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Barrettone | 06-30-2009 02:24 PM
Here's something to ponder... I have a buddy who cannot afford preps, as he has become unemployed. He went and applied for food stamps. They gave him a whopping $800/month for his family of five. He said he is very frugal with his food purchases, and it only costs $500 a month to feed everybody well for a month, so he is using the other $300 per month to stockpile canned goods, grains, etc. He even trades off with friends for things the stamps don't qualify for like medicines, PM,s, and ammo. I know we all despise anyone having to live off the government tit, but this guy has found a slick way to get his money BACK from the government!!! He was an upstanding self-employed business owner who paid all his bills and taxes until the Metro Detroit economy tanked. Now, he is underground, only working for cash, and grabbing any and all state assistance he can (utilities, mortgage, etc...). He said he paid all those years into our flawed system, and he is sick of everybody living off of his hard work, so he is gaming the system to his advantage. It's almost like an honest man can't earn a living anymore according to him. I always looked up to him as one of the most ethical people I know. I guess if he feels this way, maybe it isn't all wrong...opinions?

Canadian-guerilla | 06-30-2009 02:34 PM
Re: Here's something to ponder... Quote:
He said he paid all those years into our flawed system, and he is sick of everybody living off of his hard work, so he is gaming the system to his advantage
http://images4.cafepress.com/product...x350_Front.jpg like politicians voting themselves raises when the economy is tanking . . . GO FOR IT, he's feeding a family of five, COMING SOON, SURVIVAL, AT ALL COSTS

AOW | 06-30-2009 02:47 PM
Re: Here's something to ponder... Not paying into the system and even extracting resources from the system is surely the best way for someone to starve the beast.

I am me, I am free | 06-30-2009 02:56 PM
Re: Here's something to ponder... IMO, the only people who would fail to appreciate this are those who don't understand debt and credit, and how we lack lawful money for currency. Save for those who have PMs, we are a nation of paupers.

Twisted Avatar | 06-30-2009 03:03 PM
Re: Here's something to ponder... The man paid into the system his whole working life. Its about dam time he collected some of the benifits. I say Get it.........GET IT ALL. T

Shasta Gold | 06-30-2009 03:39 PM
Re: Here's something to ponder... Only a fool does not avail himself of every opportunity in this time of permanent & engineered crisis. If you're eligible, go for it!

Grad | 06-30-2009 04:29 PM
Re: Here's something to ponder... Quote:
Originally Posted by Barrettone (Post 1794218) It's almost like an honest man can't earn a living anymore according to him. I always looked up to him as one of the most ethical people I know. I guess if he feels this way, maybe it isn't all wrong...opinions?
congratulations you have discovered subtle (but dominant) force, shaping all systems in the matrix with the purpose of punishing honesty and morality

TechGuy | 06-30-2009 07:32 PM
Re: Here's something to ponder... I don't blame your friend at all, it is TSHTF for him right now. That being said, you see what entitlements do to society? "I have put this money in the system, so it is time for me to get mine, the gov OWES me this." How much better would it have been for society and for your friend if he were allowed to invest or save that money for all those years? Maybe he would have had enough money to actually keep his business and remain a productive contributing member of society.

Goldhedge | 06-30-2009 07:56 PM
Re: Here's something to ponder... It's your duty to pay your bills and on time... The policeman is your friend... "Our leaders are the finest men... and we elect them again and again..." Fool me once...shame on you, fool me twice...shame on me... Honest men finish last... Get yours while the getting is good....

ToBeSelfEvident | 06-30-2009 11:44 PM
Re: Here's something to ponder... If he can feed his family on $500 a month he's a miracle worker. He should be the Governer of Calif. instead of unemployed.

Barrettone | 07-01-2009 12:11 AM
Re: Here's something to ponder... Quote:
Originally Posted by ToBeSelfEvident (Post 1795341) If he can feed his family on $500 a month he's a miracle worker. He should be the Governer of Calif. instead of unemployed.
Says he buys rice, pasta and potatoes for starches (bulk), cases of cheap soup, and then buys burger, chicken, and pork. Makes good casseroles he says, and then he has a garden for veggies (a pretty balanced diet from what I can tell). Does his own canning and makes his own jams. They only drink Kool-Aid, Lemonade, iced tea, etc...NO POP OR FATTENING SNACKS, but they eat 3 solid meals a day. He said it is just about buying smartly. He definitely knows how to stretch a buck!!!

