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serj | 10-16-2008 09:34 PM
Does firewood cost money to burn? I've read that burning firewood in an open fireplace consumes so much of the oxygen in the air that it ends up raising your heating bill. Is this true? From my understanding it lowers the temperatures of the other rooms where it pulls oxygen in from. But if your house was sealed properly would this still be a problem? There are inserts but i want to burn wood i cut from outdoors. In the end doesn't it just mean you sleep closer to the fireplace for warmth?

damoc | 10-16-2008 10:10 PM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? Ive got a fairly small fireplace and not open but the warmth i get from it is so much better than propane heat or electrical heat by a factor of 10. it does tend to heat the main living room area (where it is located)better than the rest of the house. but this can be improved by fans and leaving doors open to other areas of the house. i think a few "cracks" in a wood heat home are a good thing i think the way it was expplained to me is that wood heat is radiant heat not just heated air as in propane.

StrawMan=Corporation | 10-16-2008 10:13 PM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? House from Claymation ? Or a set out of Planet of the Apes ? http://ilovecob.com/wp-content/files/homestove.jpg

TechGuy | 10-16-2008 10:22 PM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? It really depends on what you are burning the wood with. Woodstove= very efficient, high radiant heat factor. Recirculating gas wood stoves are VERY efficient and clean burning. Masonry fireplace= not bad once heat builds up in masonry and radiats heat out. Good amount of heat is sucked out of chimney Pre-fab fireplace= If this is the normal pre-fab, they are for looks only and do little more than burn your wood and suck your warm inside air to the outside. There are SOME models built specifially for heating, results may vary. My favorite: Masonry fireplace with air circulating heat pipes. Will run you out of the house, and looks nice to boot. Hard to find someone that knows how to build correctly. Confused?

rad | 10-16-2008 10:30 PM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? http://hearth.com/what/more/skip.html

Maxine | 10-16-2008 10:40 PM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? Quote:
Originally Posted by TechGuy (Post 1363605) It really depends on what you are burning the wood with. Woodstove= very efficient, high radiant heat factor. Recirculating gas wood stoves are VERY efficient and clean burning. Masonry fireplace= not bad once heat builds up in masonry and radiats heat out. Good amount of heat is sucked out of chimney Pre-fab fireplace= If this is the normal pre-fab, they are for looks only and do little more than burn your wood and suck your warm inside air to the outside. There are SOME models built specifially for heating, results may vary. My favorite: Masonry fireplace with air circulating heat pipes. Will run you out of the house, and looks nice to boot. Hard to find someone that knows how to build correctly. Confused?
This is the right answer! Listen to Tech Guy.

SLV>GLD | 10-16-2008 11:32 PM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? I'll second tech-guy. I met a man who had built a truly impressive clone of a Swedish fireplace. This type of fireplace is a confluence of the chimney. By design, specific parts of the exterior exhibit various temperature ranges.The thing basically smouldered wood and the heat was piped through a very long amount of interior piping. The floor level had an oven attached and a stove type area that water could be boiled on, for example. The upper level functioned as a room heater much like the lower level. I remember it was unbelievably wood efficient. The mosaic tilework adornment was particularly breathtaking. The house had been built around this structure.

Between The Wheels | 10-16-2008 11:40 PM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? http://www.grannysstore.com/Do-It-Yo...nry_stoves.htm I bought this book because of the masonry stove plans in it. Not as pretty or pricey as the pro-built stuff but I think one of these would be functional, if harder to equip with oven/stove. Free plans here: http://dnr.mo.gov/pubs/pub781.pdf http://www.geocities.com/RainForest/...sonry/nav.html

mick silver | 10-16-2008 11:41 PM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? nope i have no cost in my wood , i look for iy after stroms , it already cut , all i do is haul it home and store it , 14 cores this year put up , pay for my wood stove the first year with the money i saved on not heatinng my house with nat gas and elec , plus we cook on it , it cool here tonight down to 40 , just started a fire , dam it feels so good

