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SilverSalmon | 05-24-2008 11:59 AM
.45 ACP AMMO Trying get the best SD ammo for my Springfield XD .45 Thinking about going with Speer Gold Dot 230 gr JHP or Speer Gold Dot 200 gr JHP. But I want to make sure it expands in the target. I've heard bad stuff about Federal Hydra Shock, so staying away. Any opinions about which ammo ( Gold Dot 200 gr JHP vs. 230 gr JHP) will expand best out of 4 inch barrel of Springfield XD .45 ACP. NOT WHAT YOU READ, BUT WHAT YOU KNOW FROM EXPERIENCE. I've read all the stuff too. Just looking for real world advice from hunters and etc.

shooter | 05-24-2008 01:13 PM
Re: .45 ACP AMMO I have tested both gold dot 230 hp and hydra -shok 230 hp. I use 1 gal.plastic water jugs for my test. I have found both rounds to expand reliably,with speer penetrating more jugs, and retaining more of the mass-{doesn't frag into multiple pieces}. I used a Glock mod. 30 for my test,also a springfield 3" 1911 style.I presently am using hydra shok in pistol due to location. I have carried pistol with gold dots also. I would expect more carry thru using the gold dots -needs to be considered-. Hope this helps. I haven't heard about probs with hydra shok. What were they?

graspAU | 05-24-2008 01:59 PM
Re: .45 ACP AMMO The new Federal HST's +Ps have a great reputation. I bought a case of them. Have not done any experiments. http://www.streichers.com/ProductDet...&Prod=FC-45HST

Fullpower | 05-24-2008 02:10 PM
Re: .45 ACP AMMO you want expansion? your forty-five starts out at nearly half an inch..... seriously, FUNCTION in YOUR particular pistol is very much more important than what the bullet looks like after removal from the target. obtain a good supply of all cartridges you are considering, and practice a lot.

SilverSalmon | 05-24-2008 02:58 PM
Re: .45 ACP AMMO Quote:
Originally Posted by shooter (Post 1116919) I have tested both gold dot 230 hp and hydra -shok 230 hp. I use 1 gal.plastic water jugs for my test. I have found both rounds to expand reliably,with speer penetrating more jugs, and retaining more of the mass-{doesn't frag into multiple pieces}. I used a Glock mod. 30 for my test,also a springfield 3" 1911 style.I presently am using hydra shok in pistol due to location. I have carried pistol with gold dots also. I would expect more carry thru using the gold dots -needs to be considered-. Hope this helps. I haven't heard about probs with hydra shok. What were they?
They didn't reliably expand upon impact in a real human body. Lots of stories on the net. it happened at Reed's gun shop in Santa Clara, CA in 1999. Google.

SilverSalmon | 05-24-2008 04:27 PM
Re: .45 ACP AMMO Quote:
Originally Posted by Mumwaldee (Post 1117029) Google. .
If I wanted to google, I wouldn't have asked people here. OBVIOUSLY, I'M NOT INTERESTED IN GOOGLING! I WANT FIRST HAND ADVICE FROM PEOPLE I TRUST. AND GENERALLY I TRUST THE PEOPLE HERE! SHOULD I GOOLGE ADVICE ON THE INVESTMENTS AS WELL?:sarcasm:

silverJeep | 05-24-2008 04:36 PM
Re: .45 ACP AMMO Test yourself. Use soaking wet phonebooks. I've heard that's the next best thing to ballistic gel. Next to shooting into pigs. But as stated above, how it functions in your weapon is more important than in your target.

Caligula | 05-24-2008 04:46 PM
Re: .45 ACP AMMO Quote:
Originally Posted by Fullpower (Post 1116980) you want expansion? your forty-five starts out at nearly half an inch..... seriously, FUNCTION in YOUR particular pistol is very much more important than what the bullet looks like after removal from the target. obtain a good supply of all cartridges you are considering, and practice a lot.
This post pretty much sums things up....when you're talking about differences of like millimeters in expansion who really cares? Shot placement and being able to hit targets under extreme stress with your adrenaline pumping and your heart beating so hard you can hear it is waty more important than fractions of inches.....:confused_ma:...expansion-schmamchon....:tongue_ma::wink:

