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RoadKing | 02-04-2009 07:53 PM
Need help with where to Start..... If already posted I apologize.... Truth be known, being new, and reading thread after thread is just mind boggling. So....I basically have nothing, nada, with regards to supplies, and believe I should try to aquire a minimum 6 mos to 1 year of supplies for my wife and I, for starters. For examples: If I go and buy bags of wheat etc....and I don't have a manual grinder, that stuff is pretty useless to me, yes? Should I simply buy MRE's from one source, or buy from multiple sources? The list goes on and on..... I am trying to figure out: Where to start? Who to purchase from? What 'minimaly' do I need? What is the cost range I am lookin at? (How many FRN's required) Does anyone have a comprehesive 'phased' purchasing list made up they would like to share? Thanks in Advance, RK :15_1_70v:

Mill Man | 02-04-2009 08:06 PM
Re: Need help with where to Start..... MRE's, wheat grinders, and things like that are expensive. Whats cheap is buying what you already eat when its on sale. Thats the place to start. If you eat 12 cans of chill a year and chill is good for 2 years, buy 24 cans of chilli. Resupply when you get down to 16ish cans of chill, always when you catch it on sale again. Do this with all the staples you eat and you can't lose money. Once you get started with that then you can look into the other stuff.

Ralleia | 02-04-2009 08:06 PM
Re: Need help with where to Start..... I think that you have identified a significant (in importance and in workload) task. I don't think the comprehensive list and how-to exists in one place though. We could use the thread to pull together information. Here's a start that I found interesting: http://www.thepowerhour.com/news/ite...ppearfirst.htm 100 Items to Disappear First (in a crisis/panic) 1. Generators (Good ones cost dearly. Gas storage, risky. Noisy...target of thieves; maintenance etc.) 2. Water Filters/Purifiers 3. Portable Toilets 4. Seasoned Firewood. Wood takes about 6 - 12 months to become dried, for home uses. 5. Lamp Oil, Wicks, Lamps (First Choice: Buy CLEAR oil. If scarce, stockpile ANY!) 6. Coleman Fuel. Impossible to stockpile too much. 7. Guns, Ammunition, Pepper Spray, Knives, Clubs, Bats & Slingshots. 8. Hand-can openers, & hand egg beaters, whisks. 9. Honey/Syrups/white, brown sugar 10. Rice - Beans - Wheat 11. Vegetable Oil (for cooking) Without it food burns/must be boiled etc.,) 12. Charcoal, Lighter Fluid (Will become scarce suddenly) 13. Water Containers (Urgent Item to obtain.) Any size. Small: HARD CLEAR PLASTIC ONLY - note - food grade if for drinking. 14. Mini Heater head (Propane) (Without this item, propane won't heat a room.) 15. Grain Grinder (Non-electric) 16. Propane Cylinders (Urgent: Definite shortages will occur. 17. Survival Guide Book. 18. Mantles: Aladdin, Coleman, etc. (Without this item, longer-term lighting is difficult.) 19. Baby Supplies: Diapers/formula. ointments/aspirin, etc. 20. Washboards, Mop Bucket w/wringer (for Laundry) 21. Cookstoves (Propane, Coleman & Kerosene) 22. Vitamins 23. Propane Cylinder Handle-Holder (Urgent: Small canister use is dangerous without this item) 24. Feminine Hygiene/Haircare/Skin products. 25. Thermal underwear (Tops & Bottoms) 26. Bow saws, axes and hatchets, Wedges (also, honing oil) 27. Aluminum Foil Reg. & Heavy Duty (Great Cooking and Barter Item) 28. Gasoline Containers (Plastic & Metal) 29. Garbage Bags (Impossible To Have Too Many). 30. Toilet Paper, Kleenex, Paper Towels 31. Milk - Powdered & Condensed (Shake Liquid every 3 to 4 months) 32. Garden Seeds (Non-Hybrid) (A MUST) 33. Clothes pins/line/hangers (A MUST) 34. Coleman's Pump Repair Kit 35. Tuna Fish (in oil) 36. Fire Extinguishers (or..large box of Baking Soda in every room) 37. First aid kits 38. Batteries (all sizes...buy furthest-out for Expiration Dates) 39. Garlic, spices & vinegar, baking supplies 40. Big Dogs (and plenty of dog food) 41. Flour, yeast & salt 42. Matches. {"Strike Anywhere" preferred.) Boxed, wooden matches will go first 43. Writing paper/pads/pencils, solar calculators 44. Insulated ice chests (good for keeping items from freezing in Wintertime.) 