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- - Shooting other calibers in a Moisin Nagant? (http://goldismoney.info/forums/showthread.php?t=430941)

Patriotme | 12-10-2009 11:41 AM
Shooting other calibers in a Moisin Nagant? Ok....a few years ago I remember reading somewhere that in a pinch you could shoot .308 in a 30-06. This was an end of the world-out of ammo scenario and the author stated that you could shoot .308 (7.62x51mm) in a 30-06 (7.62x63mm) if it were a bolt action or single shot rifle. Supposedly the neck of the .308 cartridge would be straightened out and the accuracy would suck but it would work if you had no other ammo. As a Moisin Nagant is 7.62x54mm would shooting .308 (7.62x51mm) work as it would in a 30-06? Here's another one. If you can shoot .308 in a 30-06 then could you shoot 7.62x54mm in a 30-06 (7.62x63mm) in a SHTF type world?

Haltiat | 12-10-2009 12:05 PM
Re: Shooting other calibers in a Moisin Nagant? I have a hard time imagining how you'd get the ammo and not also get the gun that shoots it but... you wouldn't have any luck shooting 7.62x54 through a .30-06. The Russian round has a rim and the American round does not. You might be able to insert a .308 or .30-06 in a Mosin's chamber but the taper on a 7.62x54r case may prevent it. You can definitely re-use the bullets and powder, probably the primers too. If you have a Mosin you are blessed with the only cheap to feed .30cal ammo out there, no excuses not to stock up and avoid having to shoot calibers your rifle isn't chambered for.

Patriotme | 12-10-2009 12:13 PM
Re: Shooting other calibers in a Moisin Nagant? Ahhh....I forgot about the rim on the Russian round. Very good point. As for why someone might want to shoot another caliber in a Moisin-Nagan, I recently read "The Road" and it started me thinking about what someone might use in their weapons if they had no suitable ammo. I wouldn't recomend the practice but it is an interesting topic as the whole 2012/Economic Collapse/EMP/etc stuff seems kind of big right now.

Haltiat | 12-10-2009 12:26 PM
Re: Shooting other calibers in a Moisin Nagant? I understand. It's good info to have just in case. Many firearms can chamber and fire rounds other than what they're chambered for, usually safely. The big problem becomes reliability. Sometimes it's better just to have multiple guns or a means of caliber conversion. For instance a Glock 40 can also shoot 9mm or .357 sig with a barrel swap and I have seen .22lr conversion kits for Glocks. More famously any .357 magnum can fire .38 special without a problem, just clean the chambers before you shoot .357 again or you may have extraction difficulties.

Patriotme | 12-10-2009 01:21 PM
Re: Shooting other calibers in a Moisin Nagant? Hmm....that might be an interesting idea for another thread. What weapons can accept multiple calibers of ammo and what weapons have conversion kits?

Kregener | 12-10-2009 01:31 PM
Re: Shooting other calibers in a Moisin Nagant? I would not do it.

CrufflerJJ | 12-10-2009 09:28 PM
Re: Shooting other calibers in a Moisin Nagant? Quote:
Originally Posted by Patriotme (Post 2068572) Hmm....that might be an interesting idea for another thread. What weapons can accept multiple calibers of ammo and what weapons have conversion kits?
I have seen chamber inserts for the Mosin Nagant that allow you to shoot .32ACP in the MN. It's been years..not sure if they were custom made, or commercially available. I'd rather just stock up on ammo. Or reload. Or both.

desertjack | 12-10-2009 09:43 PM
Re: Shooting other calibers in a Moisin Nagant? I do not advise doing this, at all, for any reason, EVER!!! Okay with that being said I have read that the Vietcong would shoot captured 7.62x51 Nato (.308) in their Mosin Nagants safely when proper ammo was not available. However there were two drawbacks 1) accuracy was poor since you are launching a .308 diameter projectile down a .311 bore 2) the casing cannot be extracted from the chamber like normal, they would have to carry a rod sturdy enough to drop down the barrel and knock the empty case out for each and every shot. Doing this is probably better than throwing rocks at your enemy, but that's about it; chances of hitting your target are bad and it'll take you quite a while to reload after you miss.

barack obama | 12-10-2009 11:21 PM
Re: Shooting other calibers in a Moisin Nagant? My suggestion would be to close the breech on a primed case, and load it like a muzzle loader using black powder. Much safer, and would probably work better.