mightymanx | 07-01-2009 12:50 AM
Re: Here's something to ponder... What an outrage he should be buying Beer cigaretts and frozen pizzas he is not stimulating the economy. This frugality has got to go, it is runing the country he needs credit!!!! He should get a credit card and buy a big TV stop with this nutrition nonsense he and his family need to be obese and ill in the hospital to provide jobs Duuh!! :sarc::sarc::biggrin:

Saul Mine | 07-01-2009 02:22 AM
Re: Here's something to ponder... Honesty is the best policy, but only when you deal with honest people. In all other cases, the world is like weather: you take what you can use and stay out of the way of the rest. You don't argue with weather, and honesty does not apply.

sterling | 07-01-2009 02:27 AM
Re: Here's something to ponder... He's right though, if he's paid into the system for years there is no shame. They took his money by force, he should be able to get a return on his investment.

morganchaser | 07-01-2009 02:33 AM
Re: Here's something to ponder... Take the government for every penny you can get. I see no hypocrisy in it. We can help tear down unjust government by making it impossible to sustain.

luft97 | 07-01-2009 03:02 AM
Re: Here's something to ponder... Quote:
Originally Posted by Barrettone (Post 1794218) Now, he is underground, only working for cash, and grabbing any and all state assistance he can (utilities, mortgage, etc...).
I find it funny that all of you people here are applauding this guy ONLY because he paid into the system for however long. He is basically doing what the dope dealing inner city thugs do. Just because he is buying canned goods and preps instead of bling.. Just how much "Cash" does this guy bring in underground? It sounds like this is a choice not something that he could not get out of if he wanted to.

mightymanx | 07-01-2009 03:27 AM
Re: Here's something to ponder... Quote:
Originally Posted by luft97 (Post 1795626) I find it funny that all of you people here are applauding this guy ONLY(*1) because he paid into the system for however long. He is basically doing what the dope dealing inner city thugs do(*2). Just because he is buying canned goods and preps instead of bling.. Just how much "Cash" does this guy bring in underground? It sounds like this is a choice not something that he could not get out of if he wanted to.
*1. UMM... yea he paid in just like unemployment you pay for it you should use it if you need to. *2. So which IRS form do you declare your dope sales proffits on??

luft97 | 07-01-2009 03:35 AM
Re: Here's something to ponder... Quote:
Originally Posted by mightymanx (Post 1795639) *1. UMM... yea he paid in just like unemployment you pay for it you should use it if you need to. *2. So which IRS form do you declare your dope sales proffits on??
You left out *3. The guy is working for CASH ON THE SIDE defrauding the government.. Which form is he declaring that cash on the side on? So it sounds to me that he is trying to get all the benefits AND make cash on the side his regular thing. Correct me if I am wrong it was written to sound as if this guy COULD do something else and get off the welfare, but he is choosing this lifestyle... Quote:
this guy has found a slick way to get his money BACK from the government
Sorry if I don't jump for joy here.. I just can't applaud a guy for using the system.. So what he paid money at some point.. I'm sure the crack dealers worked and Burger King once too.. Does that justify it? You want applause owe the government taxes and tell em to stuff it then I'll applaud you.

sterling | 07-01-2009 03:35 AM
Re: Here's something to ponder... Quote:
Originally Posted by luft97 (Post 1795626) I find it funny that all of you people here are applauding this guy ONLY because he paid into the system for however long. He is basically doing what the dope dealing inner city thugs do. Just because he is buying canned goods and preps instead of bling.. Just how much "Cash" does this guy bring in underground? It sounds like this is a choice not something that he could not get out of if he wanted to.
Difference is he has paid into the system. They took HIS money. Now he's getting it back. I'm sure he would rather not be in this situation but had he been allowed to keep HIS money maybe things would be different. If the "dope dealing inner city thugs" pay into the system then they should be entitled to get that money back also. If your money is taken by force then all options are allowed for getting it back. It's not the government's money it was his all along.

Shasta Gold | 07-01-2009 03:35 AM
Re: Here's something to ponder... SNAP (formerly Food Stamps) screening tool: http://www.snap-step1.usda.gov/fns/

Shasta Gold | 07-01-2009 03:38 AM
Re: Here's something to ponder... Quote:
Originally Posted by luft97 (Post 1795647) defrauding the government
:haha: OMG! That's like "defrauding" the Mafia or "defrauding" the Federal Reserve or "defrauding" Bernie Madoff!

luft97 | 07-01-2009 03:45 AM
Re: Here's something to ponder... Quote:
Originally Posted by Shasta Gold (Post 1795650) :haha: OMG! That's like "defrauding" the Mafia or "defrauding" the Federal Reserve or "defrauding" Bernie Madoff!
Laugh all you like.. If he is stooping to that level just because he can, he is no better than the minorities that do the same.. I would never put myself on welfare to get my money back and work for cash on the side.. I don't need to scheme to get my money back. It has something to do with integrity.. You wanna be a real man tell the govt to step off your not gonna give em anything.. Instead you live like a worm off of the government teet that you paid into.. :thumpdown

