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optimestic1 | 05-23-2009 02:36 PM
A reason NOT to stockpile ammo Many of us here like to stockpile ammo at this time because it seems to be a good investment since ammo prices are only going up. Some of us may want to sell some in the future. But I just tried that and found a problem. Ammo starts to show its age after awhile. I asked a local dealer if he'd want to buy some of my .22 ammo. He said he'd give me $18 for each brick of Remington Thunderbolt, but not if it was starting to show signs of corrosion. Well, my ammo is all in a box in a bedroom closet, away from any of the elements. I opened a box and discovered that the shell casings are starting to darken. They aren't the bright, shiny golden color that they were when new. I guess this is what happens with age. They are about 10 years old.

Bx3 | 05-23-2009 03:13 PM
Re: A reason NOT to stockpile ammo Propper storage in an air tight container (mil ammo can) will preserve ammo for decades. Also, a dealer will rip you off just like a used car lot. Go to Gun Broker or a local gun show and you will get a premium.

GSM/MM | 05-23-2009 04:41 PM
Re: A reason NOT to stockpile ammo brass discolors, so what...discoloration is not corrosion...dealer is just looking to low ball you...also, rotation applies just like anything else...sell him some nice shinys minus the powder...

bwelkk | 05-23-2009 04:41 PM
Re: A reason NOT to stockpile ammo What you're seeing is the brass oxidizing. Throw some oxy-absorbers in with the sealed ammo can and your ammo will be in the same condition it was in when you put it there.

GSM/MM | 05-23-2009 04:44 PM
Re: A reason NOT to stockpile ammo bet that tarnished ammo will go bang long after we're all gone.

maximumrebel1 | 05-23-2009 05:01 PM
Re: A reason NOT to stockpile ammo I think most people stock pile ammo in hopes to barter with it or use it post SHTF not use it as a medium of exchange before that.

mtnman | 05-23-2009 05:11 PM
Re: A reason NOT to stockpile ammo I stockpile ammo to give to freedom fighters when the time comes. They won't care that it is a little tarnished, as long as it goes BANG!

Tallinthesaddle | 05-23-2009 06:17 PM
Re: A reason NOT to stockpile ammo This should be next to the post " A reason not to stockpile food"! If I ever see that post I know I better buy more food fast.

Brent H | 05-23-2009 06:25 PM
Re: A reason NOT to stockpile ammo There is still plenty of ammo from WWII that was being sold last year, and still worked fine.

GRP | 05-23-2009 06:29 PM
Re: A reason NOT to stockpile ammo I guess I don't see your point, so what the brass is a little tarnished. Is he telling you that that makes it bad? Hmmmmm,,,,,, GRP

Juandisimo | 05-23-2009 07:07 PM
Re: A reason NOT to stockpile ammo Rim fire ammo, esp. bulk has a tendency to have a certain % go bad as it ages because the primer is in the rim and can actually get knocked out of the rim in certain spots over time. I have a nail keg of .22 ammo that my grand dad had in his hardware store in the 50's and at this point about 3 out of 10 rounds won't fire on the first try, but if you rotate the round so that the firing pin will hit a new spot it will usually fire. Center fire ammo is a whole different ball game. If you keep it in sealed spam cans or military ammo cans it will last well over a century.I have 30-06, .303, and 8mm ammo that is over a century old at this point and have never had a misfire out of it. I have had surplus ammo that was stored badly that has had problems but, that is the exception not the rule. That fella is trying to give you what that ammo was going for 3 years ago, screw him. that's perfectly good ammo. Its worth 30 frn's a brick now at least, maybe more depending on availability in your area.

CyberGold | 05-23-2009 10:09 PM
Re: A reason NOT to stockpile ammo I don't think he is talking about darkened brass. I think the corrosion he is referring to is the white powder that forms on old lead. Look at some old lead pistol bullets and you will see what I mean. Also sometimes brass gets that green slime corrosion if it has been in contact with tanned leather. He wouldn't be able to sell cruddy looking ammo. However, If I were you I'd sell it to me!