BellevueBully | 10-16-2008 11:47 PM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? Basic physics friend. Heat rises up the chimney. Out going air creates low pressure zone in front of the open hearth. The outgoing air, which must be replaced in the burn zone, is made up from the newly conditioned warm air in the room. I don't know the numbers, but I would suspect the overall velocity and volume of the highly heated gasses exiting the chimney far outweigh the volume and velocity of the radiant heat resulting in large inefficiency. Don't listen to me.......it took me 4 times to pass grade twelve math. High five.

mick silver | 10-16-2008 11:52 PM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? my mom fire place has a fire box in it , in the box there are fans the push out the heat , before we put that in the heat went up the chimney

striped_bear | 10-17-2008 12:05 AM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? Some great info here. Check out rocket stoves/mass heaters: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rocket_stove http://www.rocketstoves.com/ http://ilovecob.com/wp-content/files/homestove.jpg

BellevueBully | 10-17-2008 12:05 AM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? Quote:
Originally Posted by mick silver (Post 1363740) my mom fire place has a fire box in it , in the box there are fans the push out the heat , before we put that in the heat went up the chimney
Mick, I love your avatar bro. But I think you can't get away from the heat going up the chimney. You may be able to improve it by slipstreaming some of the hot air en route up the chimney back into the room through vents in the shell of the flue, but short of that, any heat you can scab off the burn area is small compared to what goes up the stack. Like I said, there is a lot of velocity. Think of how quickly and forcefully light ash will come off a bonfire. It gives a bit of an idea of what I'm getting at. (I thought they said 'what goes up, must come down. Maybe they were wrong:)

BellevueBully | 10-17-2008 12:09 AM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? Quote:
Originally Posted by striped_bear (Post 1363767) Some great info here. Check out rocket stoves/mass heaters: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rocket_stove http://www.rocketstoves.com/ http://ilovecob.com/wp-content/files/homestove.jpg
Whoa!!! Thaaat's cool.

nub | 10-17-2008 12:24 AM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? Quote:
Originally Posted by serj (Post 1363485) I've read that burning firewood in an open fireplace consumes so much of the oxygen in the air that it ends up raising your heating bill. Is this true? From my understanding it lowers the temperatures of the other rooms where it pulls oxygen in from. But if your house was sealed properly would this still be a problem? There are inserts but i want to burn wood i cut from outdoors. In the end doesn't it just mean you sleep closer to the fireplace for warmth?
Serj, to answer your original question, I've always suggested to people that they open up the little cast iron ash clean out door on the exterior of their house (if there is one ).this is located at the bottom of the chimney , just open it while the fire is burning so the fire can breath, that way you don't have to open a window and pull a cold draft through the house. still the ole open fire place is a huge waste of heat but who cares if wood , labor/cost isn't an issue.....it's an issue for me, my back isn't getting any younger. I'm a big fan of the "Magic Heat" and swear by them, one of these added to the flue of a free standing wood stove makes a huge difference in effientcey

mick silver | 10-17-2008 12:31 AM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? yes i know you well loss some heat , but a open fire place you loss 85% ,a stove installer told me

mick silver | 10-17-2008 12:35 AM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? i added this to my stove it works GREAT , you well not believe the heat that well come out of this http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/w...ECLAIMER101508

nub | 10-17-2008 12:42 AM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? Quote:
Originally Posted by mick silver (Post 1363817) i added this to my stove it works GREAT , you well not believe the heat that well come out of this http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/w...ECLAIMER101508
Mick that's what I'm talking about at the end of my post, bought mine at northern tool also ( used to be Northern Hydraulics), I've been using them for 20+ years I swear by them.

mick silver | 10-17-2008 12:42 AM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? i got this 3 years ago it well take a lot of the heat you are losing out of your flu pipe , you can add it 12 to 16 off of the stove , i went with the 12 inch off , you burn less wood and get twice the heat from it , it well pay for it self , it come on at 120 temp and cut off after the fire drop below that yes i see that nub it works great , i just made a link to it so some of the guys may want to add this to there stove it works http://www.northerntool.com/webapp/w...ECLAIMER101508

