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Fixture | 07-19-2008 09:33 AM
So I've got a coyote problem. Seems as though a 5 acre subdivision is going in behind us. The seller owns about 2000 acres and sold about 100 acres to somebody whose developing it with roads, electricity and home sites. Coyotes used to roam on his place and seem to be moving onto my place. I don't mean one or two, either...I guess the number is closer to 20 or thirty. They have their celebratory whelping that can occur anytime, but mostly at 830 pm and (ugh) about 0230 am. I read an old western book years ago (LaMour?) that had a blurb stating 'that if you have coyotes, kill one and hoist it about 15 feet in the air in the area where the coyotes are coming onto your place. Let the coyote rot off the rope. The rest of them won't be back'. Well, about 5 or 6 years ago, we had a coyote problem and since I was unable to shoot one; one of my labs killed one. He dragged it to the front porch and left it. I strung some rope around its neck and hoisted it in the woods near the likely entry point to my place. Voila, they didn't come back till late last year. So this year I tried something different. I got a cd looped with sounds of a rabbit in distress and played the thing cranked whenever I hear the coyotes. I've been sitting in the woods with either my 223 or the 9mm. That just accomplishes mosquito bites and headaches. I don't think the coyotes are buying the sound effects. I have leg hold traps but with my dogs, I have to put the dogs in the house, bait and set the traps, go back to the house, but then retrieve the traps BEFORE I let my dogs back out. A major pain in the a$$. Anybody got any ideas?

Tallships | 07-19-2008 09:40 AM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. http://www.huntingnet.com/forum/tm.aspx?m=2263314 might help you some. I put you in the right thread.

SAUM | 07-19-2008 10:37 AM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. Since you are worried about your dogs, use a live trap and .22s.

Maxine | 07-19-2008 12:20 PM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. Quote:
Originally Posted by SAUM (Post 1200014) Since you are worried about your dogs, use a live trap and .22s.
I second this. Leg holds are not a good way. You could easily get other peoples' dogs and cats in them too as well as non target wildlife, or worse yet someone's kid's foot. Life trap, then shoot, if you must, is probably the best idea.

DogFarm | 07-19-2008 12:22 PM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. if you have dogs I wouldn't use the leg traps with them around....all it takes is one bolt out the door and 'snap' and your dog's new nickname will be 'Tripod'. btw--the developer should be on the hook for driving the coyotes onto your property. ask him to hire a verminator to deal with the problem (thinning the population). be polite, but be firm. developers know they are changing the habitat and forcing the animals to move out and they should do something about this as well--it's the cost of doing business and if the guy can afford to buy and develop 100+ acres then I am sure he can afford a couple of bucks to hire a professional verminator.... if he balks, you should play off his ego (ALL developers have an outsized ego. hint that "hey, maybe you don't have enough money to be developing if you can't afford to handle this tiny problem, i know you probably don't have the money to do this but...." A developers' ego goes freaking crazy at the notion that it "can't afford to do something" or someone thinks the developer lacks "the financial ability" otherwise you should start calling the county to complain. why waste your time on this?

Flinch | 07-19-2008 12:42 PM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. I doubt the effectiveness of live traps, I use leg holds and snares and have caught 'yotes in both. Can you hunt over bait in your area ? That's a good way of attracting several in one night. Sit in a tree stand and pop 'em. Works for me.

RealJack | 07-19-2008 02:10 PM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. 1 Attachment(s) Are these coyotes actually causing problems besides yipping at night? I'm not a big proponent of preemptive warfare with the local fauna. Since a typical pack ranges nearly 12 miles, depending on the concentration of food from area to area, they tend to move around quite a bit, so it's likely they will just eat a few rodents, shit in the woods and never really become a big concern. Yes, they could become a problem, however, even someones twelve year old daughter could become a problem. That doesn't mean they should preemptively give the girl an hysterectomy. :D Attempted humor... I've had coyotes yipping out there in the dark of night for years and not once have they become a nuisance or eaten a cat or a chicken. Not once have they attempted to mate with one of my dogs. :D More attempted humor... Al I'm saying is, sure, they're out there, but don't make it a problem till it's actually a problem. You'd be saving a few bullets for zombies in humvees and they may pay back your generosity by scavenging and cleaning up all the zombie piles for you. :wink: Ok, that was one final attempt at humor...

Silverstone | 07-19-2008 02:43 PM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. Well, I agree if they are doing no harm, however, he has a dog, they might attack his Lab, especially if the Lab is alone, esp. if he has that many. They are hard to get rid of if good hunting grounds around. Live traps/shoot 'em , hire an exterminator. I've heard, but don't know by experience, that Llamas chase off coyotes/wolves etc., i.e. are good herd protectors. They come/go from our property but don't usually stick around, well have never stuck around ON the property itself, but that's only beause the horses will charge them, and we have two GSDs that will fight with them and have killed one so far that I know of. I have considered if I lose one of my GSDs to old age, well toying with the idea, they are big eaters, adopting a young Irish Wolfhound. Lots up for adoption (they eat alot and need room to run). Fast, and if bred true will take on (chase off) coyotes/foxes/wolves, and keep the rodent population down (however, my husband wants another gun dog first though, so I could be waiting awhile---we had a good one, but she went hunting one day for herself and never came back). I'm not a killer, I'd just soon GIVE them the habitat, and a few chickens/rabbits now and then I would be ok with; but there are some boundaries to what a human can live with, as in leave the expensive livestock alone, and leave the "pets" alone and we'll co-exist, so far so good with us; but you have ONE lab against a pack, not good. Coyotes are known to call out and entrap domesticated dogsfor the kill; yes, they do this. P.S. At night I don't let my dogs run free, they are put in the 6 foot fenced in back section (esp. for them) because this is when most of the fights/entrapment occur; when I let them out during the day, it's always BOTH of them, never one alone, it's the buddy system :) Coyotes will kill a bigger domesticated dog if by itself and a few of them.

Silver Wolf | 07-19-2008 02:53 PM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. I would try everything under the sun to avoid killing one. I just have too much respect for coyotes. Killing one just strikes me as bad karma.