Shasta Gold | 05-23-2009 10:25 PM
Re: A reason NOT to stockpile ammo Quote:
Originally Posted by optimestic1 (Post 1735326) Many of us here like to stockpile ammo at this time because it seems to be a good investment since ammo prices are only going up. Some of us may want to sell some in the future. But I just tried that and found a problem. Ammo starts to show its age after awhile. I asked a local dealer if he'd want to buy some of my .22 ammo. He said he'd give me $18 for each brick of Remington Thunderbolt, but not if it was starting to show signs of corrosion. Well, my ammo is all in a box in a bedroom closet, away from any of the elements. I opened a box and discovered that the shell casings are starting to darken. They aren't the bright, shiny golden color that they were when new. I guess this is what happens with age. They are about 10 years old.
Like with emergency food supplies, one must rotate ammunition, first in, first out. Further, proper storage techniques will make ammo last much longer than one decade.

Mike C | 05-24-2009 01:59 PM
Re: A reason NOT to stockpile ammo Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallinthesaddle (Post 1735589) This should be next to the post " A reason not to stockpile food"! If I ever see that post I know I better buy more food fast.
No reason to stockpile food if you have ammo. If you have food, and I have ammo, now I have ammo AND food!:applause_

Bx3 | 05-24-2009 04:00 PM
Re: A reason NOT to stockpile ammo Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike C (Post 1736493) No reason to stockpile food if you have ammo. If you have food, and I have ammo, now I have ammo AND food!:applause_
Since I see no sarcasm in your post, it will be your type that I take great pleasure in sending on a dirt nap. You should be ashamed. Bx3

morganchaser | 05-24-2009 04:15 PM
Re: A reason NOT to stockpile ammo Quote:
Originally Posted by bwelkk (Post 1735463) What you're seeing is the brass oxidizing. Throw some oxy-absorbers in with the sealed ammo can and your ammo will be in the same condition it was in when you put it there.
I don't like the sound of that. The chemistry of oxygen absorbers mixed with oxidizing propellants sounds like a recipe for misfires.

CrufflerJJ | 05-24-2009 04:54 PM
Re: A reason NOT to stockpile ammo Quote:
Originally Posted by morganchaser (Post 1736607) I don't like the sound of that. The chemistry of oxygen absorbers mixed with oxidizing propellants sounds like a recipe for misfires.
Shouldn't be a problem at all. Oxy absorbers are fine iron or iron oxide particles, maybe a wee bit of salt as an accelerator, and a bit of inert filler (to keep the reactive particles separated), and maybe (not sure about this one) some carbon particles. They're all packaged in a plastic pouch with holes to let the contents react with free atmospheric oxygen. Your powders are encased inside the loaded round, so the two reactive materials are not in direct contact. I sort of wonder (doubt) if they even would react if mixed together at room temperature. Hmmmm... That might depend on the propellant chemistry itself (how "free" the oxygen is to being ripped from the propellant molecule by the iron or iron oxide particles). Now if you're talking about some more "fun" materials like perchlorates or organic peroxides, then all bets are off as to room temp reactivity. Those can easily react with or be catalyzed by iron oxide or simple fuel sources like confectioner's sugar at room temp, sometimes with "exciting" results.

Twisted Avatar | 05-24-2009 05:09 PM
Re: A reason NOT to stockpile ammo Quote:
Originally Posted by Brent H (Post 1735599) There is still plenty of ammo from WWII that was being sold last year, and still worked fine.
Exactly.............

