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Golddust | 11-11-2009 11:35 AM
WHOO WHEE! :23_30_104: Been wanting to for years and finally got around trying it and WOW!! :565: Sourdough Bread!!! Made a wild yeast starter and one week later(took that long for it to get going good) baked my first loaf day before yesterday and another one last night. This stuff is great. Will never go back to store bought no taste bread if it can be helped! It will be fun to see how long I can keep this starter living and making bread. The second loaf was better than the first in taste maybe because it was let to rise 3 times . 2 punch downs and 1 one final rise. Understand the longer the starter ages the better it will become... Can say this is for sure it is a all day thing waiting for the yeast critters to do their thing... Anyone have any thoughts and or favorite recipes they may want to share?????

Roadgold | 11-11-2009 11:50 AM
Re: WHOO WHEE! Nice job you got your own San Francisco treat at home. what area are you in? I always thought sourdough had to have special conditions Sourdough was the main bread made in Northern California during the California Gold Rush, and it remains a part of the culture of San Francisco today. The bread became so common that "sourdough" became a general nickname for the gold prospectors. The nickname remains in "Sourdough Sam", the mascot of the San Francisco 49ers. The sourdough tradition was carried into Alaska and the western Canadian territories during the Klondike Gold Rush. Conventional leavenings such as yeast and baking soda were much less reliable in the conditions faced by the prospectors. Experienced miners and other settlers frequently carried a pouch of starter either around their neck or on a belt; these were fiercely guarded to keep from freezing. Ironically, freezing does not kill a sourdough starter; excessive heat does. Old hands came to be called "sourdoughs", a term that is still applied to any Alaskan old-timer.[7] San Francisco sourdough is the most famous sourdough bread made in the U.S. today. In contrast to sourdough production in other areas of the country, the San Francisco variety has remained in continuous production for nearly 150 years, with some bakeries (e.g., Boudin Bakery among others) able to trace their starters back to California's territorial period. It is a white bread characterized by a pronounced sourness (not all varieties are as sour as San Francisco sourdough), so much so that the dominant strain of lactobacillus in sourdough starters was named Lactobacillus sanfranciscensis. Sourdough also became popular because of its ability to combine well with seafoods and soups such as cioppino, clam chowder and chili. Sourdough has not enjoyed the popularity it once had since bread became mass-produced. However, many restaurant chains, such as Cracker Barrel, keep it as a menu staple. Manufacturers make up for the lack of yeast and bacteria culture by introducing an artificially made mix known as bread improver into their dough.

Merlin | 11-11-2009 12:21 PM
Re: WHOO WHEE! A side benefit of sourdough is that it frees you from dependency on commercial yeast. If TS ever did HTF and commercial yeast were unavailable, you'd still be able to bake bread if you had stored wheat berries and/or flour. Congratulations, Golddust, on taking the plunge!

Golddust | 11-11-2009 12:56 PM
Re: WHOO WHEE! Quote:
Originally Posted by Merlin (Post 2019713) A side benefit of sourdough is that it frees you from dependency on commercial yeast. If TS ever did HTF and commercial yeast were unavailable, you'd still be able to bake bread if you had stored wheat berries and/or flour. Congratulations, Golddust, on taking the plunge!
Thanks! Have 2 starters going , one whole wheat and the other was regular unbleached flour and the whole wheat is coming along but not ready yet. Takes forever to rise after a feeding. The other one took off like a scalded cat and is the one i baked with. And the two runs of bread were not the same in taste the second one was stronger in sourdough taste and i think it was the extra punch downs and longer rise time. Think when this starter (s) is mature and has some age i will dry some and vac pack it for safety and long term storage.(?) I can see why it is not mass produced because of the length of time it takes for the dough to develop. Store bought yeast is fast working but i do not think i will have it in my house anymore. (did not have any to start with anyway) No more card board tasting bread for me now... Only problem i can see is in summer and the heat of same when working with sourdough without air conditioning. Not sure what the upper temperature limit of the starter is without killing it...

foolsgold | 11-11-2009 01:02 PM
Re: WHOO WHEE! Simple Man Simple Pleasures, that's the way to be.

scyth | 11-11-2009 02:44 PM
Re: WHOO WHEE! Some friends of the family - Wyoming - have A starter been in their family for well over 100 years. Of Scottish origin, of course. Frugal. scyth

Merlin | 11-11-2009 03:22 PM
Re: WHOO WHEE! Quote:
Originally Posted by Golddust (Post 2019777) Thanks! Have 2 starters going , one whole wheat and the other was regular unbleached flower and the whole wheat is coming along but not ready yet. Takes forever to rise after a feeding. The other one took off like a scalded cat and is the one i baked with. And the two runs of bread were not the same in taste the second one was stronger in sourdough taste and i think it was the extra punch downs and longer rise time. Think when this starter (s) is mature and has some age i will dry some and vac pack it for safety and long term storage.(?) I can see why it is not mass produced because of the length of time it takes for the dough to develop. Store bought yeast is fast working but i do not think i will have it in my house anymore. (did not have any to start with anyway) No more card board tasting bread for me now... Only problem i can see is in summer and the heat of same when working with sourdough without air conditioning. Not sure what the upper temperature limit of the starter is without killing it...
I believe you will find that the yeast will remain viable up to about 120 degrees. Above that, your starter will begin to die and at 140 degrees, it will be entirely done in. Even in Texas, I doubt you're going to have a serious problem. Of course these temps apply to commercial yeast; I do not know if wild yeast is more fragile. I doubt it. By the way, chlorine in water will kill your wild yeast, so if you're using tap water, be sure to let it stand so the chlorine evaporates. http://www.baking911.com/howto/yeast_dissolve.htm

SilverCat | 11-11-2009 03:27 PM
Re: WHOO WHEE! Quote:
Originally Posted by scyth (Post 2019942) Some friends of the family - Wyoming - have A starter been in their family for well over 100 years. Of Scottish origin, of course. Frugal. scyth
Yes, I have a friend in California whose family has 3 generations old sourdough starter. Not sure how old it is, but I think that's pretty cool.