Shasta Gold | 07-01-2009 03:51 AM
Re: Here's something to ponder... Quote:
Originally Posted by luft97 (Post 1795654) Laugh all you like.
Oh, I am. The absurdity of the concept of "defrauding" the greatest fraud and collection of fraudsters in human history is hilarious.

luft97 | 07-01-2009 03:58 AM
Re: Here's something to ponder... Let me break this down for you people as to WHY I have a problem with this.. Ok someone loses thier job or business.. Fine welfare was made for this situation. I don't agree with it, but that was the intended use. BT said: Quote:
They gave him a whopping $800/month for his family of five. He said he is very frugal with his food purchases, and it only costs $500 a month to feed everybody well for a month, so he is using the other $300 per month to stockpile canned goods, grains, etc. He even trades off with friends for things the stamps don't qualify for like medicines, PM,s, and ammo.
Ok so if you only read it that far fine.. maybe you could say cool the guy is just trying to get by. but then if you read a little further: Quote:
...but this guy has found a slick way to get his money BACK from the government... Now, he is underground, only working for cash, and grabbing any and all state assistance he can (utilities, mortgage, etc...). He said he paid all those years into our flawed system, and he is sick of everybody living off of his hard work, so he is gaming the system to his advantage.
Sounds like the pimps and crack dealers to me.. Quote:
It's almost like an honest man can't earn a living anymore according to him.
I dunno about you but I can earn an honest living just fine.. It sounds like this guy could too except he is choosing to take advantage of a corrupt system. Sorry but cheating to "Win" has no honor..

oz in sc | 07-01-2009 09:43 AM
Re: Here's something to ponder... Using what is offered by the fedgov. is fine to me...especially when you are formerly one of those who paid into the system. When you have never paid into the system is where I see a problem. I hope when we get to our place in NC we get to use every available gov't handout possible....all the while growing our own food and trading and bartering and yes getting paid cash for stuff.

Saul Mine | 07-01-2009 10:13 AM
Re: Here's something to ponder... You folks are all confusing morality with honesty. People accepting money they don't deserve from the government are not a problem. The problem is the government giving away public funds.

GOLD DUCK | 07-01-2009 10:15 AM
Re: Here's something to ponder... QWAK,When YOU become DISABLED and have NO OTHER viable alternitives the CHOICE becomes OBVIOUS!:thinkey::yes: Been THERE done THAT and YES it WORKS!:yes: Back in the late 90s I managed to SAVE up a fiew K$$$ that way and when every one was trying to get RICH buying high tech stocks and E-TRAID and others offered $200.00 for opening an account WITH a money market account that payed 5% intrist on the $$$ in the account, I opened as many as I could!:yes: I read and understood the fine print SOoooooooooo :wink: after a month I would take out the $2000.00 by check and open another account with THEM or another broker doing the SAME!:yes: At the end of 6 months (the fine print agreement) I would close the account!:yes::111::4_1_72::shine: I had my original 2K plus the 5% intrist on both my $2000.00 and the $200.00 they put in and NEVER bought any stocks SOooooo never payed brokerage fees!:452::452::452::yes::4_1_72: Then in 2000 used ALL that $$$ to buy physical GOLD @ $257.00 :thinkey::23_30_104: When GOLD was just under $400.00 the CREDIT CARD companies offered ZERO INTRIST for 12 months and I maxed out a credit card and bought MORE physical GOLD!:yes::yes::yes: When SILVER was just under $7.00 the CREDIT CARD companies offered 4% intrist for 12 months :wink::yes::yes::yes: I maxed out TWO credit cards and bought SILVER -- in less than 9 months SILVER went over $15.00 :23_30_104::yes::yes::yes::shine: I did NOT get RICH and will never be what most people concider RICH but I will NEVER be POOR or DESTITUE EITHER!:452::thinkey: This DUCK is NO FOOL :452::111::4_1_72::shine: IF you play there CORRUPTED riged game YOU will LOSE -- that is what THEY want and INTEND -- DON'T play THERE GAME!:452: the DUCK :15_1_70v:

Twisted Avatar | 07-01-2009 10:16 AM
Re: Here's something to ponder... Quote:
Originally Posted by luft97 (Post 1795647) You left out *3. The guy is working for CASH ON THE SIDE defrauding the government.. Which form is he declaring that cash on the side on? So it sounds to me that he is trying to get all the benefits AND make cash on the side his regular thing.
So I guess everytime you have a garage sale or sell something "on the side" when the end of the year rolls around you dilligently request the accountant provide a extra form so you can pay taxes on those gains right?? You lead by example and always pay "your fair share" when a sale is made. Right??? T

