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Lt Dan | 11-12-2008 12:28 PM
.380 Handguns I asked this on another forum a while back and thought since this is a different crowd, it wouldn't hurt to pose it here as well. Recently I bought a used PPK at a gun show. I got it at a fair price and am satisfied with its performance. It is the stainless model made in the states by Interarms. Once I inspected it after shooting it some I noticed that the magazines are worn bad and even have a crack up next to the lip where the catch locks it into place. I replaced the worn out mags with new ones. So, my interest is, does anyone here have any experience with the Walther PPK or PPK/S with respect to what to look for in the way of wear? I know the newer ones put out by S&W have made some improvements, but with the built in trigger locks. A feature I don't really care for in a firearm. I also have a Sig P232 (.380) which I actually like better because it fits my hand better and has better sights. Plus the fact it has a 7 rd mag as compared to the PPK's 6 rd. Any comments, info, remarks, questions or advise is welcome.

Lt Dan | 11-12-2008 05:19 PM
Re: .380 Handguns Bought it 'private sale' and would prefer S&W or any other place I'd have to send it, just were left out of the picture. The new mags weren't a big deal, I needed more anyway and the old ones still work they look more like the problem was cause by abuse the more I look at them. I doubt abuse would be covered. I'll keep them for spares, the springs are still good and they do feed properly.

MOD1 | 11-12-2008 06:20 PM
Re: .380 Handguns Are there any indications that the magazines were made by S&W or one of their contractors? Abuse? Maybe. Possibly the previous owner was Mr. Tactical Guy and liked to jam the magazine in the well ala Tom Selleck!!! If made by S&W, I'd politely ask for replacements for the ones that have cracked. If they say no, well at least you tried. I try to always depress the magazine catch whenever I insert a magazine. This avoids the catch lip riding the magazine tube. Once you release the magazine catch, tug on the base to determine if the magazine is latched. PS Don't get me started with mechanical abuse. If I see someone flip their wrist one more time on closing a revolver cylinder .............. Take care, Mod1

Caligula | 11-12-2008 08:17 PM
Re: .380 Handguns Quote:
Originally Posted by Lt Dan (Post 1412092) Any comments, info, remarks, questions or advise is welcome.
Ok. Why anyone would want to carry the wimpy .380 baffles me. 9mm of up for me. Preferably 9mm +P+....

____hoot____ | 11-12-2008 08:48 PM
Re: .380 Handguns 380 in the pocket much better than the heavier bigger "gorilla killer" back home in the drawer

Lt Dan | 11-12-2008 09:02 PM
Re: .380 Handguns Quote:
Originally Posted by Caligula (Post 1412918) Ok. Why anyone would want to carry the wimpy .380 baffles me. 9mm of up for me. Preferably 9mm +P+....
This not going to be an AR vs. AK thread. First rule of a gun fight - bring a gun. AND, you've never seen me shoot. I'd feel confident with a .22 for close up and personal. Besides the two .380s I own S&W 9mm, S&W .38 SPL, G23 Glock .40 S&W, 1911 .45 ACP and let's see a .44 mag, three .22 handguns and there might be a few more I've forgotten about. This has nothing to do with what I choose to carry, it is a discussion about .380 handguns, in particular the PPK. :banghead:

CyberGold | 11-12-2008 09:05 PM
Re: .380 Handguns Why, I've been thinking of upgrading my .25 to a .380 :sarcasm:

____hoot____ | 11-12-2008 10:34 PM
Re: .380 Handguns Gee, and I've been thinking about up-gradeing my 22 to a 44~~~~~~not! My old $50 pawn shop H&R "kit gun" will shoot 4" 25 yard 9 shot groups; it and 109 rounds of LR ammo, a back-up folder knife and my "camera bag" holster weighs 35 ounces. Sorry about that Lt. Dan, I just couldn't help it! I had a Makarov for a while.

elroy | 11-12-2008 11:08 PM
Re: .380 Handguns I have a Colt Mustang [stainless steel] .380 It is a sweet little gun. Pretty much a junior version of a 1911

reformed wastrel | 11-13-2008 12:08 AM
Re: .380 Handguns Quote:
Originally Posted by Lt Dan (Post 1412092) So, my interest is, does anyone here have any experience with the Walther PPK or PPK/S with respect to what to look for in the way of wear? I know the newer ones put out by S&W have made some improvements, but with the built in trigger locks. A feature I don't really care for in a firearm.
The Walther PPK being put out by S&W do not have a trigger lock. S&W have reserved trigger locks for their own brand of guns, apparently.

