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- - TS hits TF - Got Water ? (http://goldismoney.info/forums/showthread.php?t=196208)

RiverRat | 11-04-2007 04:45 AM
TS hits TF - Got Water ? :rolleyes_m: Small to medium sized municipal water systems ( city water ) depend on a constant availability of electricity 24/7 to operate. The heavy electrical loads of pumping water at pressure through hundreds or even thousands of miles of distribution pipelines tends to discourage any investment in generator/backup equipment should the grid fail. Of course,many of you would naturally assume they have backup equipment for emergency use in case of wide area power outages or local disasters,but that is rarely the case. Once a commercial water distribution system exceeds a few hundred homes the costs of emergency self power generation become so prohibitively expensive they don't even bother. Going into great detail explaining the distribution logistics of municipal water systems serves no purpose other than to bore most people to death with technical details. Quite simply you turn on the tap one day and no water comes out. Urban city dwellers can survive a few days without power,but when the water stops flowing it's game off. Those with wells or springs independent of any municipal water supply would do better than most if they have a plan B such as a good manual hand pump,a generator,solar water pump,wind turbine,etc...but if TSHTF those items will be almost impossible to find or buy at any price. For those who live in the country where municipal water systems are your only source of supply you are no better off than your city friends. What to do ? I asked myself that very question a few weeks ago and started working on Plan B :>) Here's a very interesting link you should take a look at: http://www.fdungan.com/well.htm Who knows ? Good information if things were to get that desperate. Let's hope they don't. :rolleyes_m::rolleyes_m::rolleyes_m:

Brio | 11-04-2007 08:59 AM
Re: TS hits TF - Got Water ? Quote:
Originally Posted by Sukhoi_fan (Post 811439) And you know how that could very easily be done - a few EMP bombs delivered by ICBMs and detonated over CONUS.
I'm remembering the NE blackout of 2003. The US's infrastructure is crumbling.

boyscout | 11-04-2007 09:13 AM
Re: TS hits TF - Got Water ? 1 Attachment(s) Attachment 35823 It was later determined by the Post War Congressional Investigation Committee that Russia did not in fact start World War Three by shutting down the electrical grid of the North Eastern United States in 2007.

walker10 | 11-04-2007 09:13 AM
Re: TS hits TF - Got Water ? I think this type of well may be very doable in some areas, I've seen these types of wells before but have always wondered how the driller would fare if they ran into rock. Another consideration that most people would have to be concerned with is the depth of the well. The shallower the well, the more likely it is that you will run into contaminated water. In my area for instance, you hit sulfurous water at 85 ft. but are fine at 150 ft. This would be of particular concern to someone living in an agricultural area where fertilizers, pesticides, etc. are used, like I do. Personally I think that if you have the time and the extra money, having a regular well drilled now is the way to go and install a Simple Pump or similar manual pump. I think I'd reserve an idea like this for after an event where you would have no other choice if you wanted a secure water supply.

RiverRat | 11-04-2007 11:00 AM
Re: TS hits TF - Got Water ? 2 Attachment(s) :rolleyes_m: Inertia pumps seem to be the easiest type to fabricate in a crunch if you can build a simple foot valve / check valve out of a ball bearing or even a hard rubber ball that doesn't float. I ran across this picture of an even simpler type of check valve design used in Afghanistan...it doesn't get any easier than this. http://goldismoney.info/forums/attac...1&d=1194191087 A 45 degree T (Y),a coat hanger,and a lid off a tin can. I didn't see a discharge outlet from looking at the pics,but another T section above the flapper would solve that problem easily with a short length of garden hose and maybe a barb fitting and some PVC cement or RTV gasket sealer. Pretty ingenious actually... It eliminates a submerged foot (check) valve. :D:D:D:D In a pinch you could use cheapo 1" black plastic pipe that can be bought by the roll. Pipe size determines volume...any water is better than no water at all. :bear_w00t::bear_w00t::bear_w00t:

shades2 | 11-04-2007 11:06 AM
Re: TS hits TF - Got Water ? Funnily enough. Yesterday I picked up a 5 Litre container the other day with spout which I filled up with filtered water. Water can be filtered and stored for quite some time between refreshes, and it's not a major chore. I figure 3 months between refreshes as long as it's kept out of the light. Packed well in the right sort of container, water takes up very little space around the house, and is unobtrusive. I have 8 litres on stand-by at any one time, 3 litres in a Plat-a-tac rehydration pack, the 5 litre heavy duty carry jug, and whatever is lying around in the water filter (usually 1.5 litres), and Gatorade (re-hydrate) mix to go. 8 litres under moderate exertion and rationing is a minimum 4 days of survival time in my current climate, in which to find another water source, not too hard at all. I actually keep this around the house as I have been very sick in the past, and being able to re-hydrate conveniently has been a major plus. I found out that the pharmaceutical rehydrate mix is basically a scam. For $8 you can get a big jar of (without wanting to sound like an advert) Gatorade powder that does the same job, compared to their tiny pharma servings at $10 a pop, which I gave to my mom when she got very ill with the flu lately. I now just keep a couple tubs of the Gatorade on hand. Water alone won't save you, you must re-hydrate, and this includes: K - Potassium Na - Sodium Cl - Chloride (Not so much really) These are all ionic (+). Gatorade provides this in the form of some easily absorbed compounds: Monopotassium Phosphate (KPO4 I think) and regular salt (NaCl). Along with glucose for some instant energy, which helps if you have low blood sugar (not so good if you are a diabetic). Slamming down water for an extended period of time which extering yourself will lead to a loss of electrolytes. Which leads to brain fog, mental confusion, cramp, eventual delirium and finally death. Your brain and other organs require electrolytes for proper function. Water alone doesn't cut it. Usually you source these electrolytes from what you eat, but if there is nothing to eat and just water, you better start looking around to supplement it.

walker10 | 11-04-2007 11:09 AM
Re: TS hits TF - Got Water ? Whoa, a very cool on the cheap setup. Have to keep this one in mind. I already have a well and have been planning on buying a Simple Pump because you can manually pressurize the moderating tank, and have your home water system operate as normal during power outages...or worse. The cost of these types of manual pumps is a real killer to a bucks down guy like me though.

walker10 | 11-04-2007 11:21 AM
Re: TS hits TF - Got Water ? Another way of storing water on the cheap is in 2 liter soda bottles. I must have about 60 gal. stored in them in the crawlspace. They've been down their for at least 3-4 years now and have shown no signs of degradation stacked 3 high. One thing though, I've tried just rinsing the bottles out with just water and have found that after a couple of months in storage about half of them treated with chlorine bleach developed some black globules floating around in them. Not quite sure what happened, maybe didn't rinse them or the caps out thoroughly enough or what. Since then I've been washing them out with Dawn dish washing detergent and they've been fine. If you store water, one thing I'd recommend is skipping the chlorine bleach though, it breaks down in a relatively short time and to be on the safe side, you have to rotate more often. Since experimenting with bleach, I've been using a product called Oxy-Stabile and have used water stored in 30 and 35 gallon barrels since 1999 and I'm still vertical. http://www.nitro-pak.com/product_inf...oducts_id=1137

walker10 | 11-04-2007 11:50 AM
Re: TS hits TF - Got Water ? Oh yea...and another thing before I forget...:D If you store water, you may want to consider buying a couple of these types of containers to set on the edge of your sinks for running water. http://relianceproducts.com/images/r...rcontainer.jpg http://relianceproducts.com/consumer/product/187.html

Tn...Andy | 11-04-2007 12:01 PM
Re: TS hits TF - Got Water ? Two 1500 gallon tanks in this building.....gravity feeds from spring up the holler, and then gravity feeds on down to the house. Spring has never quit, including this record drought year. http://www.digistash.com/data/026a39...71_p57640.jpeg

Brio | 11-04-2007 12:06 PM
Re: TS hits TF - Got Water ? Impressive Tn Andy, that yours? Very nice. We'll be fine for water too, artesian with spill-off well and a pond.