RealJack | 07-19-2008 03:30 PM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. Silverstone, everything you've said is quite true. Speaking of horses... Once I was taking a midnight stroll with a girlfriend. We were following the fence line of our mountain communities shared pasture, a large fenced area bordered on one side with a neighbors Elk Ranch. We heard some rustling in a patch of trees just on the other side of the fence, shone the flashlight into the trees and lo and behold, not more than 15 feet away were maybe 10 coyotes sitting there watching us. Too cool, now my girlfriend was getting kind of nervous, so we stared to move away and that was about when we heard a great rumbling. As it grew louder we realized it was the whole herd of horses, including two of my own, and they were headed straight for us. I mean to tell you, those horses reached us in about five seconds and the only thing they were sensing were the coyotes we were standing right in front of. As the Alpha Mayer reached us, in the near pitch dark, pumped for battle, reared up right over my girlfriend and was about to bash her head in. "HEY", I screamed (in a manly way):bear_tongue: as loud as I could and sort of tackled her out of the way. I've never seen a horse out for blood like that before. It was impressive and damn scary. That mayer, sweet as she was in the daytime, was a warhorse at night. In fact every one of those horses, including my own, were fiercely agitated until they finally caught our scent over the coyotes. After that episode we decided to keep our romantic strolls out of the pasture. :wink:

Avalon | 07-19-2008 03:44 PM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. Quote:
Originally Posted by Silver Wolf (Post 1200286) I would try everything under the sun to avoid killing one. I just have too much respect for coyotes. Killing one just strikes me as bad karma.
yep.. bad karma.:yes: My brother in law had war on some Beavers on the pond that were not really bothering anything. He killed a few and all was quiet till a few weeks ago. Evidently Brother Beaver and his cousins ate through his pipes from the well.. Chewed his whole underground piping system to bits.. The well now empties into the pond and the Beavers are enjoying the high water level.. :smokin: I would make sure I had a safe fenced and electrified area for my own animals and let it be. Throw some firecrackers out the back at night.. Time and the new subdivision will take care of the problem.

buff01 | 07-19-2008 03:45 PM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. night vision scope time?

Lt Dan | 07-19-2008 05:59 PM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. Quote:
Originally Posted by Flinch (Post 1200155) I doubt the effectiveness of live traps, I use leg holds and snares and have caught 'yotes in both. Can you hunt over bait in your area ? That's a good way of attracting several in one night. Sit in a tree stand and pop 'em. Works for me.
Plus about a hundred on that post. Any predator comes on my property with intent to do harm, has just worn out there karma. Two years ago foxes cleaned out our strawberries, so I fenced it and kept them out. Last year the coyotes came and went over the fence (4') and cleaned out all the berries, even the green ones, in one night. I put an electric wire on top and no more coyote problems there. This year we got the berries. I don't mind critters coming on my property to hunt other wild animals, especially the rabbits that eat the garden stuff, or the mice that damage the crops, but at some point they can become a problem and will be dealt with. All life lives on life! I agree with damage control by hunting or trapping, but not with poison. Live traps rarely work for fox or coyote, leg hold and snares, and bullets do. As for dogs, most won't be hurt all that bad by a leg hold and should not be running loose anyway, it's against the law to allow dogs to run free in Ohio and many other states. Fence them in or contain them but if they come on my property and cause a threat of any kind and the dog may not come home. Fencing is not cheap, but if that is what it takes to keep your dog home and the coyotes out, is it too much to do? I've spent hundreds no thousands of bucks to put up fences, some are dog proof, but there are a few gaps that I need to close. Coyotes do deserve our respect as much as our pets as does all life, but just as you'd have the right to shoot me if I forced myself into your house or threatened you or yours in anyway, so if a wild or tame critter comes and does harm, shouldn't you have the right to defend what is yours? I'm not advocating wholesale slaughter of wild animals just defense and control of what is rightfully ours. As for "their celebratory whelping", they are just doing what coyotes do. Spend some time researching them and see if you can determine where they are and how to deter them, get them to move on, change their habits. They are smart as any dog and not all that easy to catch. I'd say take a scatter gun and #4 shot, set up a call station from say a tree stand and enjoy your time in the woods with nature, after a while maybe you'd come to appreciate the 'yotes and forget why you wanted to shoot them in the first place.

Fixture | 07-19-2008 06:06 PM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. Quote:
Originally Posted by Maxine (Post 1200129) .... Leg holds are not a good way. You could easily get other peoples' dogs and cats in them too as well as non target wildlife, or worse yet someone's kid's foot.
We live in North Idaho, 6 miles E of WA, 70 miles S of British Columbia and 50 miles W of Montana. Others dogs are merely members of the food chain. Trespassing does happen here (as elsewhere) but it's not a common thing. Non-target wildlife (I guess) would be deer or moose, but they don't scent on meat. Thanks for the reply.

Fixture | 07-19-2008 06:10 PM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. Quote:
Originally Posted by DogFarm (Post 1200131) btw--the developer should be on the hook for driving the coyotes onto your property.... ....otherwise you should start calling the county to complain. why waste your time on this?
Dogfarm, hey, thanks man! But look, here in the middle of BFE, coyotes are EVERYBODIES problem. Calling the County would result in a "Huh?" and (I hate to say this) talking to the developer for "driving" coyotes from his place to mine would result in him saying a "Tuff Titty" and he'd be right.

Fixture | 07-19-2008 06:13 PM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. Quote:
Originally Posted by RealJack (Post 1200242) Are these coyotes actually causing problems besides yipping at night? I'm not a big proponent of preemptive warfare with the local fauna.
Thanks for this reality check. NO...they aren't causing problems besides announcing the local bar closings at 0230. Maybe I'm getting too crotchetty in my old age!

Fixture | 07-19-2008 06:16 PM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. Quote:
Originally Posted by Silver Wolf (Post 1200286) I would try everything under the sun to avoid killing one. I just have too much respect for coyotes. Killing one just strikes me as bad karma.
Coyotes are garbage eaters and hunt in packs. They survive by stealth and trickery, they will put a bitch in estruss near a home hoping to attract an aroused male dog. The male dog responds and he gets rat-packed by the pack. They aint that friendly.