Lt Dan | 11-13-2008 12:39 AM
Re: .380 Handguns Quote:
Originally Posted by reformed wastrel (Post 1413267) The Walther PPK being put out by S&W do not have a trigger lock. S&W have reserved trigger locks for their own brand of guns, apparently.
Thanks, mine is the older Interarms model PPK without the extended beavertail. Since I've not handled the newer S&W models I assumed incorrectly that it would have a trigger lock. My S&W smubnose .38 does.

reformed wastrel | 11-13-2008 06:20 AM
Re: .380 Handguns Quote:
Originally Posted by wildcard (Post 1413310) S&W is just the current importer. They don't build them.
Actually, S&W do build the PPK and PPK/S here in the U.S., under license from Walther. However, the other Walther products (PPS, P99, etc.) are manufactured in Germany and those are imported by S&W. Then there's the S&W SW99, which is very similar to the Walther P99, because the SW99's receivers are made in Germany by Walther while the barrels and slides for it are made in the U.S. by S&W. It's all very confusing.

CrufflerJJ | 11-13-2008 11:29 AM
Re: .380 Handguns Quote:
Originally Posted by Caligula (Post 1412918) Ok. Why anyone would want to carry the wimpy .380 baffles me. 9mm of up for me. Preferably 9mm +P+....
As others have said Rule #1 - have a gun. A nice dinky, small, light weight .380 (like the Keltec P3AT or Ruger's version) is very easy to carry & conceal. Even a small, light weight 9mm, such as Kahr's PM9, is bulkier than the P3AT. Carry what you can conceal. All the time...not just when you think you might need it.

Heimdhal | 11-13-2008 12:42 PM
Re: .380 Handguns Quote:
Originally Posted by wildcard (Post 1413950) Pardon me for saying so..., but doesn't 9mm = .380 diameter? Just a longer case for the 9mm = more powder = more velocity? :wink:
Not to mention slightly higher foot-pounds in energy delivery for the 9mm(9x19) and a heavier bullet and more variety, but also a snappier recoil. But this shouldnt turn into a this-vs-that thread, thats the last thing we need. Lets just concede the fact that a bullet going 950 FPS is gonna leave a mark or two :moon:

Lt Dan | 11-14-2008 12:45 AM
Re: .380 Handguns Quote:
Originally Posted by Heimdhal (Post 1413975) Not to mention slightly higher foot-pounds in energy delivery for the 9mm(9x19) and a heavier bullet and more variety, but also a snappier recoil. But this shouldnt turn into a this-vs-that thread, thats the last thing we need. Lets just concede the fact that a bullet going 950 FPS is gonna leave a mark or two :moon:
I found this generalized info off a google search, but any reloading manual would give you similar answers; Quote:
.380 or .380 ACP is 9mm Kurz it's dimensions are 9x17 The Makarov is 9x18 The 9mm Luger is 9x19 The 9x19 is also referred to as Parabellum/Luger/NATO
It can get a little confusing. The ammo for any of these 9's is not interchangeable.

Infidel | 11-14-2008 12:56 AM
Re: .380 Handguns My concentration is poor now. Stumbled into this thread thinking "Who in their right mind would want to shoot a .308 handgun? That is nuts."

Lars Ragnarsson | 11-14-2008 01:29 AM
Re: .380 Handguns Quote:
Originally Posted by elroy (Post 1413197) I have a Colt Mustang [stainless steel] .380 It is a sweet little gun. Pretty much a junior version of a 1911
I've got a FI Model D that I got from a friend over 20 years ago. The Colt version was called the Pony. Yeah, it looks like a mini 1911. Works real nice!

Eastex | 11-14-2008 08:12 AM
Re: .380 Handguns Lt. Dan, I also bought an Interarms PPK/S. It's a great CC pistol, points well, and a fine looking pistol. But I kept having problems with the new round feeding. Hardball ammo was ok, but hollow points in any grain would jam. Not every time, but enough to scare me off of it as a carry gun. On the Walther board, lots of complaints on the S&W built PPK. The Interarms is considered a better build.

