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- - Water Solution: Need some advice on application (http://goldismoney.info/forums/showthread.php?t=322428)

Codger | 11-14-2008 10:31 PM
Water Solution: Need some advice on application I found what I need for my home in the city. It's a 300 freestanding "doorway" tank, meaning it should fit through my door (I measured and it does). I can get it for $477 plus tax from a local supplier. I've found the same tank for over $600 with a few farm supply places and less than $400 over the net but then I have to pay god knows what to ship it. I'll be putting it in my basement and in order to keep the water somewhat fresh I figured I would plumb a dual valve at the bottom and run it to the slop sink/washer supply. Then I'll rig up some contraption at the top with the original supply. I'm thinking there has to be some type of mountable float-valve that I can install from the large opening that will keep it full. So far I've got the idea, but no idea on specifics. I also would like opinions on the foundation it sits on. I have an old house and an uneven cracked floor. I'm thinking about pouring a slightly raised footing and sinking some mounting brackets of some sort. This should be an easy application and I think it will be perfect for my city situation. 300 galloons for 2 adults and one toddler is a good start I think. <TABLE style="WIDTH: 146px; HEIGHT: 102px" width=146 align=right border=0><TBODY><TR><TD> http://www.norwesco.com/images/conte...eeStanding.jpg</TD></TR><TR><TD> FREESTANDING WATER TANK Like our 375 gallon tank, these tanks have been designed with residential and commercial applications in mind. The dimensions of the tanks allow them to fit through a conventional doorway. The design of these tanks allow them to be freestanding/self-supporting and eliminates the need for a steel frame. <TABLE class=parameters cellSpacing=1 cellPadding=1 border=0><TBODY><TR><TD class=paramtitle align=middle colSpan=8>FREESTANDING WATER TANK</TD></TR><TR vAlign=top align=middle><TH>Gallon Capacity</TH><TH>Width</TH><TH>Overall Height</TH><TH>Length</TH><TH>Fill Opening</TH><TH>Outlet/Drain Specification</TH><TH>Premium Weight Part No. White</TH><TH>Avail</TH></TR><TR align=middle><TD>250</TD><TD>29"</TD><TD>40"</TD><TD>62"</TD><TD>16"</TD><TD>1 1/4"</TD><TD>42337</TD><TD>B,C,D,E,G,H,L</TD></TR><TR style="BACKGROUND-COLOR: #e9e9e9" align=middle><TD>300</TD><TD>29"</TD><TD>48"</TD><TD>62"</TD><TD>16"</TD><TD>1 1/4"</TD><TD>41869</TD><TD>B,C,D,E,G,H,L</TD></TR><TR><TD> 400 </TD><TD> 29" </TD><TD> 65" </TD><TD> 62" </TD><TD> 16" </TD><TD> 1 1/4" </TD><TD> 41247 </TD><TD> B,C,D,E,G,H,L </TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>

Codger | 11-16-2008 06:13 PM
Re: Water Solution: Need some advice on application Bump for help. TN Andy, I know you probably have some ideas... I'm picking up the tank this weekend and my wife is actually on board with the idea.

TechGuy | 11-16-2008 07:48 PM
Re: Water Solution: Need some advice on application How about something like this.... http://www.tractorsupply.com/wcsstor...50/2170348.jpg http://www.tractorsupply.com/wcsstor...50/2170322.jpg http://www.tractorsupply.com/webapp/wcs/stores/servlet/ProductDisplay_10551_10001_28399_-1______14602|14606|14614|28399?listingPage=true&Sp ecial=false http://images.orgill.com/200x200/6644744.jpg http://http://lawn-and-garden.hardwarestore.com/39-472-stock-tank-accessories.aspx

TechGuy | 11-16-2008 08:07 PM
Re: Water Solution: Need some advice on application I am not sure though if it is better to cycle out water that way or fill it, add clean bleach, seal it and walk away. Should keep the water fresh for a pretty long time.

Tn...Andy | 11-16-2008 08:47 PM
Re: Water Solution: Need some advice on application Price seems high for the amount of volume. I can buy a 1500 gallon tank here at Tractor supply for 700 bucks or so, I think ( last one I bought couple years ago was under 500 )......but if you need something you can get thru a "normal" door, you're stuck with something that will work. You might also look at a couple cheaper options: 1. Flexible bladder tanks such as these: http://www.aquaflex.net/ 2. Look around at local bottling plants. They often have the blue barrels that held juice they use in bottling and will sell the barrels because shipping them back empty is often not cost effective.....get a bunch of them. As to rigging up some kind of filler valve to circulate the water, I wouldn't bother. Fill and rinse a couple times, then put a 1/4 teaspoon per gallon of standard ( non scented ) bleach in the water and forget it. It will be fine for years. Drain it and refill once a year if you worry about it. ( I wouldn't ) On the weight on the floor, assuming it is some kind of concrete floor, I wouldn't worry about it unless the floor is REALLY uneven. The worst concrete you'd run into would carry the weight of that sized tank.....even the 400 gallon model is only putting about 220lbs per sq foot on the floor, which for concrete is nothing. IF the floor is real uneven, put some sand down to level out the lumps or cracks.