Fixture | 07-19-2008 06:29 PM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. Quote:
Originally Posted by Lt Dan (Post 1200501) Plus about a hundred on that post. Any predator comes on my property with intent to do harm, has just worn out there karma. I'm not advocating wholesale slaughter of wild animals just defense and control of what is rightfully ours. As for "their celebratory whelping", they are just doing what coyotes do. Spend some time researching them and see if you can determine where they are and how to deter them, get them to move on, change their habits. They are smart as any dog and not all that easy to catch. I'd say take a scatter gun and #4 shot, set up a call station from say a tree stand and enjoy your time in the woods with nature, after a while maybe you'd come to appreciate the 'yotes and forget why you wanted to shoot them in the first place.
Jeesh, very well written and thought-out post. I have been living in Idaho for 10 years, deer-moose-rabbit-turkey all over the place. Never shot a one...BUT I know where on my 20 acres they are at various times of the day. IF I needed food, I've got the means to get it and the where it is at what time. I don't like coyotes as they have a pack mentality and I don't like that mentality in either animals or humans. My dogs are very special to me...trained and friendly with non-threatening humans. Nasty toward attitudes or intruders. I note that our intruding coyotes leave my dogs be. 5 or so years ago when we had the first "incursion" of coyotes, my older lab, ran into what had to be the middle of a celebratory whelping party. The coyotes were very close. He barked (announced himself) and they all shut the hell up. I had my 38 snubby and (though I couldn't see a damned thing) was ready to charge the area if my lab sounded 'excited'. No problems. So I guess maybe I'm perhaps over-reacting to the incursion. They aren't in my homesite, haven't attacked my dogs and aren't presenting a threat to me yet. Wow....talk about a reality check. Thanks folks! :applause_

GOLD DUCK | 07-19-2008 06:54 PM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. QWAK,Just LIVE with the problem and the PROBLEM will stop being a problem!:thinkey::yes: The SHIT IS HITING THE FAN ,developers are droping like FLIES and no one can BUY even IF they could do the build -- nature will take its corse and the coytes will move back to ware they came from in time. What makes people think they always GOT to make NATURE adapt to THEM and what THEY want or KILL nature off?:questionm:dontknow: "IT is "ALL ONE" people and YOU are just ONE of the ALL -- live with IT,learn from IT --- IT is a part of YOUR adventure!:wink: You can KILL or chose NOT to KILL it is FREE WILL in action -- but for every ACTION there are REACTIONS -- that is obviously WHY them coyotes came to your place!:yes: Most likely they were on your place when hunting and never bothered you. NOW some one ( HUMAN) destroid THERE HOME and your place was closists and fit there needs. Mostly they eat rodents and that is helpfull much like having a cat or lots of cats around.:yes: If I can get along with coytes and rattle snakes and lots of other criters YOU can too. :s9::grin: Personaly I much PREFER coytes and rattle snakes even the ocasional black bear to GANG BANGERS and theaves like back in the CITY!:yes: I think a red tail hawk got the cat that came here with me from the city -- KITTY thought she was the GREAT WHITE hunter -- good mouser who tought my begle pup to catch mice like a cat does!:yes: I was sad at loosing KITTY to NATURE but then THAT is realy a lot of what LIFE is ALL about and LIFE goes ON!:yes: BUT "IT" is never realy OVER -- IT just changes!:thinkey::grin: ALL you LOVE and care about no matter WHO or WHAT --will be LOST along the way and ALL left behind when you transition but "IT" is never realy OVER and NEVER realy LOST --- is part of the ALL and always will be!:s9: the DUCK

Red_Leg | 07-19-2008 08:18 PM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. Coyotes. Realitively new to my area. In the last 45 years anyway. They cost me a real good beagle 30 years ago but..... They hunt down feral cats....And I like that! Coyotes seem to be part of a chain of predators that started with a change in farming in this area. Good luck getting rid of them. One thing that is lacking in this area that seems to have something to do with Coyote numbers rising is the end of fox drives in the early 70's.

Maddie | 07-19-2008 08:45 PM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. It's hard not to have some admiration for coyotes, survivors that they are. However, I wouldn't want to worry about them getting after my dogs. Cute song about coyotes: <object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/8yYc8mYfrkg&hl=en&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/8yYc8mYfrkg&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>

Zilver | 07-19-2008 09:19 PM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. 1 Attachment(s) Quote:
Originally Posted by Maddie (Post 1200695) It's hard not to have some admiration for coyotes, survivors that they are. However, I wouldn't want to worry about them getting after my dogs. Cute song about coyotes: <object width="425" height="344"><param name="movie" value="http://www.youtube.com/v/8yYc8mYfrkg&hl=en&fs=1"></param><param name="allowFullScreen" value="true"></param><embed src="http://www.youtube.com/v/8yYc8mYfrkg&hl=en&fs=1" type="application/x-shockwave-flash" allowfullscreen="true" width="425" height="344"></embed></object>
Maddie, that song was corny! ...geesh

momopanda | 07-19-2008 09:56 PM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. Try wolf urine before you start killing 'em. They take folks cats around here all the time. Poodles too.

Onboard | 07-19-2008 10:14 PM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. This last deer season as I was sitting in a climbing stand this little doe comes hauling it past with a coyote in hot pursuit. The fella that owns the land across from mine says that a pack of coyotes killed one of his calves that spring. I've also heard that too many coyotes will decimate your turkey (wild) population. I've been thinking about doing some predator calls and popping a few. This is in Northern Arkansas, the Ozarks. Duck. Are you in the Ozarks or Quachita/Boston range?