RiverRat | 11-04-2007 12:23 PM
Re: TS hits TF - Got Water ? :rolleyes_m: Nice Andy :>) I have a 600 gallon spring fed reservoir also...the drought hasn't affected it so far. Also a couple of springs above the house I could pipe in with gravity flow very easily...so I'm set for clean drinking water. :rolleyes_m::rolleyes_m::rolleyes_m:

REV127 | 11-04-2007 01:28 PM
Re: TS hits TF - Got Water ? Thanks for the link. I've already got a well but I've been considering trying to drive a new one, I hope to be able to hit the deep aquifer and bypass the thinking sulphurous shallow one. Otherwise it will be rain catchment. The site mentioned dug wells. I've seen a technique for that which seemed to be the safest, most logical I've come across. Basically they start with a wide iron ring and build a layer of well casing with brick, stone, whatever. Then the dig out the soil from inside the ring, then from under the ring. The ring slowly settles down a little deeper and you add another layer of brick. Rinse wash repeat. It probably isn't the fastest possible method but it looks like the easiest, safest method to get a neatly lined dug well.

Floyd | 11-04-2007 03:07 PM
Re: TS hits TF - Got Water ? I'm stocking up on dehydrated water. :-)

Maddie | 11-04-2007 03:40 PM
Re: TS hits TF - Got Water ? The place we're planning to hole up has a well. If we end up bugging in, things could get iffy. We have more than a month of stored water here (50-gallon barrel, numerous 7-gallon containers, several 5-gallon carboys, and just plain 1-gallon water jugs and filled 2-liter bottles), but after that, we'd have to rely on the two large creeks that run through the neighborhood, the two retaining ponds, and our Berky. There's also a spring that bubbles up just onside our downhill-side fence that requires the neighbors to keep a sump pump running in their crawlspace in all but the driest seasons and to channel water into a cement-lined drainage ditch that runs behind all the houses. I'm sure we could tap into that, as it bubbles up only 10 feet from the fence.

Andy9999 | 11-04-2007 10:56 PM
Re: TS hits TF - Got Water ? 2 Attachment(s) My well ,it is 24 ft deep and give me approx 6 gallon per minute with both tanks I have 40 gallons storage capacity Did it myself:smokin: Well is operational for 2 years

Dave Thomas | 11-05-2007 01:58 AM
Re: TS hits TF - Got Water ? What about rainwater collection? It's probably too sparse for crops and farm watering, but for life saving drinking water it will probably suffice. (Provided you can sanitize it) Check it: http://builditsolar.com/Projects/Water/Water.htm

aeondaze | 11-05-2007 02:18 AM
Re: TS hits TF - Got Water ? Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Thomas (Post 812678) What about rainwater collection? It's probably too sparse for crops and farm watering, but for life saving drinking water it will probably suffice. (Provided you can sanitize it) Check it: http://builditsolar.com/Projects/Water/Water.htm
I'm trying to do this already and found that aquaponics is the most complete and water efficient way to grow fish and vegetables. The flood and drain cycle boosts absorption of oxygen by the roots and reduces the amount of water used at the same time increasing growth rates...:smokin: Two types of aerobic bacteria inhabit the grow bed media that oxidise the ammoniates into Nitrates... I think you could live off (barely) about 1000 gal rainwater tank, minimum...as long as you receive adequate rainfall and maybe a small garden with a lupins or chickpea crop, which could be used for fish meal...:smokin: theres tons of free nitrate around...:wink:

RiverRat | 11-05-2007 05:05 AM
Re: TS hits TF - Got Water ? 1 Attachment(s) :rolleyes_m: Update: You can roll your own foot (check) valve out of PVC like the pics or use one of these made from brass and bronze available from any hardware supplier locally. It's called a swing check valve Y The gate ( flap ) is internal and prevents backflow...just an internal version of the external tin can lid in the pics. Available in all pipe sizes 1/4" to 3"

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