StrawMan=Corporation | 11-16-2008 08:57 PM
Re: Water Solution: Need some advice on application Here is a colapasable fabric NOS military tank that holds 250 gallons. More pics at the auction link. It has a reserve but it starts at 9.99.. Better hurry if you want it I might buy it myself. http://cgi.ebay.com/250-gal-MILITARY...1%7C240%3A1318 Quote:
This is a HEAVY DUTY rubberized fabric Water Tank. Empty weight is 200 lbs! It is built like a tank for the military by Amfuel in Magnolia, AK. It is apparently NEW OLD STOCK. Shackles still have a covering taped on them and there is no sign of use on fittings or anywhere. Neither I nor the guy who runs the demil yard have ever seen a more rugged collapsible tank. Original price tag says $3,233.52! It still has the box although the box is in poor condition. Manufacture date is 06/1995 The top only is threaded for a valve. The threads into the tank are 2" NPT. There is some staining on one side of the tank where it apparently was left outside and some water sat on the bottom of the tank. See 2nd photo. No damage to the tank at all apparent. The fitting can be easily removed and is a valve type fitting which opens when attached to a particular quick release valve. I do have the original valve setup but that can be purchased separately. Only the fitting shown goes with this auction. Dimensions are either 80" x 40" or 60" x 40" I have filled one about 1/2 full and it seems that 60" tall would be about right. But in one of the photos it looks like 80" is printed on the tank. I use mine for a remote water supply when burning lots and for camp water. I also will use a couple to catch rain water off my roof for garden use. This would ship on a pallet from Los Angeles. It cost me $195.00 to deliver one from LA to Cleveland. I could get quotes for seriously interested parties or you can pick up from LA. I have a very low reserve price set on this auction.
http://i11.ebayimg.com/06/i/001/1b/5c/0361_12.JPG http://i18.ebayimg.com/01/i/001/1b/5c/03ff_12.JPG

Codger | 11-17-2008 11:37 AM
Re: Water Solution: Need some advice on application Thanks for the responses guys. My floor is very uneven. Sand would probably be easier than adding a concrete base. I'm not sure why but I like the idea of the water cycling. Though draining and filling once a year wouldn't be a big deal. I agree about the cost being high. If I weren't in the city in a northern climate I would go with a different option. I've thought of using barrels but again I'm hoping to cycle the water. Also, for this much water I'm looking at 5 or six barrels and I don't have the space for that. Are most of you who are in a big city situation going with barrels? (I know, get out of the city...I will as soon as possible)

Codger | 11-18-2008 09:33 AM
Re: Water Solution: Need some advice on application I think you guys put me back on the fence. This water storage deal is really bothering me. I think I'll just go for it and be done. This is the last major prep move for me to make and I'm surprised that I am finding it so difficult. The way I've set up everything else is completely explainable to your typical person but the blue water barrels or 300 gallon reserve is a bit odd. Plumbing it into the system seemed to make it easier but the more I think about it, the more I think sticking it in a corner and forgeting about it would be wise. But then I start thinking about leeching chemicals into the water over the long term. I really wish I lived in the country with a well and space for a big ol' traditional tank. I could pick it up thursday if I call the guy right now. I've got a truck to haul it until saturday. If I don't do this now, I probably will not do it until spring or summer next year. :s15:

Tn...Andy | 11-18-2008 09:40 AM
Re: Water Solution: Need some advice on application Something else you BETTER watch on plumbing tanks or barrels into your house water.....the pressure. These are NOT pressure rated containers and WILL split wide open if you put more than a few PSI on them.

Codger | 11-18-2008 09:53 AM
Re: Water Solution: Need some advice on application Thanks Andy. That's why I was going to go with a float-valve type fill. I may just hook up the bottom to the sink as a supply and then strategically place a valve for filling the tank when the level goes down a foot or two.