Squirrel Bait | 07-19-2008 10:52 PM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. Coyotes are out of balance here in N. Illinois. Had a neighbor who had his dog beat up and the coyotes were stealing the dogs food, but if he turned on the lights to shoot 'em they were too quick and would run. His solution was a jury rigged motion sensor light that instead of turning on a light outside, it rang a bell in his house. He would get his shotgun loaded with buckshot, get ready at the door and have his wife turn on the light. First night he got two coyotes. Now they mostly leave him alone. They aren't stupid. But if they don't perceive a threat they will take advantage of you. s

electric-amish | 07-20-2008 01:35 AM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. While camping one weekend on the Current river in the Ozarks I heard the worst noise I've ever heard before. A pack of Coyotes took down a deer across the river from us and ate the thing mostly alive. 15 of us on that trip and it sounded so viscious some slept in their cars. I have no respect for the Coyote and say kill them if you can legaly. E-A

GOLD DUCK | 07-20-2008 08:20 AM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. Quote:
Originally Posted by Onboard (Post 1200851) This last deer season as I was sitting in a climbing stand this little doe comes hauling it past with a coyote in hot pursuit. The fella that owns the land across from mine says that a pack of coyotes killed one of his calves that spring. I've also heard that too many coyotes will decimate your turkey (wild) population. I've been thinking about doing some predator calls and popping a few. This is in Northern Arkansas, the Ozarks. Duck. Are you in the Ozarks or Quachita/Boston range?
QWAK,Onboard,Boston range about half way between Fayetteville and Fort Smith. The building of the new I 540 highway disrupted natural balance a bunch and will take conciderable time to reestablish equlibrium. GREED and commerce seem to be the only factors that limit human expancion and also propell it --- people see only what they want to see and ignore every thing else or just try to PUSH it out of the way -- THEY like to call it PROGRESS but it is just a word that sounds nice and seems to justify about any thing they want to do!:yes::rant: Indian barrial grounds were bulldosed and covered over fast so there "PROJECT" would not be stoped or delayed. I had an option on 80 achers that linked to my 40 which was taken by the highway project, it had a creek with a small water fall and a small pool in front of the water fall with big flat rock you could lay on in the sun to dry off after going skinny diping to cool off on hot summer days --- GONE -- now diverted to a culvert pipe under the new HIGHWAY!:censored::508: The state condemed the property and payed $200.00 per acher!:censored::realmad: Brown and Routs made lots of $$$ I guess THEY concider that PROGRESS! the DUCK

Percival | 07-20-2008 10:27 AM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. Quote:
Originally Posted by Fixture (Post 1199927) Seems as though a 5 acre subdivision is going in behind us. The seller owns about 2000 acres and sold about 100 acres to somebody whose developing it with roads, electricity and home sites. Coyotes used to roam on his place and seem to be moving onto my place. I don't mean one or two, either...I guess the number is closer to 20 or thirty. They have their celebratory whelping that can occur anytime, but mostly at 830 pm and (ugh) about 0230 am. I read an old western book years ago (LaMour?) that had a blurb stating 'that if you have coyotes, kill one and hoist it about 15 feet in the air in the area where the coyotes are coming onto your place. Let the coyote rot off the rope. The rest of them won't be back'. Well, about 5 or 6 years ago, we had a coyote problem and since I was unable to shoot one; one of my labs killed one. He dragged it to the front porch and left it. I strung some rope around its neck and hoisted it in the woods near the likely entry point to my place. Voila, they didn't come back till late last year. So this year I tried something different. I got a cd looped with sounds of a rabbit in distress and played the thing cranked whenever I hear the coyotes. I've been sitting in the woods with either my 223 or the 9mm. That just accomplishes mosquito bites and headaches. I don't think the coyotes are buying the sound effects. I have leg hold traps but with my dogs, I have to put the dogs in the house, bait and set the traps, go back to the house, but then retrieve the traps BEFORE I let my dogs back out. A major pain in the a$$. Anybody got any ideas?
I got an idea, stop killing animals for no good reason. Move somewhere else, they were there first I would wager and you intruded on their territory and now you want to murder them one by one because they wont conform to your lifestyle. Sounds like what Bush is doing in Iraq... Now, dont get me wrong, I DO understand that they can be a problem, living in Arizona I know ALL about coyotes, this place is infested with them, but all I am saying is do a little research and find some alternative methods before you resort to killing the poor critters. They are just doing what they do, they are not knowingly consciously plotting against you or anything.

Silverstone | 07-21-2008 01:17 AM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. Quote:
Originally Posted by RealJack (Post 1200322) Silverstone, everything you've said is quite true. Speaking of horses... Once I was taking a midnight stroll with a girlfriend. We were following the fence line of our mountain communities shared pasture, a large fenced area bordered on one side with a neighbors Elk Ranch. We heard some rustling in a patch of trees just on the other side of the fence, shone the flashlight into the trees and lo and behold, not more than 15 feet away were maybe 10 coyotes sitting there watching us. Too cool, now my girlfriend was getting kind of nervous, so we stared to move away and that was about when we heard a great rumbling. As it grew louder we realized it was the whole herd of horses, including two of my own, and they were headed straight for us. I mean to tell you, those horses reached us in about five seconds and the only thing they were sensing were the coyotes we were standing right in front of. As the Alpha Mayer reached us, in the near pitch dark, pumped for battle, reared up right over my girlfriend and was about to bash her head in. "HEY", I screamed (in a manly way):bear_tongue: as loud as I could and sort of tackled her out of the way. I've never seen a horse out for blood like that before. It was impressive and damn scary. That mayer, sweet as she was in the daytime, was a warhorse at night. In fact every one of those horses, including my own, were fiercely agitated until they finally caught our scent over the coyotes. After that episode we decided to keep our romantic strolls out of the pasture. :wink:
Yeah, especially if you have the cow ponies! They'll charge 'em off...some horses will run first, but I have two Paints that are technically QH foundation cow/speed stock...they will stand their ground, shake their heads, pin those ears back, drop the head and go after 'em. And my little gelding cow pony came between me and the transient/resident fox one night, I couldn't figure out what he was doing, he just walked in front of the fox (that was frozen and put his body between it and me) and stood there tight as a drum watching the fox, I told him it was ok and moved away so he could let his guard down. He's a sweetie.

Fixture | 07-21-2008 08:38 AM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. Quote:
Originally Posted by Percival (Post 1201200) I got an idea, stop killing animals for no good reason. Move somewhere else...
Where in this thread have I indicated "killing animals"? "Move somewhere else..." Thanks for your contribution to the discussion.