Professur | 11-11-2009 03:30 PM
Re: WHOO WHEE! http://allrecipes.com/Recipe/Herman-...er/Detail.aspx

Golddust | 11-11-2009 03:36 PM
Re: WHOO WHEE! Quote:
Originally Posted by Merlin (Post 2019999) I believe you will find that the yeast will remain viable up to about 120 degrees. Above that, your starter will begin to die and at 140 degrees, it will be entirely done in. Even in Texas, I doubt you're going to have a serious problem. Of course these temps apply to commercial yeast; I do not know if wild yeast is more fragile. I doubt it. By the way, chlorine in water will kill your wild yeast, so if you're using tap water, be sure to let it stand so the chlorine evaporates. http://www.baking911.com/howto/yeast_dissolve.htm
I keep a jug of water on the counter that sits for a good day before using after filling. Learned along time ago about chlorine and yeast. Think you are right about no problem in summer. Tho I may have to do the baking outside. Same about the the max temp of store bought yeast.. It is the wild yeast I am not sure of . All the web searches turn up as do not let it get hot. Luke warm is the most referenced. And it seems like everyone has different opinion of what is too hot. And also what to do, it is a mess. Do some searches and you can see. use this--no, no, use that! It's a grin.:biggrin:

Golddust | 11-11-2009 03:45 PM
Re: WHOO WHEE! Quote:
Originally Posted by Professur (Post 2020008) http://allrecipes.com/Recipe/Herman-...er/Detail.aspx
Thanks Have seen the web pages that used store bought yeast and decided not to. I agree you can let the ready made yeast go wild to get a sourdough starter going. But wanted to do it in the traditional ways of old. So far it is working and it will be interesting to see where it goes...

Professur | 11-11-2009 04:02 PM
Re: WHOO WHEE! Mum always had a bowl of herman in the bottom of the fridge. Never knew what went into it ... and I knew was it tasted damn good. But you had to give some of it away all the time. That was part of it's mystique.

Merlin | 11-11-2009 08:44 PM
Re: WHOO WHEE! Quote:
Originally Posted by Golddust (Post 2020018) I keep a jug of water on the counter that sits for a good day before using after filling. Learned along time ago about chlorine and yeast. Think you are right about no problem in summer. Tho I may have to do the baking outside. Same about the the max temp of store bought yeast.. It is the wild yeast I am not sure of . All the web searches turn up as do not let it get hot. Luke warm is the most referenced. And it seems like everyone has different opinion of what is too hot. And also what to do, it is a mess. Do some searches and you can see. use this--no, no, use that! It's a grin.:biggrin:
On a warm, sunny day you can bake bread in a Sun Oven and keep the heat out of your house. I've done it, so I know it's possible. I never got my Sun Oven up to 350 degrees; but it baked bread just fine at 325.

Merlin | 11-11-2009 11:12 PM
Re: WHOO WHEE! Wild yeast floats in the air everywhere. So if you leave your starter on the counter, it gets infected (cultured) automatically. If you want to affect the outcome, you can innoculate your starter, but it is not necessary. Flour and water on the kitchen counter will eventually get frothy and turn into sourdough starter. Of course, like most things, you can make as big a production out of it as you want. I am not myself a big believer in 100 year old sourdough starters. They've been sitting on the shelf for a 100 years, after all, collecting whatever yeast is floating in your neighborhood. So, I don't want to pick a fight here. It's all good.

scyth | 11-11-2009 11:21 PM
Re: WHOO WHEE! I haven't kept a starter for quite some time. Being "off" wheat, and "on" brun rice. However, back in the days............ Soak down a cup of wheat flour with about a half a bottle Of beer And jump back! scyth

Golddust | 11-12-2009 06:00 AM
Re: WHOO WHEE! Quote:
Originally Posted by ImaCannin (Post 2020837) So how did you make your yeast? Inquirery minds want to know.
Used this web page as a start. http://www.prismnet.com/~sjohn/sour.htm Made the starter like merlin stated. Used 3/4 cup of un-chlorinated water to 1 cup of unbleached bread flour.Mixed and left on the counter. I did not do it like a lot of web authors said to do. Did not throw away 1/2 of starter at every feeding.(hate waste) To the original flower I added the same ratio of water to flour everyday but cut the amount down. Instead of using fractions of cups I switched to fractions of spoons. So to the original 1 cup of flour , would add 4 tbs of flour and 3 tbs of water mixed in and left on the counter in a wide mouth jar. Everyday it got more active and at the end of 7 days started smelling great and very active at each feeding. At that point made the bread that is shown in the web link above..GREAT. Did the same with whole wheat and it is coming along but it is developing slower than the white flour.

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