Fullpower | 05-24-2008 05:55 PM
Re: .45 ACP AMMO I hunt with .45 Glock, tritium front sight.. At night. Head shot a feral cat at 2 AM last winter. Held a mini flashlight in support hand, kneeling position, from about 50 feet, and pitch dark, no moon. hit between the eyes, one shot, one kill. animal traveled maybe 20 feet. bullet not recovered.

tojaktoty | 05-24-2008 06:32 PM
Re: .45 ACP AMMO Quote:
Originally Posted by shooter (Post 1116919) I have tested both gold dot 230 hp and hydra -shok 230 hp. I use 1 gal.plastic water jugs for my test. I have found both rounds to expand reliably,with speer penetrating more jugs, and retaining more of the mass-{doesn't frag into multiple pieces}. I used a Glock mod. 30 for my test,also a springfield 3" 1911 style.I presently am using hydra shok in pistol due to location. I have carried pistol with gold dots also. I would expect more carry thru using the gold dots -needs to be considered-. Hope this helps. I haven't heard about probs with hydra shok. What were they?
The new Federal HST are the new update for the hydrashok. The HST expand a LOT better than the hydrashok, according to empirical testing. Usually the HST can even be had for a better price. Don't buy the hydrashok anymore. The only reason they are still being sold by Federal is because of the name recognition they have causing people to continue to buy them.

eat_beef | 05-25-2008 10:00 AM
Re: .45 ACP AMMO All things being equal, the lighter the bullet = higher velocity = better expansion. That said, I've shot LOTS of stuff with LOTS of different calibers/rounds. Terminal ballistics are whacky. There is no golden bullet.:wink: I've had frangible 308 rounds zip right through hogs at close range with no expansion, and fmjs explode and not exit. As was stated, make sure whatever ammo you chose functions 100% in YOUR PARTICULAR firearm. For me, that requires at least 200 rounds downrange with ZERO problems.

mtnman | 05-25-2008 02:38 PM
Re: .45 ACP AMMO Shot placement is everything, learn to shoot, learn to shoot without aiming. The US government has been using the 1911 since 1911 to knock down and kill the enemy using Ball ammo. Ball is what the gun was designed for, use it. All the fancy ammo in the world won�t help if you can�t hit your target. There is no two legged prey on the American continent that the 1911 won�t stop with one well placed round using Ball type ammo.

SilverSalmon | 05-25-2008 05:20 PM
Re: .45 ACP AMMO Quote:
Originally Posted by mtnman (Post 1117906) Shot placement is everything, learn to shoot, learn to shoot without aiming. The US government has been using the 1911 since 1911 to knock down and kill the enemy using Ball ammo. Ball is what the gun was designed for, use it. All the fancy ammo in the world won�t help if you can�t hit your target. There is no two legged prey on the American continent that the 1911 won�t stop with one well placed round using Ball type ammo.
You're probably da*n right!!!!!!! Thanks!

Prometheus | 05-25-2008 09:02 PM
Re: .45 ACP AMMO Quote:
Originally Posted by Fullpower (Post 1116980) you want expansion? your forty-five starts out at nearly half an inch.....
+1 I see so many people obsessing over 1mm... Guess what kiddies? The 45 auto is only 1mm bigger than the 40s&w which is exactly the same diameter as the 10mm which is only 1 mm bigger than the 9mm. Yep the top three self defense rounds 45, 40 and 9 are separated by all of 2 mm from biggest to smallest. Thats one of the reasons I fall over laughing everytime I hear so yahoo picking on 9mm and especially on 45. Simpletons. As others have said shot placement (thats your issue) and function (your guns issue) are paramount to all the fancy hollow points. For me I have a few boxes of quikshoks (fragmenting bullets, very cool and effective google how they work, nothing like the over rated glaser crap) and bulk packs of remington 100 round bulk packs from walmart. Yep, I'll use bulk packed 100 round remington hollow points for self defense without hesitation... for several reasons the least of which is I've fired hundreds of them and I know they work and function 100% in my gun. How many 100's of roudns can you afford to shoot of the super dooper stuff? ;) Food for thought.