nub | 10-17-2008 12:51 AM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? Quote:
Originally Posted by mick silver (Post 1363832) i got this 3 years ago it well take a lot of the heat you are losing out of your flu pipe , you can add it 12 to 16 off of the stove , i went with the 12 inch off , you burn less wood and get twice the heat from it , it well pay for it self , it come on at 120 temp and cut off after the fire drop below that
Mick you should keep them a minimum of 24" (36" is better) from flue connection to the stove......extreme heat can burn out heat exchanger, not saying you can't go closer but if your burning real hot fires you'll shorten the life span of the exchanger......the one in my new house is less than 24" LOL and it's about 5 yrs old , if I make some new flue pipe I'll raise it up, I own a sheet metal shop so I make the pipe when and if needed

mick silver | 10-17-2008 12:59 AM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? was was told be the company that make it 12 to 16 inch for best heat off the flu , when i got mine all the wire were losse they sent me out all new guts for it , so , o just wire up the one that was in it , keep the new stuff for a spare , i lose my elec for 3 day and it didnt hurt it , i was lucky

nub | 10-17-2008 01:21 AM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? Quote:
Originally Posted by mick silver (Post 1363857) was was told be the company that make it 12 to 16 inch for best heat off the flu , when i got mine all the wire were losse they sent me out all new guts for it , so , o just wire up the one that was in it , keep the new stuff for a spare , i lose my elec for 3 day and it didnt hurt it , i was lucky
. They used to say in their install manual to keep them higher than that...who knows....who cares Hahaha Mick one reason to keep it lower would be to have the heat enter the room at less altitude cuz heat rises ( one reason to keep it low). Any heat that would be lost before entering the MH at say 24" or so would be transfered to the conditioned space and it helps to keep flames from licking the exchanger before dampened down the flue ,thus shorting the life span. Mick if it was a heavy stainless heat exchanger I wouldn't worry about it at all, but they are not.......I've rebuilt many wood stoves over the years I know where they burn out. Just be aware of it I'm sure you'll have no problems...like I said mine isn't 24" but I keep an eye on it. Stay warm Mick...:36_1_63: :coolbeer:

Squirrel Bait | 10-17-2008 01:22 AM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? I put a wood stove insert into a masonry fireplace about 20 years ago. The difference was unbelievable. I think I used about $300 in propane that year to heat the house. I now have two woodstoves in this house. One in the basement and a nicer one on the main level. Wood is free for the work. I don't mind keeping the house a little extra warm. sb

BellevueBully | 10-17-2008 01:41 AM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? Mick/Nub That stack fan is great. Thanks for links. Good thread.

Saul Mine | 10-17-2008 02:12 AM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? The Forgotten Art of Building a Good Fireplace by Vrest Orton Amazon This is a wonderful little book based on writings of Ben Franklin and Count Rumford. It tells you in simple terms what makes a good fire place and why it works that way. It also mentions common mistakes in bad fire places and why they don't work right. If you have or want to have a fire place you need this book. To answer your question, each fire place should have an air inlet for the reasons you mention. And also a way to close the inlet.

Lackluster | 10-17-2008 06:59 AM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? Open fireplaces are extremely inefficient compared to wood stoves. There is no way to meter the air to the fire, and most heat does go straight up the chimbley. A fire in an open fireplace will draw cold air into the whole house. Ironically, If you have a conventional, open fireplace running, your furnace will run more, because of all the cold air being sucked in the house. Interestingly, English settlers in New England came from a mild climate, and were accustomed to using fireplaces, and so built them in their homes. They burned vast amounts of firewood in their new, colder climate. Procuring firewood took up a lot of their time. German settlers, in Pennsylvania, knew about woodstoves, and used them. They were able to spend much less time making firewood, and were much more industrious as a result.

Lt Dan | 10-17-2008 07:25 AM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? 1 Attachment(s) Central Boiler heats my home and as a bonus it heats my hot water as well as my sons house all for the labor involved with cutting some firewood. It sets outside and the only mess in the house comes in on me or my shoes after loading it. I load 1-3 times a day depending on the weather.