NotTheOne | 07-01-2009 10:30 AM
Re: Here's something to ponder... "He can feed his family on $500 a month." Quote:
Originally Posted by Barrettone (Post 1795387) Says he buys rice, pasta and potatoes for starches (bulk), cases of cheap soup, and then buys burger, chicken, and pork. Makes good casseroles he says, and then he has a garden for veggies (a pretty balanced diet from what I can tell). Does his own canning and makes his own jams. They only drink Kool-Aid, Lemonade, iced tea, etc...NO POP OR FATTENING SNACKS, but they eat 3 solid meals a day. He said it is just about buying smartly. He definitely knows how to stretch a buck!!!
I think my wife could teach him a thing or two. She's a master (mistress?) coupon shopper. She carries an envelope of coupons in her purse where ever she goes. If it's not on sale she doesn't buy it. If it's not "double coupon" time at the supermarket, she doesn't buy it. If she wants something, she waits for it to come on sale.....then she sees if she has a coupon for it too. She never pays for toothpaste, shampoo, soap and a few others. A combination of sale and coupons make the item free. Yes, it's a bit of work, but she enjoys doing it.

luft97 | 07-01-2009 12:02 PM
Re: Here's something to ponder... Quote:
Originally Posted by Twisted Avatar (Post 1795946) So I guess everytime you have a garage sale or sell something "on the side" when the end of the year rolls around you dilligently request the accountant provide a extra form so you can pay taxes on those gains right?? You lead by example and always pay "your fair share" when a sale is made. Right??? T
No I don't.. But I was making a point to the guy who was asking which IRS form do the crack dealers declare the dope on. Don't give your money to the government. It is yours after all..

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- - Here's something to ponder... (http://goldismoney.info/forums/showthread.php?t=387344)

Twisted Avatar | 07-01-2009 12:15 PM
Re: Here's something to ponder... Quote:
Originally Posted by luft97 (Post 1796137) No I don't.. But I was making a point to the guy who was asking which IRS form do the crack dealers declare the dope on. Don't give your money to the government. It is yours after all..
But Majority of us have been trained(since birth) that we are suppose to pay taxes and it is only in the 11th hour that we come to understand just what the collect of taxes are (payment to the fricken Ghoul of England and the inbred Pedophile Rothchild clan for a debt you and I NEVER incurred ) But to make sure the majority never dig that deep they toss a handful of crumbs off the table called "social services" and that has done a fine job of keeping the masses quelled and ignorant of the massive theft that has faithfully occured every week of there working lives So if a person has any means and I means ANY MEANS of recouping a small portion of what has been stolen from them IT IS ONLY RIGHT THAT THEY SHOULD EXPLOIT THAT AVENUE FOR MAXIMUM BENEFIT. Its only "fair" T

jaybone | 07-01-2009 12:19 PM
Re: Here's something to ponder... Quote:
Originally Posted by I am me, I am free (Post 1794271) IMO, the only people who would fail to appreciate this are those who don't understand debt and credit, and how we lack lawful money for currency. Save for those who have PMs, we are a nation of paupers.
the only one really being harmed is the grocer who gives valuable foodstuffs in exchange for the ghost of money. My GF asked if I would refuse to take UI on principle, My take is, if I am forced to take part in this loathsome game, then I am going to be the best player that I can be.

Barrettone | 07-01-2009 01:58 PM
Re: Here's something to ponder... Quote:
Originally Posted by jaybone (Post 1796174) My GF asked if I would refuse to take UI on principle, My take is, if I am forced to take part in this loathsome game, then I am going to be the best player that I can be.
Here, here!!!! This was exactly his point. He could no longer afford to play by the governments rules. He was priced out via exorbitant general liability insurance, workmen's compensation, and state and federal taxes. He said, he could no longer do business in an honest fashion as the rules of the game had been slanted so much in the governments/big business (read: banks and insurance companies) favor. Construction is a tough enough and competitive enough business WITHOUT all the pickpockets he said he was experiencing. luft97 said: "You want applause owe the government taxes and tell em to stuff it then I'll applaud you." He has now been relegated to working cash as the IRS has him in hock so bad with a debt load he couldn't sustain. So, luft97 I guess you get your wish...he has a large tax bill and IS TELLING THE GOVERNMENT TO STUFF IT!!! Does this change your opinion of him??? The more I read here, the more I am coming to appreciate his choice...