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teedub31 | 07-21-2008 10:09 AM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. Quote:
Originally Posted by Fixture (Post 1200519) Coyotes are garbage eaters and hunt in packs. They survive by stealth and trickery, they will put a bitch in estruss near a home hoping to attract an aroused male dog. The male dog responds and he gets rat-packed by the pack. They aint that friendly.
Now I aint calling you a liar or anything, but simple understanding of most all animals would should throw up a red flag against your claim. Animals have 2 goals in life. Mate and eat, in that order. And when they eat they do so in the easiest way possible. Few animals if any go out looking for a fight just to be fighting. With this in mind, why would males bring in a hot bitch with the chance that a dog might breed her. Violates initial life goal. If she is hot, they are (to put it nicely) pounding her not using her as bait for a game. And while they do pack up at night, I have yet to see any packs during the day while they are scavenging (not really hunting) for food. Why scavenge,easier to kill a weakling. Don't get me wrong, I shoot coyotes before shooting deer, but I tend to question what I feel are absurd claims that I have yet to see in my 25+ years in the woods.

RealJack | 07-21-2008 10:12 AM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. Quote:
Thanks for this reality check. NO...they aren't causing problems besides announcing the local bar closings at 0230. Maybe I'm getting too crotchetty in my old age!
I'm happy you didn't take my post as an indictment toward your character. You sound mighty decent to me. Man, I sure do miss the Rockies and the West. Especially this time of the year when down here in Florida the heat, humidity and bugs are stifling the life out of my garden. I miss the almost overwhelming scent of prairie sage and the Cottonwood snow tickling my nose. Anyway, just a few weeks back I spotted a 4 pack Fox family no more than 200 ft. from the hen house. It looked like they had taken up residence right there. I could have just plinked em from the porch and was wondering some of the same things you are. In my imagination I was seeing feathers flying and blood everywhere. The Classic Fox in the Hen house fare. :wink: Come to find out they were feasting on a cache of Gopher Tortoise and camping out in its hole. I was able to spend time watching them frolic in the weeds for a week or more, but one day, they just up and left. Another thing I found out is if the Foxes are around it's likely the Coyotes aren't. There are thousands of acres of saw grass preserves nearby and a National Forest 2 miles away, so they all have plenty of room to play. Somehow I feel honored by their presence. I took this pic with a 10x telephoto. They wouldn't let me any closer before they'd disappear back down the old Gopher hole. http://i286.photobucket.com/albums/l...bucher/fox.jpg

teedub31 | 07-21-2008 10:13 AM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. Quote:
Originally Posted by DogFarm (Post 1200131) if you have dogs I wouldn't use the leg traps with them around....all it takes is one bolt out the door and 'snap' and your dog's new nickname will be 'Tripod'. btw--the developer should be on the hook for driving the coyotes onto your property. ask him to hire a verminator to deal with the problem (thinning the population). be polite, but be firm. developers know they are changing the habitat and forcing the animals to move out and they should do something about this as well--it's the cost of doing business and if the guy can afford to buy and develop 100+ acres then I am sure he can afford a couple of bucks to hire a professional verminator.... if he balks, you should play off his ego (ALL developers have an outsized ego. hint that "hey, maybe you don't have enough money to be developing if you can't afford to handle this tiny problem, i know you probably don't have the money to do this but...." A developers' ego goes freaking crazy at the notion that it "can't afford to do something" or someone thinks the developer lacks "the financial ability" otherwise you should start calling the county to complain. why waste your time on this?
If I was the developer, I would counter that when you built your liitle homestead, you drove coyotes off you land onto mine. So turn around is fair play.

teedub31 | 07-21-2008 10:22 AM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. Quote:
Originally Posted by Fixture (Post 1199927) Seems as though a 5 acre subdivision is going in behind us. The seller owns about 2000 acres and sold about 100 acres to somebody whose developing it with roads, electricity and home sites. Coyotes used to roam on his place and seem to be moving onto my place. I don't mean one or two, either...I guess the number is closer to 20 or thirty. They have their celebratory whelping that can occur anytime, but mostly at 830 pm and (ugh) about 0230 am. I read an old western book years ago (LaMour?) that had a blurb stating 'that if you have coyotes, kill one and hoist it about 15 feet in the air in the area where the coyotes are coming onto your place. Let the coyote rot off the rope. The rest of them won't be back'. Well, about 5 or 6 years ago, we had a coyote problem and since I was unable to shoot one; one of my labs killed one. He dragged it to the front porch and left it. I strung some rope around its neck and hoisted it in the woods near the likely entry point to my place. Voila, they didn't come back till late last year. So this year I tried something different. I got a cd looped with sounds of a rabbit in distress and played the thing cranked whenever I hear the coyotes. I've been sitting in the woods with either my 223 or the 9mm. That just accomplishes mosquito bites and headaches. I don't think the coyotes are buying the sound effects. I have leg hold traps but with my dogs, I have to put the dogs in the house, bait and set the traps, go back to the house, but then retrieve the traps BEFORE I let my dogs back out. A major pain in the a$$. Anybody got any ideas?
Seeing as how the 2000 acres is less the 4 square mile, the seeling of 100 acres has no real bearing on you ground. If the owner had coyotes then you had coyotes plain and simple (especially if the ground is behind you as you say). I suspect they are there for other reasons besides besides they selling and development of a measly 100 acres.

RealJack | 07-21-2008 10:23 AM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. Quote:
Originally Posted by teedub31 (Post 1202363) Now I aint calling you a liar or anything, but simple understanding of most all animals would should throw up a red flag against your claim. Animals have 2 goals in life. Mate and eat, in that order. And when they eat they do so in the easiest way possible. Few animals if any go out looking for a fight just to be fighting. With this in mind, why would males bring in a hot bitch with the chance that a dog might breed her. Violates initial life goal. If she is hot, they are (to put it nicely) pounding her not using her as bait for a game. And while they do pack up at night, I have yet to see any packs during the day while they are scavenging (not really hunting) for food. Why scavenge,easier to kill a weakling. Don't get me wrong, I shoot coyotes before shooting deer, but I tend to question what I feel are absurd claims that I have yet to see in my 25+ years in the woods.
I'm don't know about the trickery thing, but I do know mix breeding occurs. They're called Coydogs.

teedub31 | 07-21-2008 10:29 AM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. I am sure they are able to mix. However, a male aint bringing a hot bitch to someone else. I thing being a cuckhold is something specific to the human race.