UncaScrooge | 05-24-2009 06:02 PM
Re: A reason NOT to stockpile ammo Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike C (Post 1736493) No reason to stockpile food if you have ammo. If you have food, and I have ammo, now I have ammo AND food!:applause_
That is a SHAMEFUL and FOOLISH post!!! If you really have that attitude, you won't last! I hope you were just being "cute." :s15:

randymatt | 05-24-2009 06:05 PM
Re: A reason NOT to stockpile ammo Quote:
Originally Posted by Juandisimo (Post 1735650) Rim fire ammo, esp. bulk has a tendency to have a certain % go bad as it ages because the primer is in the rim and can actually get knocked out of the rim in certain spots over time. I have a nail keg of .22 ammo that my grand dad had in his hardware store in the 50's and at this point about 3 out of 10 rounds won't fire on the first try,.....
In the 70's my grampa gave me a few hundred rounds of .22LR from the 40's... worked fine... but he kept it in old sealed mason jars.

Shasta Gold | 05-24-2009 07:22 PM
Re: A reason NOT to stockpile ammo Quote:
Originally Posted by UncaScrooge (Post 1736712) That is a SHAMEFUL and FOOLISH post!!! If you really have that attitude, you won't last! I hope you were just being "cute." :s15:
What's really sad is that that will be a reality - whether we like it or not. Food, water, medical equipment, PMs but no guns & ammo = NO PREPARATIONS. Only a select few of us will cooperate with others on a voluntary basis. The rest will return to the law of jungle - you have it, I want it, you can't defend it, now I have it.

Ag_man | 05-24-2009 08:59 PM
Re: A reason NOT to stockpile ammo Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike C (Post 1736493) No reason to stockpile food if you have ammo. If you have food, and I have ammo, now I have ammo AND food!:applause_
IIRC, you're a cop, right?

morganchaser | 05-24-2009 09:38 PM
Re: A reason NOT to stockpile ammo Quote:
Originally Posted by UncaScrooge (Post 1736712) That is a SHAMEFUL and FOOLISH post!!! If you really have that attitude, you won't last! I hope you were just being "cute." :s15:
I don't think he was being cute. I think he was playing the devil's advocate. Play a little bit of fallout 3. You don't wander the wasteland with a 50lbs bag of rice. You scavenge and kill anything that interferes. Your reaction is the exact one that needs to hear this, because like it or not, Mike C or not, it may happen.

Ag_man | 05-24-2009 09:43 PM
Re: A reason NOT to stockpile ammo Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike C (Post 1736493) No reason to stockpile food if you have ammo. If you have food, and I have ammo, now I have ammo AND food!:applause_
Quote:
Originally Posted by morganchaser (Post 1736971) I don't think he was being cute. I think he was playing the devil's advocate. Play a little bit of fallout 3. You don't wander the wasteland with a 50lbs bag of rice. You scavenge and kill anything that interferes. Your reaction is the exact one that needs to hear this, because like it or not, Mike C or not, it may happen.
It probably will happen, I'm a realist. I think it is also realistic to think that a fair proportion of people with that type of SHTF plans will end up very dead, at the hands of people with food and guns.

Silver001 | 05-25-2009 12:27 AM
Re: A reason NOT to stockpile ammo Those with a 90 day supply of food and water have a 50% chance of surviving. Most people will starve off in that time.

Argentsum | 05-25-2009 12:46 AM
Re: A reason NOT to stockpile ammo Quote:
Originally Posted by Silver001 (Post 1737194) Those with a 90 day supply of food and water have a 50% chance of surviving. Most people will starve off in that time.
This is assuming that society breaks overnight. More likely is that things slowly go downhill in fits and starts. A lot of the people who stockpiled PMs will sell them for personal emergencies and not THE emergency. Likewise with firearms which will be tragic. Stored food is a different scenario. We will start to see shortages of certain food items from time-to-time. Some fruits and veggies will get very expensive out of season. How many people think they will see ration cards in their lifetime? As it gets worse and worse there will be new laws and rules to incrementally accomodate the slide. Stuff like, no driving on Sundays to combat global warming or other such silliness. Now if a friggin meteorite smacked the earth and we experience a year of freezing temps. Yeah, if you haven't stockpiled food then your pretty much FUBAR'd. More likely our cheese will slowly slide of the cracker.