GOLD DUCK | 07-01-2009 02:47 PM
Re: Here's something to ponder... QWAK,Yesterday I went in to town to get a tire on my Tahoe repaired,I had picked up a nail and when I bought a full set of new tires about two years ago they came with a "FREE" life time repair for punctures!:23_30_104::23_30_104: The place had been there LONG befor I bought my property in 81 but I kept looking for the sign and did not see it.:dontknow: Drove passed the location 3 times! Shortly after I bought my tires the STATE shut them down and one morning when the workers arived they found all the doors CHAINED and LOCKED and ORANGE stickers from the STATE TAX department sealing the doors!:favorites21::censored: Aparently they had been collecting state sales tax but NOT sending all of it on to the government.:36_1_30: There were coustemers cars and trucks locked up inside and it took ove a weak to get them out!:rant::censored: Today it is a LADIES DAY SPA :yes::111::4_1_72::shine: Don't even look like the old dirty tire store with 4 bays and hydrolic lifts. Looks SOoooooooooo diferent that is why I drove passed 3 times!:confused_ma::yes: Cost me $18.00 to get the nail pulled and a patch on the inside!:rant::censored: The SYSTEM is IMPLODING -- been happening for several years but NOW it is happening FASTER and becoming SOoooooooo OBVIOUS no one can ignore the reality that WE are IN a DEPRESSION and it WILL get a lot worse befor it gets even a little bit better! PS: My fire wood guy just called wanting to know if I wanted to buy my fire wood EARLY this year:questionm:questionm -- I usualy buy in late Oct or early Nov. and hope he will deliver befor the snow and cold rain comes. Got Red Oak and Hickory and even some cherry too:s1: NOT the junk that burns fast with low BTUs like he often mixed in -- same price but better quality IF I buy NOW! :yes::yes: He knows I pay on delivery and MY checks have NEVER BOUNCED unlike many of his other customers have.:s1: the DUCK

Ash_Williams | 07-01-2009 03:21 PM
Re: Here's something to ponder... Hey duck you know you can buy that kit to plug your tires for about $12? Fast and easy. As for the OP... when you're dealing with crooks, you don't win by being straight.

GOLD DUCK | 07-01-2009 03:37 PM
Re: Here's something to ponder... Quote:
Originally Posted by Ash_Williams (Post 1796449) Hey duck you know you can buy that kit to plug your tires for about $12? Fast and easy. As for the OP... when you're dealing with crooks, you don't win by being straight.
QWAK,Ash_Williams,I have a plug kit but the glue dried up long ago. PLUS a plug in a radial tire can FAIL. Back when I was a kid I fixed tires in a gas station as part of my job. (1969) A patch inside NEVER FAILS:452: It is a 30 mile run in to town so I pumped up the tire to 50 PSI and headed in and did not want to drive around with the nail (a DRY WALL SCREW as it turned out) I Could have put " Stop leak GOOE" in too but it makes a MESS if you ever do replace the tire BUT will work in a pinch IF the hole is not too big. When I was doing it as a kid the price was $2.50 to fix a flat with a patch, NOW the TAX was almost $2.00!!:confused_ma::10_1_19: ADDITION: Was rereading this thread and failed to mention that because of all the bond issues and previous screw ups on projects to GROW Fayetteville Ark. ALL goods and services in the city are taxed at 10% -- another reason I hate going to town!!! the DUCK :15_1_70v:

Eyebone | 07-02-2009 11:46 AM
Re: Here's something to ponder... Quote:
Originally Posted by luft97 (Post 1795654) Laugh all you like.. If he is stooping to that level just because he can, he is no better than the minorities that do the same.. I would never put myself on welfare to get my money back and work for cash on the side.. I don't need to scheme to get my money back. It has something to do with integrity.. You wanna be a real man tell the govt to step off your not gonna give em anything.. Instead you live like a worm off of the government teet that you paid into.. :thumpdown
Wait, who said he wasn't a minority? Oops I think your raceschmizm (my schmelling) is showing.

luft97 | 07-02-2009 11:48 AM
Re: Here's something to ponder... Quote:
Originally Posted by Eyebone (Post 1797725) Wait, who said he wasn't a minority? Oops I think your raceschmizm (my schmelling) is showing.
Is it? Glad the sock puppets are noticing. :15_1_70v:

Eyebone | 07-02-2009 11:53 AM
Re: Here's something to ponder... I apologize for my last post, it was trollish. I just have a sometimes uncontrollable urge to attack the self righteous. As far as the fellow on food stamps, good on him, the system needs to be torn down by any means possible.

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