GOLD DUCK | 10-17-2008 08:43 AM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? QWAK,Been heating now for over 20 years with wood. It is dirty and messey but cheep. The cabin had a small open fire place when I bought the place -- looked nice but damn near froze to death one very cold winter and was up every two hours feeding the fire!:36_1_28: Got a free standing wood stove after that with a built in blower and heat exchanger WAY better but still dirty and a hastel but CHEEP!:yes: I recently ordered and had delivered a wood fired water water boiler to heat my DUCK POND (HOT TUB) and hopfully suply most of the heat for my green house bath.:565: http://www.lehmans.com/shopping/prod...d=water+heater Yesterday I ordered all the stove pipe to hook it up. NOTE: Do your reaserch lots of diferent kinds and prices and it is a hastel replacing the old rusted out cheep stuff not to mention FIRE DANGER and posable carbon monoxide killing you wile you sleep. GET a carbon monoxide detector alarm!:yes: I also ordered a "HEAT RECLAMOR" this is the one I ordered: http://www.northlineexpress.com/item...p?ic=5NC-MH-6R They have two diferent ones and I had the cheeper one but the stove pipe rusted out so I ordered the new one for the new boiler. NOTE: Stove pipe aint cheep but the better pipe is cheeper in the long run because you don't have to replace it as often! :s1::yes: I will also have propaine radient heat as a back up with a thermostat so if I am away pipes and DUCK POND don't freez!:wink: the DUCK

Russkie | 10-17-2008 09:06 AM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? http://www.russia-ic.com/culture_art/traditions/658/ Russian Stove January 11, 2008 The stove was man�s unfailing helpmate in the olden days. The so-called �Russian stove� is a brick masonry heater, which is perhaps the most efficient and environment-friendly of all wood burning fireplaces ever invented by man. Throughout many centuries Russian stoves were used both for cooking meals, baking bread and pies, drying grains, mushrooms, and roots and for heating and drying the house in winter and autumn. Usually the stove is located in the centre of izba (peasant�s log hut). The traditionally big Russian stove keeps heat for quite a long time, and thus requires fueling it only twice a day. Such a stove has several (usually two) draught preventers. The smoke circulates through a complex labyrinth of pathways inside the stove and thus heats a great many bricks. To prolong the cooling down process, a horizontal flue is necessary: it is laid down in the attic, and is sometimes also used as a smoking chamber. Stove setters always enjoyed respect of the community as the art of stove-setting was of vital importance. An ill-set stove is very difficult to repair (reset), a bad stove smokes a lot and does not keep heat well, thus demanding overuse of burning wood. There is a number of constructions of the Russian stove; there is, for instance, a version with two hearths, one of which is used mainly for quick cooking, whereas the other one for heating the house in wintertime. Cooking on the Russian stove makes food very tasty. Porridge, pies or pancakes made in such a hearth greatly differ in taste from the same dishes cooked through one-way heating, like that characteristic of a gas stove. The cooking process on the Russian stove is peculiar for an even heat area kept for a long time and could be called �simmering� or �soaking�. This is why certain dishes, such as baked milk, pearl barley porridge with mushrooms, potato or mushrooms in sour cream, etc. cannot be cooked in line with their authentic taste in different conditions. Bread is put into the stove and taken out of it with the help of a special wooden spade with a long handle. Iron pots with soup, porridge or milk are taken out with a special fork � a metal semicircular Y-shaped stick on a long handle. The Russian stove was not only a heater and a cooker, but also a doctor, healing the family folks from any colds. Moreover, it provided a perfect sleeping nook: the plank bed, arranged between the stove and a wall, just beneath the ceiling, gained plenty of warm air (which always ascends, following the law of physics). If necessary the Russian stove could even well replace a steam bath. It was done in the following way: the stove was fuelled to a very high temperature and when it got a little cooler, coals and food were removed out of it; then the bather would lie on a special wooden plank and be pushed right into the glowing throat of the stove. The walls of the stove would be splashed with water or diluted kvas to arouse dense �bread� vapor. Afterwards the hearth entrance would be tightly closed with a stove door, leaving the bather inside of it to sweat very well. (Read more about Russian steam bath) The Russian stove, being a most significant element of household, often turned into a folk personage, which can be found, in particular, in folk tales. Many good guys of Russian wonder tales are fond of sitting or lying on the stove. Thus, the epic strongman Ilya Muromets spends 33 years of his life lying on the stove before he takes to various feats, whereas another tale hero, Yemelia, unwilling to leave his warm stove bench, drives the stove as if it were a comfy car. Same love of the stove is inherent in Baba Yaga, the evil witch who uses it in her attempts to fry the kidnapped children or lost heroes. The Russian stove is often endowed with human features, such as speaking, feeling and thinking ability, like, for example, in the tale Geese and Swans : a girl looking for her lost brother comes across a stove standing in the open field and asks for its advice. The stove treats her with pies, and afterwards, on her way back, hides the girl inside it, saving her from chase. The last picture: Russian Stove in the classical animated cartoon film Vovka v Tridevyatom tsarstve (Vovka in Far Far Away Kingdom) (1965).