shortstack | 05-25-2009 01:23 AM
Re: A reason NOT to stockpile ammo Quote:
Originally Posted by Bx3 (Post 1736596) Since I see no sarcasm in your post, it will be your type that I take great pleasure in sending on a dirt nap. You should be ashamed. Bx3
This is not the first time Mike C has talked about his "plan b" murder you, then steal your stuff. http://goldismoney.info/forums/showt...89#post1674589 Problem is that if Mike C finds out who any of us are, surmises that we keep our PM's at home (if you don't hold it, you don't own it), then why should he have to wait until the SHTF to stop by your house on a foraging trip?

renegade_01 | 05-25-2009 11:27 AM
Re: A reason NOT to stockpile ammo Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike C (Post 1736493) No reason to stockpile food if you have ammo. If you have food, and I have ammo, now I have ammo AND food!:applause_
You wouldn't last long around THESE parts... :36_1_30: they have special treatment sessions for people with your stance... in some countries they will beat up the thug, while the woman of the house boils up a large pot of rice to the sticky point...lets just say you would be marked for the rest of your life. :36_1_25: good luck "taking what is mine".

Barrettone | 05-25-2009 12:45 PM
Re: A reason NOT to stockpile ammo Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike C (Post 1736493) No reason to stockpile food if you have ammo. If you have food, and I have ammo, now I have ammo AND food!:applause_
C'mon over Mike C.....I have a surprise for you. I make no claim to be the biggest, baddest, cat in the jungle, but trust me, there would be a hefty price to be paid for trying. I shoot for a major firearms manufacturer and instruct the SRT training for some of the local PD's dynamic entry teams (putting between 5,000 and 10,000 rounds down range annually). Care to try me out??? Funny thing is, you wouldn't know this if I hadn't told you. Wanna bet there aren't others on this board who are even more qualified than me to neutralize a potential threat and exercise a tactical option??? I would never be so bold as to call them out. I was always taught to never fear a loud-mouth in a bar, but rather, to fear the quiet man minding his own business just sipping his beer ...he's the one that'll clean your clock every time if you get uppity. Why don't you crawl back under your rock troll. Your comments sicken me. You're just another gun store commando...probably not even a cop...I'm guessing mall security guard...am I close tough guy???

Professur | 05-25-2009 01:05 PM
Re: A reason NOT to stockpile ammo Interesting conversation, but I think the point was missed by more than a few. The dealer obviously only wants bright brass, because that is what sells. Fin. Dull brass he'd have to sell as surplus/old stock at a lower price, and with shelf space costing money .... It's not a case of him ripping anyone off. He's probably offering a decent price compared to what he buys at from wholesale .... which is probably quite a bit lower than any of us are getting it at. You can't really expect him to pay retail.

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Barrettone | 05-25-2009 01:15 PM
Re: A reason NOT to stockpile ammo Since I reload, I tend to keep my components apart until I really need them. That way, I can tumble the brass, re-prime it, and charge it when I need to and not fear the dreaded "aging ammo" issue. I only load around 5,000 rounds at a time, and leave the rest unassembled. However, if stored correctly (sealed ammo cans as an example), it can keep for several decades as long as you are dealing with non-corrosive ammo. YMMV

Ag_man | 05-25-2009 02:51 PM
Re: A reason NOT to stockpile ammo I thought dealers tend to shy away from buying "pre-owned" ammo, for liability issues?

Nanook | 05-25-2009 03:19 PM
Re: A reason NOT to stockpile ammo Quote:
Originally Posted by Ag_man (Post 1736919) IIRC, you're a cop, right?
Must be a Chicago or L.A. cop. And some wonder who will collect guns if the time comes. It'll be guys like this. I can hear their defense now. "I was only following orders."