Patriotme | 12-11-2009 02:10 AM
Re: Shooting other calibers in a Moisin Nagant? Once again, I don't plan on trying this but it did seem like an interesting idea. I posted the same topic on The High Road and got a lot of interesting responses. Some say a .270 will work in a 30-06, some say it won't. I never considered that mix but again....this thread is only for consideration. I don't plan on risking life, limbs or expensive guns on trial and error experiments.

Magikphun | 12-11-2009 02:58 AM
Re: Shooting other calibers in a Moisin Nagant? BO - That's a damn interesting idea! I wonder if it has ever been tried?

eat_beef | 12-11-2009 09:25 AM
Re: Shooting other calibers in a Moisin Nagant? You absolutely cannot fire a 308 in a 30-06, at least not without some sort of chamber insert (ala Navy Garand). The .308 is about a half inch shorter, and will push into the chamber past the reach of the bolt/FP. I once bought a Garand that was 'converted to 308' with a chamber insert. It wasn't, it was still a 30-06, and the 308 rounds would stick in the front of the chamber, out of reach of the bolt face/FP, and need to be removed with a cleaning rod. I suppose it might work with a controlled round feed bolt action, maybe the extractor would hold it close enough to the bolt face for the FP to reach, but I DEFINITELY wouldn't try it, not even with your face!:rofl: Theoretically, you should be able to shoot any smaller caliber round through a larger caliber with the same parent case, IE 270 or 25-06 through a 30-06, 260 or 243 through a 308, etc. I'm not planning on trying that, either.

Zusn | 12-11-2009 09:44 AM
Re: Shooting other calibers in a Moisin Nagant? Quote:
Originally Posted by eat_beef (Post 2070262) You absolutely cannot fire a 308 in a 30-06, at least not without some sort of chamber insert (ala Navy Garand). The .308 is about a half inch shorter, and will push into the chamber past the reach of the bolt/FP.
I have to kindly disagree to that statement. Before my grandfather moved (from east coast to west coast) he sold most of his ammo since the movers wouldn't take it. He still had some left, including 308. I remember him telling me the day he got back from the range about shooting 308 in his 30-06 rifle. The neck of the cartridge does get straightened out when fired in a 30-06. I don't remember his mentioning accuracy. All that ammo he had. It would have cost me about $2k to rent a small box truck and drive it cross country. It seemed too expensive back then, now it would have been practically free. He got paid a visit by the FBI back in 1965 after purchasing 22 rifles and 100,000 rounds of ammunition. He thought civil war was coming back then. Good 'ol Grandpa....

Big Country | 12-11-2009 10:24 AM
Re: Shooting other calibers in a Moisin Nagant? Quote:
Originally Posted by barack obama (Post 2069634) My suggestion would be to close the breech on a primed case, and load it like a muzzle loader using black powder. Much safer, and would probably work better.
if you try this make sure your powder completely fills the case and is in DIRECT contact with the ball/bullet or you are likely to explode your gun this way too... I've seen a muzzle loader EXPLODE because someone didn't seat the ball all the way down on the powder...You don't want room for the explosion to expand without moving the bullet first or you are in trouble...

eat_beef | 12-11-2009 01:35 PM
Re: Shooting other calibers in a Moisin Nagant? Quote:
Originally Posted by Zusn (Post 2070301) I have to kindly disagree to that statement. Before my grandfather moved (from east coast to west coast) he sold most of his ammo since the movers wouldn't take it. He still had some left, including 308. I remember him telling me the day he got back from the range about shooting 308 in his 30-06 rifle. The neck of the cartridge does get straightened out when fired in a 30-06. I don't remember his mentioning accuracy.
If you have a 30-06 rifle and some 308 ammo, I suggest you try chambering it. Like I said, maybe with a Mauser or other controlled feed action, the extractor MIGHT allow it to fire. With a Garand it definitely will not. This isn't hearsay, I've tried it myself, albeit accidentally.