Russkie | 10-17-2008 09:16 AM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? 2 Attachment(s) Another excellent way to heat a room is to have a big samovar (samo-varit; self-boiler) on a table in a room. You have a few gallons of hot water always available. The samovar, radiates heat throughout the room, and offsets any loss of humidity. Scoop out coals from the fireplace, and you can diversify the heat soures in your living space. This is from Wikipedia: Description Samovars come in different body shapes: urn- or krater-shaped, barrel, cylindric, spherical. A traditional samovar consists of a large metal container with a faucet near the bottom and a metal pipe running vertically through the middle. The pipe is filled with solid fuel to heat the water in the surrounding container. A small (6 to 8 inches) smoke-stack is put on the top to ensure draft. After the fire is off a teapot could be placed on top to be kept heated with the passing hot air. The teapot is used to brew the заварка (zavarka), a strong concentrate of tea. The tea is served by diluting this concentrate with (кипяток) kipyatok (boiled water) from the main container, usually at a ratio of about 10 parts water to one part tea concentrate, although tastes vary. It is particularly well-suited to tea-drinking in a communal setting over a protracted period. The Russian expression "to have a sit by samovar" means to have a leisurely talk while drinking tea from samovar. This compares with the Japanese tea ceremony, but only superficially. In everyday use it was an economical permanent source of hot water in older times. Various slow-burning items could be used for fuel, such as charcoal or dry pinecones. When not in use, the fire in the samovar pipe was faintly smouldering. When necessary, it was quickly rekindled with the help of bellows. Although a Russian jackboot сапог (sapog) could be used for this purpose, there were bellows manufactured specifically for use on samovars. A Late Classical samovar, ca 1840-50, depicted on a 1989 USSR postage stampThe samovar was an important attribute of a Russian household. Sizes and designs varied, from "40-pail" ones of 400 litres (100 US gallons) to 1 litre (1 US quart) size, from cylindrical to spherical, from plain iron to polished brass to gilt.

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JJ_ | 10-17-2008 09:25 AM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? Russkie- that was facinating.. read about the banya too... interesting

Russkie | 10-17-2008 09:30 AM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? I can't find any articles on this, but cooking is done in these stoves in clay vases called "garshochka". The vase is larger at the top, so you can handle it with a forked stick in and out of the oven. Small vases about the size of three coffee cups would hold one portion of food. Put meat, veggies, mushrooms, cheese, sour cream, potatoes, or any combination of the above into the pot, covered by its small lid. Put as many pots as you have people into the stove, then just forget about them. When its time to eat, take out the pots with wooden forks, and set them on the table. Everyone eats directly out of their own pot. This is really efficient, because there's hardly any dishes to do, the warm clay pot keeps the food warm as you eat it (you can hold the pot in your hands too, which warms them), and no extra heat is generated or wasted in the proccess of cooking. Anything you would cook in a slow-cooker or dutch oven is good with this method. any soups, stews, porridge, roast or casserole recipies are good with it too, you just need the right size pot. All natural cooking container- no plastic, aluminum BS. I had a chance to visit a family-owned workshop where they make them in a provincial town three hours from Moscow. They do everything from digging the clay at the riverbank, turning it on a foot-powered wheel, firing them, etc. I cook with them all the time. I personally pioneered the art of using them to make lasagna!