Lt Dan | 11-14-2008 09:10 AM
Re: .380 Handguns Quote:
Originally Posted by Infidel (Post 1415324) My concentration is poor now. Stumbled into this thread thinking "Who in their right mind would want to shoot a .308 handgun? That is nuts."
That's .380 not .308, huge difference. People who know me, have never accused me of being in my right mind. :MIA: :111:

CyberGold | 11-14-2008 10:30 PM
Re: .380 Handguns a 380 is usually a blowback design while 9mm requires a locking breech to slow the slide from retracting too fast. My S&W 3913 is about the smallest and most concealable 9mm I have. My Beretta 70-S in 308 is bigger than I would like so I often shove my colt .25 in my pocket to go to the store, thus my interest in upgrading to a LCP or other similar size. I do have a 642, 638 and 60 in revolvers but I want something small to throw in a pocket.

koyaanisqatsi | 11-17-2008 01:16 AM
Re: .380 Handguns http://www.cz-usa.com/data/productimg/main040.png Lt. Dan, sorry to diverge a bit from topic but ... I selected a CZ 83 in 9mm Makarov to replace my stolen Bulgarian Makarov. It is near 100% reliable with it's simple blowback design. The workmanship is very good, all construction is all-blued steel, including it's (3) 12-shot staggered magazines. The gun is accurate with a fixed barrel, in a compact size 6.8" long. It has a polygonal non-rifled-cut barrel, very durable with Soviet-style, copper-washed steel-jacketed ammo, and makes for easier bore cleaning as well. I got the optional factory walnut grips, and to me it looks functionally beautiful. It rides well in a Bianchi paddle high-rise leather holster for the PPK, and a smooth double-action trigger means I can carry it with a round chambered and dis-engaged hammer down like a revolver, for potential fast draw-and-snap action. After a fast 13-shots the slide locks open, I punch the release and the steel mag just falls out, ready for another 12 rounds. As you may know, the Mak has about 5-10% more energy than a typical .380, yet maybe 35-50% less energy than a full-size 9x19mm Luger round. Most of the talk about handgun 'killing power' here on GIM is just sort of funny haha to me - like a writer exclaiming that if one has just the right model of typewriter one can write like a William Shakespere, otherwise one is doomed to be a stupid illiterate. I remind us all that a cool head, consistent reliability, and shot placement are always the utmost concern - besides CARRYING a gun into a crime scene in the first place. Most perps I expect don't want any gunfight and they won't wonder if you're shooting them with a 9mm Luger or just a 'dinky' .380acp. The deadly 1858 Remington blackpowder revolvers like Eastwood used in some of his best western movies fired only a 140grain .44 ball at 720fps, less energy than my CZ 83 with alternating 95gr Russian Wolf/Barnaul hardballs and hp's at 1,050fps. These Rusky FMJs will probably exit the far side of a bad guy. (I stocked away 900 rounds when they were $7.88/box of 50 shots, 100 of them are rare 105grain LVE hp ammo, the best) But the pistol is to some a little heavy (28oz) and fat in the grip (1.4"), and having less power than it could ... so what? A heavier gun points steady, absorbs muzzle flip, and yet I hardly notice any extra weight on my hip, and the thick grip fills my hand nicely. It's just a bit too big and heavy for a pants pocket. My other handguns range from a Beretta Model 21 in .22LR (Ian Flemming's James Bond favored his Beretta .25acp) to a Taurus .45/410 Judge shooting the (5 pellet) 000 buckshot 3" shells and 255gr 1,000fps Buffalo Bullets ... I love my various handguns each and all in the right time and place. And we each have different tastes, as is good. I feel quite safe carrying my CZ 83 around this town ... that's what matters to me, not caring what the 'gun crowd' says... Of course this is all just my 2 cents worth of personal opinion and there sure are lots of nice guns out there today... Yet all pistols are compromises, wishing for the long gun I left back home. I'm getting a conceal-to-carry pistol permit before the year's out, better to sieze my rights before they're taken away, and this potent CZ 83, and my light-weight 17oz Taurus 85ULSS .38+p, and my invisible 11oz pocket size Beretta .22 and CCI Velocitors will each have days of carry for me soon. I won't want for more gun in my current travels really ... just for more gun(s)... that's natural I gotta figure.

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