RealJack | 07-21-2008 10:43 AM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. A pack of urbanized Mexican Coyhuahua's howling and yipping, preparing for the hunt. Prey we never run into these hombre's. :D http://i286.photobucket.com/albums/l...ihuahuadog.jpg

stranger | 07-21-2008 03:29 PM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. Want 'em gone?...live trap one and inject it with about 10x the normal dose of distemper vaccine, then let it go. It's a live virus, and the 'yote'll carry it right back to the den and kill everyone of 'em outright. They have no natural predators, and can throw an entire ecosystem out of balance, not to mention what they can and will do to livestock and pets. They get eliminated by any means around here.

GOLD DUCK | 07-21-2008 03:48 PM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. Quote:
Originally Posted by stranger (Post 1202781) Want 'em gone?...live trap one and inject it with about 10x the normal dose of distemper vaccine, then let it go. It's a live virus, and the 'yote'll carry it right back to the den and kill everyone of 'em outright. They have no natural predators, and can throw an entire ecosystem out of balance, not to mention what they can and will do to livestock and pets. They get eliminated by any means around here.
QWAK,stranger,Humans got no natural predators LEFT and are a much MORE dangerous VIRUS to the ECOSYSTEM -- lets INJECT --YOU FIRST and watch what happens!:thinkey::yes: You sound like the MORONS who thought it was a good idea to give SMALL POX and other diseases to the NATIVE AMERICANS because THEY were concidered a PROBLEM -- mostly to GREED expanding any ware IT wanted to go!! To kill to LIVE and continue LIFE is NATURAL and OK but to KILL for GREED and with total ABANDON is -- only HUMAN --I supose ,STUPID but very human. Some times it makes me UNCOMFORTABLE sharing the same GEAN POOL with people who CAN think like THAT!:rant: IF you kill every thing you percieve as a PROBLEM you will find you have KILLED every thing and every one else!:yes: Most people don't THINK -- they only THINK they DO!:hahaha::thinkey::s9: the DUCK

Jonas Parker | 07-21-2008 03:54 PM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. Don't coyotes like duck as much as they like road-runners?

stranger | 07-21-2008 04:10 PM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. Your opinion Duck, and you are entitled to it. For what it's worth, a human trespassing on my land with the intent to work ill on me or mine would be eliminated with just as much prejudice, and I'd be in the right. I got that particular trick from a wildlife enforcement officer. It's a lttle more humane than the way we used to do it. Hang a steel leader and shark hook from a limb and thread the hook with a hotdog, and walk away... I see where you'd draw the comparison to American Indians and smallpox, and I can't say I didn't expect it. Just so we're clear, I do not equate human life with that of feral predators. Perhaps you do, and again you are most welcome to that opinion. It seems to offend you that I don't hold them in the same esteem as humans, but there it is. I protect my family, my property, and myself...by any means I deem suitable. And against any and all threats, immediate OR potential. You say to kill to live is O.K. by you? Soooo...if I and others kill to protect our livestock, our pets, and possibly our families, is that not ensuring our lives and livelihood? Either way, your reaction (and quite likely a bit more) is expected for that posting. So long as you sleep well at night. I know I do.

GOLD DUCK | 07-21-2008 04:24 PM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. Quote:
Originally Posted by Jonas Parker (Post 1202818) Don't coyotes like duck as much as they like road-runners?
QWAK,Jonas Parker,Actualy I think they like DUCK much more -- WE don't RUN as fast --mostly sort of WADDEL.:wink: Thing IS I trim my TREES with a 12 gage SHOT GUN and DOUBLE (OO) buck shot,I believe it sort of IMPRESSED the local COYOTES both 4 leged and TWO! :wink: it aint real SMART to KILL a DUCK or any thing else on the property that I may not want to get killed naturaly.:grin: It does happen from time to time and then I just REMIND them -- that 12 gage is a GREAT reminder TOOL!:wink::hahaha::haha: the DUCK

Red_Leg | 07-21-2008 04:27 PM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. Quote:
Originally Posted by Squirrel Bait (Post 1200882) Coyotes are out of balance here in N. Illinois. Had a neighbor who had his dog beat up and the coyotes were stealing the dogs food, but if he turned on the lights to shoot 'em they were too quick and would run. His solution was a jury rigged motion sensor light that instead of turning on a light outside, it rang a bell in his house. He would get his shotgun loaded with buckshot, get ready at the door and have his wife turn on the light. First night he got two coyotes. Now they mostly leave him alone. They aren't stupid. But if they don't perceive a threat they will take advantage of you. s
Hello Squirrel Bait, Good post! I still think the advances starting in the 60's in agriculture/terrain have had alot to do with the coyote numbers increasing. The demise of fence and hedge rows, which exposed the pheasants, quail, feral cats, etc and made the terrain a true 'open range', broadened the coyotes territory and their need to have more room to pack and run their prey down as they do here. I do not think they will go away soon unless agriculture as we know it today regresses.