Russkie | 10-17-2008 09:38 AM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? 1 Attachment(s) JJ, glad you liked the info. My best friend here has a banya on the shore of a pond in his village, and after we sweat we jump into the water in a hole in the ice, even in the middle of winter. Banya is VERY healthy, and you feel like a million roubles afterwards. I'm 25% Finnish (from Michigan's UP) so it was something I was already familiar with. Banya is my religion!!! One more thing before I forget- I've learned alot about heating houses while living in Russia. In the upper right-hand corner of the window, they have something called a 'fortochka'. This is a small, 1ft. sq. window which can be opened at the top of the window. When the room gets too stuffy and you need fresh air, crack the fortochka open for five minutes, the room cools off, fresh air, and no drafts around the feet of the children. Here's a small picture, so you get the basic idea. Russians always use double pane windows.

Russkie | 10-17-2008 10:10 AM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? 3 Attachment(s) www.r2controls.com/energyop.htm "In 1980 we built a Russian stove as our main heat source. It seemed like a bit of a gamble at the time, but it has proven safe, clean, and efficient. This design was imported from Northern Russia. Legend has it they heated on a handful of sticks every day, and slept next to the stove. My installation is in my kitchen and extends so that it heats the tile floor in the bathroom above. This is very popular in the winter. We kept the house as warm as we like it, and only used 2 cords of hardwood per year, lighting the stove once per day for only about 1 hour."

Lackluster | 10-17-2008 10:21 AM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? One question I have about the Russian masonry stoves is this: Is there a lot of creosote buildup in the brick labryinth? I always thought that as smoke cooled, the creosote wouls condense on to the masonry. Is there a possibility of a 'chimney fire' inside of the stove? I know using seasoned wood would help, but still there must be some soot build up inside there.

nub | 10-17-2008 10:22 AM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? I almost built a masonry heater in my present home but money became an issue (we built our home out of pocket) it was the exact same design as what you show.In essence an MH is a BIG masonry structure that contains a very convoluted smoke passage that usually goes up and down a few times, and a relatively small, tightly sealed firebox, with a generous but carefully controlled airflow. They must be fairly centrally located in a structure, and do best with very open floor plans. It is not uncommon for them to incorporate a large cook oven suitable for breads, roasting, pizzas and the sort - a traditional “brick oven” IOW. They can also incorporate heat exchangers for radiant floor heating (in a bathroom for instance) and / or domestic hot water pre-heating, done right they are quite costly. I wish now we would have spent the extra money, although what I have now works very well.

BellevueBully | 10-17-2008 10:23 AM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? Russkie, It's a little hard to tell from the drawing, but is the principle based on running the flue gas thru a set of baffles to keep the heat available to be captured by the exterior brick before escaping up the chimney?? A friend of mine has an old wood stove with a set of baffles at the back of the firebox. Seeing the cross section of your drawing suggests it is working on the same principal.

Saul Mine | 10-17-2008 10:26 AM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? Lackluster, all your questions are answered in the book I linked. It's only ten bux. I repeat: anybody who has a fireplace, or wants one, needs to read this book.

nub | 10-17-2008 10:26 AM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? Quote:
Originally Posted by BellevueBully (Post 1364413) Russkie, It's a little hard to tell from the drawing, but is the principle based on running the flue gas thru a set of baffles to keep the heat available to be captured by the exterior brick before escaping up the chimney?? A friend of mine has an old wood stove with a set of baffles at the back of the firebox. Seeing the cross section of your drawing suggests it is working on the same principal.
Yup that's the basic idea

BellevueBully | 10-17-2008 10:48 AM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? Quote:
Originally Posted by nub (Post 1364421) Yup that's the basic idea
Thermal mass is a wonderful thing, especially if your freezing your ass off in Siberia :) Thanks.

serj | 10-17-2008 11:04 AM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? Thanks for the info guys, it's been informative :RockOn:

GOLD DUCK | 10-17-2008 11:05 AM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? Quote:
Originally Posted by Lackluster (Post 1364405) One question I have about the Russian masonry stoves is this: Is there a lot of creosote buildup in the brick labryinth? I always thought that as smoke cooled, the creosote wouls condense on to the masonry. Is there a possibility of a 'chimney fire' inside of the stove? I know using seasoned wood would help, but still there must be some soot build up inside there.
QWAK,Lackluster,I believe that back then they had "SELF CLEANING OVENS" too!:wink: A chimmney fire is HOW they cleaned them out!:hahaha::yes::shine: Built so massively the fire burned off the creosote and restored efficiency and did no harm to the stove. Best to do it on a RAINEY day how ever!:wink: So you don't set the roof or any thing else on fire from the SPARKS! :hahaha: BTW: That was the FIRST JET INGEN:hahaha::yes: -- it was just pointed DOWN with the PUSH!:111::cry1: Chimney fires ARE like suddenly realising YOU got a JET ENGEN firing off and I garantee they get your HEART PUMPING!:yes::s1: the DUCK

Russkie | 10-17-2008 11:28 AM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? Quote:
Originally Posted by Lackluster (Post 1364405) One question I have about the Russian masonry stoves is this: Is there a lot of creosote buildup in the brick labryinth? I always thought that as smoke cooled, the creosote wouls condense on to the masonry. Is there a possibility of a 'chimney fire' inside of the stove? I know using seasoned wood would help, but still there must be some soot build up inside there.
lackluster, I think the answer to your question is here: http://mha-net.org/msb/html/guide2.htm excerpt: "What's a Masonry Heater? A masonry heater allows you to heat your home with wood in a unique way. It's main distinction is the ability to store a large amount of heat. This means that you can rapidly burn a large charge of wood without overheating your house. The heat is stored in the masonry thermal mass, and then slowly radiates into your house for the next 18 to 24 hours. You get a number of benefits, described in more detail below. If you burn wood fairly rapidly, it is a clean fuel. If you try to burn it too slowly, the fire will change from flaming to smoldering combustion. The burning process is incomplete and produces tars. Atmospheric pollution increases dramatically. This is important if you are planning an energy-efficient house. The average energy demand of your house will be quite low. For most of the time, it may require only 1 to 2 kW of heat. For most conventional woodstoves, this is below their "critical burn rate", or the point where they start to smolder. In other words, woodburning and energy efficient houses don't really suit each other very well, unless you have some way to store heat so that your stove can operate in the "clean" range all of the time." There's more info on the site.

Eyebone | 10-17-2008 06:55 PM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? You are absolutly right Serji. Fire draws air, air from the room and air from outside. If there is no supply of air fire goes out. So, if the air outside is cold and the fire is not your primary heat source you will "pay".

GOLD DUCK | 10-17-2008 07:57 PM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? QWAK,Eyebone,When I set up my stove in the kitchen it has knobs at the bottom of each door that regulate the air. What I did was cut two holes in the floor, in to the unheated crawl space and from each side of stove some 4" stove pipe with 2 90 degree elbos. The 4" stove pipe allowed the stove to run off out side air and not house air and there was a signifigent improvment in heating!:yes: the DUCK

Eyebone | 10-17-2008 08:27 PM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? Mr. Duck, you are eons beyond the original poster. If he can re-engineer his fireplace, that would alleviate the problem. :23_1_22:

SLV>GLD | 10-17-2008 11:52 PM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? Let it be said that futzing with fireplaces is nothing to be taken lightly. Professional review of the final design and construction should be consulted regardless if the intent is 100% self-performance.

.925 | 12-12-2008 05:55 PM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? Quote:
Originally Posted by StrawMan=Corporation (Post 1363586) House from Claymation ? Or a set out of Planet of the Apes ? http://ilovecob.com/wp-content/files/homestove.jpg
That right there is freakin' awesome!!!!:10_1_20:

JoBob | 12-13-2008 11:14 AM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? I use a wood stove insert in my fireplace. Using the open fireplace to burn wood sucked so much of the inside air out through the vent in the firescreen I could hear it whistle as it went up the chimney! I installed the Bart stove, vented outside air up through the ash vent in the fireplace into the stove box, and the change in the inside temperature was immediately noticeable. I'm heating the inside air through radiation while using outside air for combustion; very efficient because the heated, inside air stays inside. Also, burning a dead tree in a vented firebox burns much hotter than in a fireplace and actually puts less carbon dioxide into the atmosphere than allowing the tree to rot in the forest.