45. Workboots, belts, Levis & durable shirts 46. Flashlights/LIGHTSTICKS & torches, "No. 76 Dietz" Lanterns 47. Journals, Diaries & Scrapbooks (jot down ideas, feelings, experience; Historic Times) 48. Garbage cans Plastic (great for storage, water, transporting - if with wheels) 49. Men's Hygiene: Shampoo, Toothbrush/paste, Mouthwash/floss, nail clippers, etc 50. Cast iron cookware (sturdy, efficient) 51. Fishing supplies/tools 52. Mosquito coils/repellent, sprays/creams 53. Duct Tape 54. Tarps/stakes/twine/nails/rope/spikes 55. Candles 56. Laundry Detergent (liquid) 57. Backpacks, Duffel Bags 58. Garden tools & supplies 59. Scissors, fabrics & sewing supplies 60. Canned Fruits, Veggies, Soups, stews, etc. 61. Bleach (plain, NOT scented: 4 to 6% sodium hypochlorite) 62. Canning supplies, (Jars/lids/wax) 63. Knives & Sharpening tools: files, stones, steel 64. Bicycles...Tires/tubes/pumps/chains, etc 65. Sleeping Bags & blankets/pillows/mats 66. Carbon Monoxide Alarm (battery powered) 67. Board Games, Cards, Dice 68. d-con Rat poison, MOUSE PRUFE II, Roach Killer 69. Mousetraps, Ant traps & cockroach magnets 70. Paper plates/cups/utensils (stock up, folks) 71. Baby wipes, oils, waterless & Antibacterial soap (saves a lot of water) 72. Rain gear, rubberized boots, etc. 73. Shaving supplies (razors & creams, talc, after shave) 74. Hand pumps & siphons (for water and for fuels) 75. Soysauce, vinegar, bullions/gravy/soupbase 76. Reading glasses 77. Chocolate/Cocoa/Tang/Punch (water enhancers) 78. "Survival-in-a-Can" 79. Woolen clothing, scarves/ear-muffs/mittens 80. Boy Scout Handbook, / also Leaders Catalog 81. Roll-on Window Insulation Kit (MANCO) 82. Graham crackers, saltines, pretzels, Trail mix/Jerky 83. Popcorn, Peanut Butter, Nuts 84. Socks, Underwear, T-shirts, etc. (extras) 85. Lumber (all types) 86. Wagons & carts (for transport to and from) 87. Cots & Inflatable mattress's 88. Gloves: Work/warming/gardening, etc. 89. Lantern Hangers 90. Screen Patches, glue, nails, screws,, nuts & bolts 91. Teas 92. Coffee 93. Cigarettes 94. Wine/Liquors (for bribes, medicinal, etc,) 95. Paraffin wax 96. Glue, nails, nuts, bolts, screws, etc. 97. Chewing gum/candies 98. Atomizers (for cooling/bathing) 99. Hats & cotton neckerchiefs 100. Goats/chickens From a Sarajevo War Survivor: Experiencing horrible things that can happen in a war - death of parents and friends, hunger and malnutrition, endless freezing cold, fear, sniper attacks. 1. Stockpiling helps. but you never no how long trouble will last, so locate near renewable food sources. 2. Living near a well with a manual pump is like being in Eden. 3. After awhile, even gold can lose its luster. But there is no luxury in war quite like toilet paper. Its surplus value is greater than gold's. 4. If you had to go without one utility, lose electricity - it's the easiest to do without (unless you're in a very nice climate with no need for heat.) 5. Canned foods are awesome, especially if their contents are tasty without heating. One of the best things to stockpile is canned gravy - it makes a lot of the dry unappetizing things you find to eat in war somewhat edible. Only needs enough heat to "warm", not to cook. It's cheap too, especially if you buy it in bulk. 6. Bring some books - escapist ones like romance or mysteries become more valuable as the war continues. Sure, it's great to have a lot of survival guides, but you'll figure most of that out on your own anyway - trust me, you'll have a lot of time on your hands. 7. The feeling that you're human can fade pretty fast. I can't tell you how many people I knew who would have traded a much needed meal for just a little bit of toothpaste, rouge, soap or cologne. Not much point in fighting if you have to lose your humanity. These things are morale-builders like nothing else. 8. Slow burning candles and matches, matches, matches