GOLD DUCK | 07-21-2008 04:45 PM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. Quote:
Originally Posted by stranger (Post 1202848) Your opinion Duck, and you are entitled to it. For what it's worth, a human trespassing on my land with the intent to work ill on me or mine would be eliminated with just as much prejudice, and I'd be in the right. I got that particular trick from a wildlife enforcement officer. It's a lttle more humane than the way we used to do it. Hang a steel leader and shark hook from a limb and thread the hook with a hotdog, and walk away... I see where you'd draw the comparison to American Indians and smallpox, and I can't say I didn't expect it. Just so we're clear, I do not equate human life with that of feral predators. Perhaps you do, and again you are most welcome to that opinion. It seems to offend you that I don't hold them in the same esteem as humans, but there it is. I protect my family, my property, and myself...by any means I deem suitable. And against any and all threats, immediate OR potential. You say to kill to live is O.K. by you? Soooo...if I and others kill to protect our livestock, our pets, and possibly our families, is that not ensuring our lives and livelihood? Either way, your reaction (and quite likely a bit more) is expected for that posting. So long as you sleep well at night. I know I do.
QWAK,stranger,You have FREE WILL and FREE CHOICE --I would NOT -- even IF I could -- take away that ,which even GOD can't take AWAY from YOU!:grin: ALL things are GOOD (GOD) and PEOPLE are not nessarely ALWAYS at the top of the PRIORITY LIST for GOD!:wink: I figure there is a better than 50/50 chance that in the near future COYETES may be nessary to clean up the HUMAN BODIES left ware the fell killed DEAD by other HUMANS who played with GENETICS and little BUGS and made them MORE DEADLY!:thinkey::yes: What goes AROUND comes AROUND -- you may want to PONDER on that concept -- KARMA has a way of doing THAT balance thing --often in the EXTREAM!:wink: Generly speaking AVOIDING KILLING is best but I agree some times LIMITED killing is nessary comes down to personal choice and judgment but need to be REASNOBLE and PRUDENT with the minimal KILL posable!:grin: BTW: Some PEOPLE need KILLING TOO!:yes: the DUCK

stranger | 07-21-2008 07:32 PM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. Won't disagree with that Duck. To each his own. Mebbe in the next life I'll come back as a 'yote...or a 'yote's dinner. Unfortunately, predators being what they are and doing what they do, they are sometimes lead into direct conflict with our lives, and when that happens, people usually prevail. Good conversation and advanced without rancor. Very good example of disagreement not necessarily becoming impasse. And yes, many, many more two legged predators deserving of the long dirt nap. Cheers Duck...

Avalon | 07-21-2008 08:31 PM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. Quote:
Originally Posted by stranger (Post 1202781) Want 'em gone?...live trap one and inject it with about 10x the normal dose of distemper vaccine, then let it go. It's a live virus, and the 'hotel carry it right back to the den and kill everyone of 'em outright. They have no natural predators, and can throw an entire ecosystem out of balance, not to mention what they can and will do to livestock and pets. They get eliminated by any means around here.
Dear Lord:bear_w00t: Talk about screwing with he balance of nature.!!! First off have you ever watched an animal die from distemper? Its a horrible and long death that goes through many stages including neurological when it hits the brain. I would not wish it on my worst enemy. There is a huge difference between quickly shooting an animal and inflicting a horrid and painful death that can last a week. Second distemper is also deadly to other animals including the domestic dog. When you take a vaccine and abuse it in this manner you are basically tampering with the only line of defense the domestic dog has against the disease. The bottomine is certain coyotes will survive this mega dose of vaccine and distemper. Then you stand the very real possibility of creating a super strain that over rides the vaccine and it is not only dangerous to wildlife but the domestic dog in particular..

Red_Leg | 07-21-2008 08:56 PM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. I'd bet my bottom silver dollar that coyotes have been chasing down and eating or chewing/mauling feral cats that have distemper for decades. They probably already have a higher resistance to that and many other diseases. Agriculture/terrrain will only change their #'s, IMO.

StackerKen | 07-21-2008 10:26 PM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. Quote:
Originally Posted by Red_Leg (Post 1203172) I'd bet my bottom silver dollar that coyotes have been chasing down and eating or chewing/mauling feral cats that have distemper for decades. They probably already have a higher resistance to that and many other diseases.
Very good point I live in the foothills of central Ca. We have lots of coyotes...saw one this morn. as a mater o fact Hear em all the time doesn't bother me we have four dogs that live out side...never bother them. We have lost a few cats over the years.... But thats just part of country livin. Haven't lost any chickens...Yet We have a young horse that chases Yotes when he sees em :D Maybe he's pertectin his freind (our Goat) I say unless the are robbing you....Leave em be

stranger | 07-21-2008 11:02 PM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. Quote:
Originally Posted by Avalon (Post 1203153) Dear Lord:bear_w00t: Talk about screwing with he balance of nature.!!! First off have you ever watched an animal die from distemper? Its a horrible and long death that goes through many stages including neurological when it hits the brain. I would not wish it on my worst enemy. There is a huge difference between quickly shooting an animal and inflicting a horrid and painful death that can last a week. Second distemper is also deadly to other animals including the domestic dog. When you take a vaccine and abuse it in this manner you are basically tampering with the only line of defense the domestic dog has against the disease. The bottomine is certain coyotes will survive this mega dose of vaccine and distemper. Then you stand the very real possibility of creating a super strain that over rides the vaccine and it is not only dangerous to wildlife but the domestic dog in particular..
I have seen the effects of distemper Avalon. Have you ever watched a coyote pack run a pregnant heifer to exhaustion, to force a miscarriage, so that they can eat the aborted calf? Have you seen woods that are nearly devoid of deer, turkey, fox, rabbit, and quail beacuse of the predatory and breeding nature of a coyote pack? Have you ever seen a family pet mauled and torn to pieces crawl home with it's guts dragging behind it? Have you ever put a bullet between the eyes of a colt because a pack had eaten it's hindquarters and privates completely off? I have no sympathy. Second, distemper can't live outside a host for more than a few minutes. If a dog, which should have been immunized in the first place, does come into contact with a killed den, they should have no problems. Third, canine mortality in coyotes is better than 90% in pups, less so in adult animals. The 'yotes that don't die do develop immunity, but over time, the population density becomes less than is sustainable. The pack will be forced to die out or move. There is no such thing as a "super strain" of immune coyote. An animal is either immune, or it's not. Immunity is not passed from parent to pup. The worst thing you will have is an immune carrier of the virus, eliminating younger members of the pack. I aired all these concerns with the wildlife officer who told me about the technique. I know it is used in MS, AL, and FL to control 'yote populations, by state game and fish commissions, in urban and rural areas.

stranger | 07-21-2008 11:07 PM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. Quote:
Originally Posted by Red_Leg (Post 1203172) I'd bet my bottom silver dollar that coyotes have been chasing down and eating or chewing/mauling feral cats that have distemper for decades. They probably already have a higher resistance to that and many other diseases. Agriculture/terrrain will only change their #'s, IMO.
Cats don't contract canine distemper, and dogs are not susceptible to the feline strain.