eat_beef | 12-11-2009 01:46 PM
Re: Shooting other calibers in a Moisin Nagant? Curiosity being what it is, I just dug out a Mosin and tried to chamber a 308 round. I couldn't get the bolt to close. I think it might have gone if I banged the bolt with a hammer, but I'll leave that to someone much more desperate. There is absolutely no way you're ever going to get a round of 30-06 in there. Mosins are cheap ugly old sticks for which I have little respect, and I wouldn't mind trying to close the bolt and fire it, but alas, while my face may be old and ugly, it's harder to replace than a 75frn rifle. Mythbuster status: Fail.

barack obama | 12-11-2009 07:01 PM
Re: Shooting other calibers in a Moisin Nagant? Quote:
Originally Posted by Big Country (Post 2070377) if you try this make sure your powder completely fills the case and is in DIRECT contact with the ball/bullet or you are likely to explode your gun this way too... I've seen a muzzle loader EXPLODE because someone didn't seat the ball all the way down on the powder...You don't want room for the explosion to expand without moving the bullet first or you are in trouble...
Ok, I am not actually suggesting anyone do this, just that it would be better than the suggested alternative. And yes, the ball should definitely always be seated against the powder.

barack obama | 12-11-2009 07:02 PM
Re: Shooting other calibers in a Moisin Nagant? Quote:
Originally Posted by Magikphun (Post 2069892) BO - That's a damn interesting idea! I wonder if it has ever been tried?
I'm not sure I like that abbreviation :-).

Blorp | 12-11-2009 09:32 PM
Re: Shooting other calibers in a Moisin Nagant? Quote:
Originally Posted by CrufflerJJ (Post 2069367) I have seen chamber inserts for the Mosin Nagant that allow you to shoot .32ACP in the MN. It's been years..not sure if they were custom made, or commercially available. I'd rather just stock up on ammo. Or reload. Or both.
Mosin ammo is CHEAP. Can you get any cheaper? It is difficult. I've tried. Hard to beat. The Russian surplus is awesome. Just shoot that. Check out ammunitiontogo 880 rounds in two tins with an opener for cheap, shipped. Dirty as hell but accurate and reliable. Plan now, don't take chances later.

BobtheTomato | 12-11-2009 10:15 PM
Re: Shooting other calibers in a Moisin Nagant? the 7.62x54 is rimmed. I doubt the bolt would engage properly.

Patriotme | 12-12-2009 12:47 AM
Re: Shooting other calibers in a Moisin Nagant? Quote:
Originally Posted by eat_beef (Post 2070786) Curiosity being what it is, I just dug out a Mosin and tried to chamber a 308 round. I couldn't get the bolt to close. I think it might have gone if I banged the bolt with a hammer, but I'll leave that to someone much more desperate. There is absolutely no way you're ever going to get a round of 30-06 in there. Mosins are cheap ugly old sticks for which I have little respect, and I wouldn't mind trying to close the bolt and fire it, but alas, while my face may be old and ugly, it's harder to replace than a 75frn rifle. Mythbuster status: Fail.
Actually my question was can you get a 7.62x54 to work in a 30-06 not the other way around. Also I asked if a .308 would work in a Moisin-Nagant. Thanks for the info on the .308 not fitting. I posted this question on another forum and it seems to have drawn a bit of interest. Once again...I'm not going to try shooting the wrong ammo in rifles. The warnings are appreciated but I am not going to try it or advocate others trying it. The question came up after reading "The Road" in which the main character is slowly starving and freezing while trying to survive a nuclear winter with his son. He's poorly armed (as are most of the survivors) and considering reloads that I won't even go into.

eat_beef | 12-12-2009 10:26 AM
Re: Shooting other calibers in a Moisin Nagant? Like a previous poster said, no way is a 7.62x54R fitting into a 30cal chamber, either. Aside from the rim, the case taper is different; the x54 is much larger at the base, even in front of the rim. The only thing that might work would be a .243 in a 308 or some such, as mentioned above, and even then you're just making noise, I doubt if you could hit anything more than a few feet away. Instead of worrying about such things, one should worry about caching weapons/ammo/support items in multiple locations, so that one doesn't end up in a position of needing to use stuff that's going to blow up in your face.:ok:

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