StrawMan=Corporation | 11-18-2008 11:53 AM
Re: Water Solution: Need some advice on application Correctamundo If you plan to put the storage in line You need a "pressure tank". Not one that has a bladder in it like a well tank just a tank that will hold pressure up to at least 50-60 PSI as that is the pressure that the average well would put out. An ideal material for the tank would be stainless steel but this is spendy and not easily found. Think of this as well the larger the pressure tank the larger the cash spent. Quote:
Originally Posted by Tn...Andy (Post 1421710) Something else you BETTER watch on plumbing tanks or barrels into your house water.....the pressure. These are NOT pressure rated containers and WILL split wide open if you put more than a few PSI on them.

Codger | 11-21-2008 02:24 PM
Re: Water Solution: Need some advice on application Strawman: I know. It has never been my intention to put it under pressure, hence the questions about float valves. Think giant toilet resevoir. I picked up the tank last night. It's huge. Actually it's exactly the size they said it would be but it feels different after unloading it from the back of an F-350 and moving it into my garage. After moving it in I sat in front of it with a glass of mead and a pipe and realized that I am definately over the edge now. No turning back. I'm a survivalist nutjob. My entire front yard of my big-city lot is dug up and built into raised beds with 400 cubic ft of new compost and topsoil (an addition to the small garden in the backyard), I've got a basement storage room with a permanent rotation of wet and dry canned goods, a homebrewing station, a stack of logs ready for mushroom inoculation, a garage full of hand and power tools and the knowledge to use and care for them, etc, etc, and now this big-azz tank. I can't really deny the tank. Everything else is explainable to J6P relatives if need be. But I may as well be driving a Unimog in new designer camos. Not that I really mind. The water tank has also brought with it a level of comfort I did not expect. Assuming my city home isn't overrun with hordes of starving sheeple, we're in good shape for just about anything. I waited until last for the tank because I couldn't settle on the right application. I wanted to do rain barrels and probaly still will but I need to make a substantial investment in gutters first. This water tank will be filled and rinsed this weekend, then I will take the advice from this board and fill it, treat it, and forget it, at least for a while. This will give me the comfort I need to design a better system. Thanks for the help guys.

StrawMan=Corporation | 11-21-2008 02:34 PM
Re: Water Solution: Need some advice on application The reasoning for using a pressure tank would be to have it in line with your current water system and still have a certain amount of storage. You would benefit from the tank or tanks standing upright as to get the majority of water out of them if you ever needed to get the water out of them without electricity and or a pump. But that anyhow was the reason for using a pressure tank to fit into your current system if you are on city water or use a well, the water would always be used and not stagnant in my understanding of the design of my storage system at least. A poly tank with water in it will go stagnant in time keep that in mind. And if you planned to add bleach to it keep in mind bleach is a poison to the body. Quote:
Originally Posted by Codger (Post 1428535) Strawman: I know. It has never been my intention to put it under pressure, hence the questions about float valves. Think giant toilet resevoir. I picked up the tank last night. It's huge. Actually it's exactly the size they said it would be but it feels different after unloading it from the back of an F-350 and moving it into my garage. After moving it in I sat in front of it with a glass of mead and a pipe and realized that I am definately over the edge now. No turning back. I'm a survivalist nutjob. My entire front yard of my big-city lot is dug up and built into raised beds with 400 cubic ft of new compost and topsoil (an addition to the small garden in the backyard), I've got a basement storage room with a permanent rotation of wet and dry canned goods, a homebrewing station, a stack of logs ready for mushroom inoculation, a garage full of hand and power tools and the knowledge to use and care for them, etc, etc, and now this big-azz tank. I can't really deny the tank. Everything else is explainable to J6P relatives if need be. But I may as well be driving a Unimog in new designer camos. Not that I really mind. The water tank has also brought with it a level of comfort I did not expect. Assuming my city home isn't overrun with hordes of starving sheeple, we're in good shape for just about anything. I waited until last for the tank because I couldn't settle on the right application. I wanted to do rain barrels and probaly still will but I need to make a substantial investment in gutters first. This water tank will be filled and rinsed this weekend, then I will take the advice from this board and fill it, treat it, and forget it, at least for a while. This will give me the comfort I need to design a better system. Thanks for the help guys.

Codger | 11-21-2008 03:13 PM
Re: Water Solution: Need some advice on application Strawman, did you read any of my posts since the begining of this thread? I don't mean to be rude, but all of that has been covered. A pressure tank is too small for what I am looking for. I've mentioned a million times that I want the water to refresh itself from the system and do not want to take the chances of having three hundred gallons of nasty water when I can set it up differnently. I'm setting it up on a temporary basis as storage and after I can procure the parts I will plumb it into the system but not under pressure.

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