Red_Leg | 07-21-2008 11:47 PM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. Quote:
Originally Posted by stranger (Post 1203304) Cats don't contract canine distemper, and dogs are not susceptible to the feline strain.
I looked that up on the good old internet and you are right! I stand corrected. But I gotta tell ya, stranger, injecting any living thing with what you propose is mmmmm kinda ghoulish. But....I'm not about to go out and field test distemper on felines or canines. You try it and let me know how it turns out :wink:

Raven | 07-22-2008 03:59 AM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. Hmmm, The original issue of this thread was the coyotes yapping and making noise. You really want to go through all this killing to surpress the sounds of nature??? Two dogs together will work as a team to fend off coyotes if trained properly. Keep your cats in the house at night (or in a barn) cats decimate the bird population but are good for mice and rats. Protect them by housing them. There are ways to live with nature and minimize killing. Deer and other wild life survived quite well with coyotes and wolves. I have a hard time believing they have emptied the woods around anybody's house.

StackerKen | 07-22-2008 07:30 AM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. Quote:
Originally Posted by Raven (Post 1203489) Hmmm, The original issue of this thread was the coyotes yapping and making noise. You really want to go through all this killing to surpress the sounds of nature??? There are ways to live with nature and minimize killing. Deer and other wild life survived quite well with coyotes and wolves. I have a hard time believing they have emptied the woods around anybody's house.
:applause_:applause_:applause_

stranger | 07-22-2008 08:41 AM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. Quote:
Originally Posted by Raven (Post 1203489) Hmmm, The original issue of this thread was the coyotes yapping and making noise. You really want to go through all this killing to surpress the sounds of nature??? Two dogs together will work as a team to fend off coyotes if trained properly. Keep your cats in the house at night (or in a barn) cats decimate the bird population but are good for mice and rats. Protect them by housing them. There are ways to live with nature and minimize killing. Deer and other wild life survived quite well with coyotes and wolves. I have a hard time believing they have emptied the woods around anybody's house.
No Raven, I would not do such a thing over noise. What I'm speaking of is a population explosion in the coyote numbers, like we had where I lived as a teen. Multiple packs of animals were killing livestock on a nightly basis on farms all around because they had decimated their natural foodsources. In addition to the trapping and infecting, the MDWFP put a paid bounty on 'yotes, and would come out and poison fresh kills in hopes the coyotes would return to feed. Two properly trained dogs would have become two properly trained corpses had they encountered a pack of hungry coyotes like this. I'm sure coyotes did not completley eliminate deer, or turkey, or other wildlife, but they did force the remaining populations to move. I can remember hunting all day and not seeing so much as a deer track on my grandads' place. Instead of moving with them, the coyotes remained and began to utilize livestock and pets as their primary source of sustenance. Today, I can see deer and turkey on my place everday, as well as a healthy cottontail population. The quail population never recovered, though some of that has not been coyote related. Yes, certainly there are ways to live with nature and minimize killing. And then there are certain animals that get shot on sight where I come from. I can guarantee that there are coyote populations moving at least transiently through my place and my neighbors even now. I see their scat and tracks periodically. So long as their numbers are kept in check and no livestock or pets are threatened, they generally get left alone. I still have zero respect for them and shoot 'em on sight, but neither I nor anyone else I know around here has set out to completely eliminate them from the ecosystem.

stranger | 07-22-2008 08:56 AM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. Quote:
Originally Posted by Red_Leg (Post 1203349) ...kinda ghoulish.
Yeah Red, kinda ghoulish, but effective. Quote:
Originally Posted by Red_Leg (Post 1203349) But....I'm not about to go out and field test distemper on felines or canines. You try it and let me know how it turns out :wink:
Well, people can't get distemper either. As I understand it, we can contract the virus, but suffer no ill effects from it. Closest human strain cousin to the virus is measles, and as most of the population already has had or has been immunized to that, we might likely not ever contract any distemper strain.

Fixture | 07-22-2008 09:12 AM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. Interesting commentary abounds in this thread and I thank all who chimed in. I'll be letting the coyotes alone for now and see what happens. If anyone is interested, I found a neat website that's pertinent. Try http://www.coyotehuntinginfo.com/ ...particularly note the 'decoy' page...kinda funny! :s9:

Onboard | 07-26-2008 02:27 PM
Re: So I've got a coyote problem. Quote:
Originally Posted by GOLD DUCK (Post 1201133) QWAK,Onboard,Boston range about half way between Fayetteville and Fort Smith. The building of the new I 540 highway disrupted natural balance a bunch and will take conciderable time to reestablish equlibrium. GREED and commerce seem to be the only factors that limit human expancion and also propell it --- people see only what they want to see and ignore every thing else or just try to PUSH it out of the way -- THEY like to call it PROGRESS but it is just a word that sounds nice and seems to justify about any thing they want to do!:yes::rant: Indian barrial grounds were bulldosed and covered over fast so there "PROJECT" would not be stoped or delayed. I had an option on 80 achers that linked to my 40 which was taken by the highway project, it had a creek with a small water fall and a small pool in front of the water fall with big flat rock you could lay on in the sun to dry off after going skinny diping to cool off on hot summer days --- GONE -- now diverted to a culvert pipe under the new HIGHWAY!:censored::508: The state condemed the property and payed $200.00 per acher!:censored::realmad: Brown and Routs made lots of $$$ I guess THEY concider that PROGRESS! the DUCK
Duck, I asked a question and promptly ran off. That was rude, my apologies. That neck of the woods you live in is a pretty place. Been a while since I've passed through that area though. Hate that you missed out on that piece of property, greedy bastids ain't they? Also glad to know that you won't hold it agin me fer killin a few coyotes :D Later neighbor.

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