't prepped would go to established places they've already been eyeing for the last several months trying to decide if prepping was necessary. The pros have been doing this stuff for years and you'd be the new guy on the block trying to get product and customers they already have access to. Just my .02

Between The Wheels | 06-11-2009 04:10 PM
Re: Gun Store + Coin shop? Quote:
Originally Posted by Iptuous (Post 1764644) They don't have any indication of the coins on their website.....
Aye. You'll have to take my word on this.

Iptuous | 06-11-2009 04:43 PM
Re: Gun Store + Coin shop? Quote:
Originally Posted by Between The Wheels (Post 1765099) Aye. You'll have to take my word on this.
Is it all bullion coin? is it displayed prominently? is it a significant seller?

Ag_man | 06-11-2009 05:24 PM
Re: Gun Store + Coin shop? Quote:
Originally Posted by horseshoe3 (Post 1764689) That's good, but you don't want it to be a clique. New customers would be intimidated when the owner spends too much time visiting with the "in crowd". You want everyone to feel welcome and not feel like they are intruding on a private gathering of good old boys.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Fabonz (Post 1764728) When I was "new" to these things I would HATE this sort of thing. You walk in the door and you see four guys shooting the breeze. They all stop talking and look at you... You don't know who works there and who the customers are. You feel like a jerk so you start looking around until one guy says "Can I help you find something...?" So you say "no thanks...just looking" and browse a minute more then leave. It can be VERY intimidating, especially for young people, women, people unfamiliar with Guns or PM's. From a "business" standpoint you would be better off with a somewhat knowledgeable "clerk" at the counter that isn't already involved in a conversations with others. Have a back room to "hang out" if you want. I used to run businesses where a lot of contractors would stop by in the morning to pick up stuff on the way to their job site. They would have a few cups of coffee and hang out for hours if you let them. It chases away the retail trad. You will need to sell small amounts (of PM's or GUN's) to lots of different customers. You can't keep selling guns to the same 15 or 20 guys that think they are your partners because they spend so much time at your shop. They are also the ones that send their friends in looking for a better price because they "know you"
This sounds like one of the places I shop at. The same old guys hanging out there all the time. It can be a real pain in the ass, if the 2 clerks are busy in conversation with "the coffeepot crowd". I never let it bother me too much, but I'm sure it costs the owner sales, but he doesn't do anything about it.

Fabonz | 06-11-2009 05:56 PM
Re: Gun Store + Coin shop? Quote:
Originally Posted by Ag_man (Post 1765252) ". I never let it bother me too much, but I'm sure it costs the owner sales, but he doesn't do anything about it.
Now that I'm "initiated" I may even be one of the ones sitting and BSing. It just isn't great for the "new customers. I think it happens this way because a lot of gun/coin shop owners are doing it as a 2nd carrer/hobby and maximum sales are not their concern. They just love swapping stories and making an occasional sale.

Big Country | 06-11-2009 06:03 PM
Re: Gun Store + Coin shop? I really like the idea of the back room to shoot the shit. I definitely know what you mean about the intimidation, I was intimidated in the first few gun shops I went into. I don't ever think its too late to get into a business that will be needed for quite some time. Of course something like floppy disk manufacturing would not be wise). There always has to be a "new kid on the block". I still have plenty to work out, but I just wanted to get a feel for your ideas and what you guys thought of a place like that. This has really helped me reign in my thoughts on the subject so far

obilly | 06-11-2009 06:06 PM
Re: Gun Store + Coin shop? they have one of those stores down road from me,,,its own by this Chinese guy ... mr pawns ,,sign out front says, he buys guns and gold.

Between The Wheels | 06-11-2009 10:42 PM
Re: Gun Store + Coin shop? Quote:
Originally Posted by Iptuous (Post 1765158) Is it all bullion coin? is it displayed prominently? is it a significant seller?
There are other dealers in town. Bullion Direct is probably the biggest but you are not welcome to visit them or to pick up orders. There are a handful of others who want to decide on the phone/e-mail if you're worth their time talking to you. McBride's is the biggest dealer that you can walk into, pull out a wad of cash, buy your stuff, and walk out of in 5 minutes. They sell numismatic as well as bullion. At any time there are probably a dozen people ready to drop you should you try anything stupid (LEO and non). The coin shop is around 500 sq. ft. the gun store is much bigger.

St. Germain | 06-11-2009 10:44 PM
Re: Gun Store + Coin shop? Add a wood stove, some comfortable chairs and a beer cooler for a foot stool and i'll take a ride out this Fall. Sound like paradise.

horseshoe3 | 06-12-2009 09:27 AM
Re: Gun Store + Coin shop? Quote:
Originally Posted by Fabonz (Post 1764728) You walk in the door and you see four guys shooting the breeze. They all stop talking and look at you... You don't know who works there and who the customers are. You feel like a jerk so you start looking around until one guy says "Can I help you find something...?" So you say "no thanks...just looking" and browse a minute more then leave.
Exactly. And why do they always just turn and stare. Why doesn't the owner say "Hi, can I help you?" or "Get the hell out of my store." or something? Anything other than that blank stare like he can't figure out why you're there. This used to bother me when I was in high school and just starting to interact with adults. I thought I was making some kind of social faux pax. Now I realize that it's just a bunch of guys who have nothing better to do than waste time at the gun store, and try to act like they're cooler than the next guy to walk through the door.