GoldBuyer123 | 05-25-2009 03:32 PM
Re: A reason NOT to stockpile ammo I had reloads sitting out in the storage building for 10 years and they shoot just fine. I was more concerned about the stored powder and primers, also largely ignored with no precautions taken to protect them. Again all are just fine. Thanks to this forum, I stock piled deep over a year ago, 100's of dollars worth of 9mm and 45ACP factory ammo and fully used up all my reload supplies. I just check Walmart, and nothing on the shelves and the price is double what it was a year ago.

UncaScrooge | 05-26-2009 10:17 PM
Re: A reason NOT to stockpile ammo Quote:
Originally Posted by Barrettone (Post 1737717) Since I reload, I tend to keep my components apart until I really need them. That way, I can tumble the brass, re-prime it, and charge it when I need to and not fear the dreaded "aging ammo" issue. I only load around 5,000 rounds at a time, and leave the rest unassembled. However, if stored correctly (sealed ammo cans as an example), it can keep for several decades as long as you are dealing with non-corrosive ammo. YMMV
Makes sense to me! I'm just getting prepped to start rolling my own, and see the sense in your approach of keeping "raw materials" stored away and only combined when needed. :wavey:

St. Germain | 05-26-2009 10:25 PM
Re: A reason NOT to stockpile ammo Quote:
Originally Posted by Brent H (Post 1735599) There is still plenty of ammo from WWII that was being sold last year, and still worked fine.
Ran a bunch through the M1 carbine. bang, bang, bang.

CrufflerJJ | 05-27-2009 07:40 AM
Re: A reason NOT to stockpile ammo I've shot Turkish 8mm ammo from 1932-1933, and it all fired just fine. Corrosively primed as all get-out, but sure fire.

ruprick | 05-27-2009 07:47 AM
Re: A reason NOT to stockpile ammo Tarnished ammo trumps Tarnished Politicians.....

GoldWampum | 05-27-2009 08:13 AM
Re: A reason NOT to stockpile ammo Quote:
Originally Posted by ruprick (Post 1740499) Tarnished ammo trumps Tarnished Politicians.....
:4_1_72::rofl::4_1_72: No argument there.

Twisted Avatar | 05-27-2009 09:23 AM
Re: A reason NOT to stockpile ammo Quote:
Originally Posted by Shasta Gold (Post 1736809) What's really sad is that that will be a reality - whether we like it or not. Food, water, medical equipment, PMs but no guns & ammo = NO PREPARATIONS. Only a select few of us will cooperate with others on a voluntary basis. The rest will return to the law of jungle - you have it, I want it, you can't defend it, now I have it.
BUT DO YOU HAVE THE SENSE TO USE IT??? AS PEOPLE THAT EMPLOY THAT STRATEGEY USUALLY DONT HAVE TO KNOW HOW. I MEAN THINK ABOUT IT: IF THEY DIDNT PREPARE ENOUGH TO PROCURE CERTAIN ITEMS WHAT MAKES YOU THINK THEY READ THE INSTRUCTION BOOKS (BEFORE THEY KILLED THE RIGHTFUL OWNER)ON HOW TO PROPERLY USE AND MAINTIAN THEM?? A TANGIBLE IS ONLY AS GOOD AS YOU ARE CAPABLE OF USING IT. SO YOU ARE CORRECT IN THE IMMEDIATE BUT OVER THE LONG TERM NATURAL SELECTION WILL REMOVE PEOPLE LIKE THIS FROM THE GENE POOL AS OVERLY AGRESSIVE IS AS FOOLISH AS UNDERLY AGRESSIVE......ONLY THOSE WHO ARE ABLE TO BLEND THE TWO WILL HAVE THE GREATEST ODDS OF SEEING THEMSLEVES ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THIS. BUT NATURE WILL MAKE NO GUARANTEES EITHER WAY......EVERYDAY IS A PEFECT DAY TO MEET YOUR DEMISE. T

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