RatHoler | 02-04-2009 08:13 PM
Re: Need help with where to Start..... http://goldismoney.info/forums/showthread.php?t=258820

damoc | 02-04-2009 08:18 PM
Re: Need help with where to Start..... Quote:
Originally Posted by Mill Man (Post 1550332) MRE's, wheat grinders, and things like that are expensive. Whats cheap is buying what you already eat when its on sale. Thats the place to start. If you eat 12 cans of chill a year and chill is good for 2 years, buy 24 cans of chilli. Resupply when you get down to 16ish cans of chill, always when you catch it on sale again. Do this with all the staples you eat and you can't lose money. Once you get started with that then you can look into the other stuff.
this is where i have got to disagree you can get units that will do the job at most local antique stores for 25 to 45 dollars and they seem to last forever. wheat can also be sprouted soaked and boiled hell grind it with a stone if you have to.it should be in everybodies stock. same goes for barley but it is better if it is sprouted/malted before being ground into flour

Cassandra | 02-04-2009 08:31 PM
Re: Need help with where to Start..... Quote:
Originally Posted by Mill Man (Post 1550332) MRE's, wheat grinders, and things like that are expensive. Whats cheap is buying what you already eat when its on sale. Thats the place to start. If you eat 12 cans of chill a year and chill is good for 2 years, buy 24 cans of chilli. Resupply when you get down to 16ish cans of chill, always when you catch it on sale again. Do this with all the staples you eat and you can't lose money. Once you get started with that then you can look into the other stuff.
+1. Stock up on canned food: veggies, spam, soups. Also big sacks of rice (25-50lb), dried pasta, beans like pintos, kidney beans, black beans, lentils. These are all very cheap, nourishing, and will keep for many years. Sugar, salt, shortening/oil. Get a good stock of these basics in your pantry/garage/cellar, then you can take time to optimize for the "best" stuff to have. Just do a bit more every shopping trip, or whatever you can manage. I got 2 25lb bags of wheat even though I haven't found the right grinder yet. It was cheap, and better to have food but no grinder than the reverse.

RoadKing | 02-04-2009 09:09 PM
Re: Need help with where to Start..... Quote:
Originally Posted by damoc (Post 1550375) wheat can also be sprouted soaked and boiled hell grind it with a stone if you have to.it should be in everybodies stock. same goes for barley but it is better if it is sprouted/malted before being ground into flour
Not to sound stupid, but what the hey does that mean? Is there a book or resource that explains what you are stating? Is this the 'Normal' way to handle sprout/malt wheat and barley? Thanks again....

AOW | 02-04-2009 09:20 PM
Re: Need help with where to Start..... Not to advertise for anyone, but after buying several MRE's to be set for my family for a weeklong event, I ordered two 275-meal buckets from Costco.com. I was then up to a few months of emergency food. Buying extra cans of things on sale whenever I go shopping has brought my supplies for my family up to about a year;s worth now.

scyth | 02-04-2009 09:40 PM
Re: Need help with where to Start..... Quote:
Originally Posted by RoadKing (Post 1550505) Not to sound stupid, but what the hey does that mean? Is there a book or resource that explains what you are stating? Is this the 'Normal' way to handle sprout/malt wheat and barley? Thanks again....
RoadKing - You hit the meat of the matter on the head. One of the things which really irritates me Is the consumer driven approach to preps. "O shit i need a generator and fuel and a medical kit and lots of matches And propane/white gas/kerosene/diesel And lots of food and an extra freezer and Weapons and ammunition and reloading supplies and Toilet paper and antibiotics and toothpaste And the list goes on forever............." Yup, and o shit I need to stockpile all this stuff so I need to build a warehouse too. My own term for this is McMansion Survival. What you need, first, is knowledge, as you said. That is the critical path. We have so many levels of dependency and co-dependency on existing technology (a lot of it totally unecessary) That its kinda hard to see the forest for the trees. What I would suggest is a small plan. The scenario is this: You do not have power (i.e., electric, natural gas, automobile gas) For one month. Neither do you have mobility except on foot. Given the situation, your job is also shut down. Of course, you cannot get to the bank either physically or online To manage financial transactions. If you manage to get to a store for anything, they are out of stock. And its winter. So, the question is, what knowledge do I need For bare minimum survival for one month, Assuming these conditions. Hell, start with just one week, then go to a month. From there you can develop a list of what stuff you really need, And from there you can develop a list of what more knowledge, And what more stuff, you might need for a year. I'll say it again. Knowledge and planning drives the program. Not purchasing. You will be amazed at how little you really need. Just my .02 scyth