Squirrel Bait | 12-15-2008 03:36 PM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? Quote:
Originally Posted by JoBob (Post 1463980) Also, burning a dead tree in a vented firebox burns much hotter than in a fireplace and actually puts less carbon dioxide into the atmosphere than allowing the tree to rot in the forest.
Hey JoBob, I'm not jumpin' on you abut this, but can you explain this one a little. I can understand a hotter fire not puttin more pollution in the atmosphere. But decomposition should put less is the atmosphere as many of the cellulose strands do not decompose for decades, creating what we call humous. This is especially true in the cold northern climates sb

Squirrel Bait | 12-15-2008 03:40 PM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? Quote:
Originally Posted by Lt Dan (Post 1364200) Central Boiler heats my home and as a bonus it heats my hot water as well as my sons house all for the labor involved with cutting some firewood. It sets outside and the only mess in the house comes in on me or my shoes after loading it. I load 1-3 times a day depending on the weather.
Lt Dan or anybody, Does anyone make a central boiler that can generate its own electricity to run the electric pumps necessary to circulate the water throughout the system. sb

woodman | 12-15-2008 08:33 PM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? I have a Central Boiler outdoor wood fired boiler. It is easier than running an indoor wood stove but I miss the radiant heat. Nothing like the heat from a woodstove to warm the bones. I got the biggest residential model they offered and I think it was a good choice as I only have to fill it once every 24 hours in the coldest of weather. Doesn't do me any good at all when the power is out though. I keep my traditional woodstove handy and in a pinch it only takes a little while to set it back up in the fireplace. I heat my water with my wood fired boiler also. It works well but I'm sure it's very ineficient. I really don't use much more wood than what I used with my traditional woodstove though. I wake up in the morning and no need to freeze my ass off and build a fire.

Lt Dan | 12-15-2008 09:14 PM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? Quote:
Originally Posted by Squirrel Bait (Post 1467068) Lt Dan or anybody, Does anyone make a central boiler that can generate its own electricity to run the electric pumps necessary to circulate the water throughout the system. sb
You'd need at least some type of electrical source for running the boiler pumps and damper door, plus you have to run your furnace fan when the house 'stat calls for heat.

SomeSilver | 12-15-2008 09:16 PM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? Biggest problem with burning wood is that it's messy. Wood always leaves off residue...flaking bark etc. The ashes are messy and dusty to deal with. Can't beat the price though if you cut your own on your own woodlot! As far as heat loss via air flow going up the chimney...there is a net loss only with a fireplace..not a stove. If it were true (net heat loss up the chimney from a woodstove)...then it would also apply to an oil furnace or a gas fired burner...any fuel which requires a chimney. The only heating system that puts essentially 100% of energy consumed into the heated space is electric heat which needs neither burner not chimney...the power plant takes care of that (unless its nuclear)!

JoBob | 12-16-2008 09:16 AM
Re: Does firewood cost money to burn? Quote:
Originally Posted by Squirrel Bait (Post 1467061) Hey JoBob, I'm not jumpin' on you abut this, but can you explain this one a little. I can understand a hotter fire not puttin more pollution in the atmosphere. But decomposition should put less is the atmosphere as many of the cellulose strands do not decompose for decades, creating what we call humous. This is especially true in the cold northern climates sb
Oh, go ahead and jump. :wink: I think it's because a fallen tree attracts other organisms like mold, fungi, crawly-critters like termites, and generates a local ecology of organic material that all decays over time, contributing to the total CO2 generated from the process. All of the organics will eventually decay. Obviously, the forest benefits from the long term release of nutrients if the tree were left alone. It takes a string of "ifs" to validate the statement, such as beginning with "IF you're gonna burn a tree anyway..." It is splitting hairs and i can't reference a scientific study. I have a wood stove that works great and prefer to use it to generate the CO2 myself rather than watching trees decay for a decade. So far, I have used only dead, standing trees from my wood lot. I even leave the big ones for the woodpeckers! :bear_happy:

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