Ag_man | 06-12-2009 12:50 PM
Re: Gun Store + Coin shop? Quote:
Originally Posted by horseshoe3 (Post 1766450) Exactly. And why do they always just turn and stare. Why doesn't the owner say "Hi, can I help you?" or "Get the hell out of my store." or something? Anything other than that blank stare like he can't figure out why you're there. This used to bother me when I was in high school and just starting to interact with adults. I thought I was making some kind of social faux pax. Now I realize that it's just a bunch of guys who have nothing better to do than waste time at the gun store, and try to act like they're cooler than the next guy to walk through the door.
That used to bother me as well, but I've just developed a "f' em" attitude!

AZLiberty | 06-13-2009 01:55 AM
Re: Gun Store + Coin shop? Maybe I'm oversensitive, but "Hi can I help you" always comes off as really pushy. I hate that.

St. Germain | 06-13-2009 01:57 AM
Re: Gun Store + Coin shop? They change their attitudes once you spend a few bucks. They usually warm right up and are pretty good guys.

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WAoG | 06-13-2009 02:01 AM
Re: Gun Store + Coin shop? Quote:
Originally Posted by The Argent Dragon (Post 1764660) :111:.......Good ONE !
That was a very good one!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Shit sell some pot also:-)

WAoG | 06-13-2009 02:37 AM
Re: Gun Store + Coin shop? Quote:
Originally Posted by Fabonz (Post 1764708) The two areas of my life where I mose value privacy and secrecy are my firearms, and my PM's. Unfortunately, Running a business doesn't really lend itself to that level of privacy. Lots and lots of records with the ATF, lots or transaction reporting, etc. All that in addition to the normal bookkeeping and tax records. Just something to thing about... If you do it you HAVE to comply with all that stuff. They don't mess around.
The a-t-f shut down my buddy. He sold one gun, to the wrong guy and the guy killed a few people. So I walked into the guys shop that bought his stuff. He is the one that told me they screwed by buddy. He tells me he is a psyck doctor. I was kind of shocked but he is very old so I guessed this is a hobby:-) I'm a little slow at times:-) He says I have to be according to the a-t-f. If I make one mistake judging people they shut me down. So he shuts down a punk on hand gun sale. Punks stuff (ID) did not seem right. Punk and four friends (break in) rob him and steal a few guns a few months ago (March I do believe). Last time I talked to him a few days ago he still could not sell his guns as they took his license but he thinks he will be back in business soon. I do not think this man is hurting for bucks but they caught the guys a while ago and he was still shut down months later? He sells CARS and Trucks also and fixes guns too. The guy I have seen doing the best selling guns does just about everything on the internet. Almost no one goes to his shop.

Juandisimo | 06-13-2009 04:01 AM
Re: Gun Store + Coin shop? Buddy of mine owns a gun and coin store in Hiram Ga. called Gold n Guns.

voodoo1951 | 06-13-2009 06:47 AM
Re: Gun Store + Coin shop? Well, first off, I like your idea about becoming an employer (business owner) as opposed to an employee. Done em' both...Just a few words of caution. Gun sales are going thru the roof these days and even if sales were slow, guns and PM's are always gonna be worth money. On the other hand, If you don't have a few hundred thousand dollars to play around with and have to mortgage your life away to capitalize such a venture, don't do it. My local Mom n Pop gun store reminds me of the type of business model you are talking about. Not too friendly at first because you will get alot of "tire kickers". People who ask a million questions,want to fondle half the firearms in your shop and wind up not dropping a Dime. That gets old pretty fast. Thats why so many GS owners are effin grouches. You sound like you might have the customer service skills to build up a good business. Also, The BATF want detailed records of all transactions . You must keep multiple books on the firearme you sell and if you forget to cross a t or dot an i they can put you thru living hell. Even if you decide noy to open a Brick and Mortar storefront, jusy the fact that you are computer savvy guy can open up lots of new doors. Example: a few months ago, I bought a "Ms. Pacman" cocktail table model from an eBay seller. He has been selling between 4/6 units per month without hardly breaking a sweat. Even with all the doom and gloom going around the country, this dude keeps on pumping out those table top models on a consistent basis. I'm not saying you should sell arcade machines. I just wanted to use that as an example. There is plenty of money out there and if you have the right product for the right price and super people skills, you have a very good chance of sucess. You know the old saying " No guts, no glory"...Whatever you do, best of luck to you and yours. VD51

elroy | 06-13-2009 12:53 PM
Re: Gun Store + Coin shop? I wonder if you wouldn't find that the majority of the gun customers have little $$ for PMs. They are constantly saving for the next great weapon and accessories, leaving little $$ for other things. I would also investigate the sales tax treatment of PMs in your state. In Indiana all bullion sales are subject to sales tax which means a B&M store cannot compete with an online dealer. Both due to taxes and overhead.

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