damoc | 02-04-2009 09:57 PM
Re: Need help with where to Start..... Quote:
Originally Posted by RoadKing (Post 1550505) Not to sound stupid, but what the hey does that mean? Is there a book or resource that explains what you are stating? Is this the 'Normal' way to handle sprout/malt wheat and barley? Thanks again....
there is tons of info on the internet just google sprouting and malting when you sprout seeds it releases nutrients in the seeds which were often undigestable before they were sprouted.not to mention sprouts are very tasty and a welcome treat if other "spring greens" are not available. very simple to do all you need is a quart or gallon jar and a bit of cheese cloth or other breathable fabric.many many different seeds can be sprouted most people like to start with alfalfa but wheat and barley and beans also make good sprouts many grass seeds that we would have trouble digesting can be sprouted to make them more nutritious. malting also involves sprouting but the sprouting is stopped prematuely normally by drying this traps the enzymes in the grain.these enzymes are what convert the starches in grains into sugars to be used in such delacasies as beer. malting of barley makes it better for use in flour,look at the back of the flower you buy at the grocery store it probably contains as well as wheat malted barley.i think malted barley is also cheap as comapred to wheat?? for use in flour. i could not possibly do this subject justice please check on the internet or at your library/bookstore it will open a world of possibilites to you. sorry if my post is confusing all i was originally trying to say is that with a little knowledge some bags of grain are a cheap fast start to some preps and you could buy a years worth of food for about the same price as a month of prepared stuff that we normally eat.

damoc | 02-04-2009 10:12 PM
Re: Need help with where to Start..... another plus for grains is they can be planted and fed to livestock

Sparky | 02-04-2009 10:47 PM
Re: Need help with where to Start..... I sense panic. My first advice would be: don't panic. You have time. Start with a more modest goal of 1-month. I agree with Mil-man: From the list of things you normally buy, start making quadruple purchases of those items which have a shelf life greater than a year. (Examples: canned food, pasta, etc.) If you panic, you will find yourself oversupplied in some stuff, undersupplied in others, and not enough money.

AMforPM | 02-04-2009 11:16 PM
Re: Need help with where to Start..... Also, read your way back through this section of the site. Your questions have been asked, and other good ones, and discussed, many times. There's a lot of info in the back pages.

nickelless | 02-05-2009 03:05 AM
Re: Need help with where to Start..... With regard to wheat, flour can go rancid very quickly when it's exposed to air. Don't grind your grain until you're ready to use it or else you could have hundreds of pounds of flour that won't be fit to use.

Cast Iron | 02-05-2009 08:52 AM
Re: Need help with where to Start..... I agree with Scyth's approach. How can you know for sure what's coming? Or what will be left afterwards? The ability to adapt and improvise based on knowledge is paramount. Can't buy your way out of that, but you�ll always need water, food, shelter. Take time now to become as self sufficient and sustainable as possible. Search �LDS preparedness manual�. It�s a 122 page PDF. Find it, save it, read it. Now I'm not one, and it's not a plug for their teachings. However, the manual is very detailed around storing food and water. It�s a good start to get your house in order�

CrufflerJJ | 02-05-2009 10:54 AM
Re: Need help with where to Start..... Quote:
Originally Posted by Cast Iron (Post 1551143) Search “LDS preparedness manual“. It’s a 122 page PDF. Find it, save it, read it. Now I'm not one, and it's not a plug for their teachings. However, the manual is very detailed around storing food and water. It’s a good start to get your house in order…
One step at a time. I agree that the LDS prep manual seems to be a decent resource, and also HIGHLY recommend ldscatalog.com for a low cost source (free shipping!) of #10 canned wheat & pinto beans, along with oxygen absorbers & 1 gal mylar bags. If you have any LDS friends, they may also be able to get you access to the local LDS cannery, where you could buy low cost wheat/grains/canned goodies.