AZLiberty | 05-26-2008 08:40 PM
Re: .45 ACP AMMO 230 grain Gold dots. The 200s have some expansion issues. The top 3 which all meet the FBI/IWBA test criterion are the 230 Gold Dot 230 Win ranger-t (part # 45RAT) 230 HST I carry the Gold Dots, but would feel perfectly comfortable with either the Ranger-T or HST load. The nice thing about the Gold Dot is that a GD is a GD, Win sells almost a dozen different bullets under the "Ranger" line, but only the "T" series meets the FBI test criterion. FBI/IWBA test is penetration of 12 to 18 inches in ballistic gelatin after penetrating 4 layers of denim. Lots of older HP (like the hydroshok) plug up in the denim, and end up acting like an FMJ.

SilverSalmon | 05-26-2008 08:58 PM
Re: .45 ACP AMMO Quote:
Originally Posted by AZLiberty (Post 1119548) 230 grain Gold dots. The 200s have some expansion issues. The top 3 which all meet the FBI/IWBA test criterion are the 230 Gold Dot 230 Win ranger-t (part # 45RAT) 230 HST I carry the Gold Dots, but would feel perfectly comfortable with either the Ranger-T or HST load. The nice thing about the Gold Dot is that a GD is a GD, Win sells almost a dozen different bullets under the "Ranger" line, but only the "T" series meets the FBI test criterion. FBI/IWBA test is penetration of 12 to 18 inches in ballistic gelatin after penetrating 4 layers of denim. Lots of older HP (like the hydroshok) plug up in the denim, and end up acting like an FMJ.
thanks, that's actually the answer to my question. shot placement is important,but if for some reason i don't hit where i want, this hp will set it straight i hope.

Irons | 05-26-2008 09:00 PM
Re: .45 ACP AMMO Quote:
Originally Posted by mtnman (Post 1117906) Shot placement is everything, learn to shoot, learn to shoot without aiming. The US government has been using the 1911 since 1911 to knock down and kill the enemy using Ball ammo. Ball is what the gun was designed for, use it. All the fancy ammo in the world won�t help if you can�t hit your target. There is no two legged prey on the American continent that the 1911 won�t stop with one well placed round using Ball type ammo.
Nobody yells ouch! ouch! ouch! When they are hit with a .45, they are down. Ball, hollow point really doesn't matter

SilverSalmon | 05-26-2008 09:08 PM
Re: .45 ACP AMMO Quote:
Originally Posted by Irons (Post 1119564) Nobody yells ouch! ouch! ouch! When they are hit with a .45, they are down. Ball, hollow point really doesn't matter
ok,ok, i'm sold! Which ball ammo is best? Some brands must be better than others! Thanks!!!!

sky | 05-27-2008 10:45 AM
Re: .45 ACP AMMO Anyone here ever buy/use the 'extreme shock' rounds in .45acp? What do you think of their usefulness in a close quarters attack, besides being VERY expensive.

AZLiberty | 05-28-2008 02:38 AM
Re: .45 ACP AMMO Gimmick. Think about this, almost anything will do the job if you can get a nice direct shot direct to the sternum. I mean in most folks the heart is just 5-6" under the skin. The reason the IWBA requires 12" of penetration is because in the real world you might have to penetrate through say, an arm or a shoulder to reach the vitals.

Irons | 05-31-2008 10:25 AM
Re: .45 ACP AMMO Quote:
Originally Posted by SilverSalmon (Post 1119573) ok,ok, i'm sold! Which ball ammo is best? Some brands must be better than others! Thanks!!!!
We shoot a lot of bowling pins all summer long so I buy 500 or 1000 rounds at a time.The sardine cans of wolf .45 is great ammo at a great price.Watch for sales from sportsmansgiude.com or cheaperthandirt.com, gunbroker.etc and buy online or over the phone to avoid state sales tax. I realize there is better ammo than Wolf but for us its ideal.Its not dirty, it always go's Bang and it feeds no problem through our Colts, HK's, Kimber, Glock and AMT Hardballer.:applause_ Also its humid here in nojobistan Michigan and the sealed cans can be stored in the pole barn without worry.

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