TheSimpleton | 02-05-2009 03:25 PM
Re: Need help with where to Start..... Scyth has my view in brief. Two things: knowledge is all. With knowledge, a pocket knife, and a tin can, you can make all. Without knowledge and all the supplies in the world will fail. Knowledge is very, very, very cheap. It also can't be taken from you or stolen, which I guarantee your tools and preps will. Search here for the book list. I'd pick edible wild plants, gardening books, and primative re-enactment. Survival books generally have info that is presented all wrong, since they depend on the SAR team to helicopter in and rescue you. That won't be happening. The others think you'll shoot your way out if you have enough guns. That won't be happening either. You're better off learning what people did in the last Great Depression, which may be the technological level we fall too. That said, let's run down how to think about this. Start with a Bronze age person, New or Old world. What do they need? A knife, a pot, a cloak, a basket. Move up to the Colonial period. What do they have? Axes, saws, shovels, even Scythes, hand pumps, blankets, beds, seeds, orchards, graineries and mills. Move on to the Covered-wagon frontier, what did they take? Revolvers, coats, advanced farm machinery. And so on until you reach today. Roughly what you need to get first, second, and third runs into this group. The toughest, cheapest, quickest, most reliable, bare-bones non-technological tools first. On the whole, no one will want them or steal them. And you're in the modern age! You can get a Wiggy's synthetic bag and a Estwing all-steel hatchet primatives would die for, and get them delivered to your door in a week! The rest depends largely on your situation? Do you live in an apartment? Near an outdoor ramble or no? How much room--safe, hidden room--can you rustle for storage? Are you tied into a group like your family or clan? Do you have basically unlimited capital to throw at it? Are you deeply in debt? Are you trying to get in or out of the markets? Will your other half be onboard or not? Do you read well or are you a hands on learner? Those are things only you can strategize. But that's the way in which I'd go about it. Personally--and you'd never guess this--I'm a good reader, so I read everything out there on primitiveism, Native peoples, gardening, and survival. Then everything on economics, gold, and specifics, like firearms, electricity, and engines. This has made me stupider than ever, but at least I know what sort of things I want and need to focus on first. Just start, and don't worry too much about it. The only thing you need to get somewhere is the desire and persistent effort. TS �The things that will destroy us are, politics without principle, pleasure without conscience, wealth without work, knowledge without character, business without morality, science without humanity, and worship without sacrifice,� -- Mahatma Gandhi.

Sparky | 02-05-2009 03:39 PM
Re: Need help with where to Start..... Can someone recommend a single survival manual that best captures these skills and knowledge?

Awoke | 02-05-2009 04:17 PM
Re: Need help with where to Start..... Quote:
Originally Posted by Sparky (Post 1551979) Can someone recommend a single survival manual that best captures these skills and knowledge?
This book Amazon captures most of them. Everything from growing wheat to raising chickens to whatever else. EDIT - Damn it all. I didn't type "Amazon captures most of them", I typed "This book captures most of them", but amazon somehow highjacked my post when I linked it.

Lt Dan | 02-05-2009 04:26 PM
Re: Need help with where to Start..... RK, have you talked this over with your SO? I'd get her input on the food storage thing, unless you're the cook. In that case, just buy what you normally think you'd like to eat. I'm thinking MRE's would be the eotwawki, just regular eating food that would last you through the hard times. Fact is, I hate MRE's and do not plan on ever stocking those. We've lots of rice, but no wheat. I tried that wheat thing and it ended up becoming green manure for the garden. Also, beens, herbs and spices, garden produce works good canned too, if you're in a location you can do that. It's a renewable food source. Let me put it real simple as in KISS. Food, water, shelter and creature comforts. Build on those. Your brain is the most valuable of all, so guard your sanity.

TechGuy | 02-05-2009 04:55 PM
Re: Need help with where to Start..... Quote:
Originally Posted by Awoke (Post 1552046) This book captures most of them. Everything from growing wheat to raising chickens to whatever else. EDIT - Damn it all. I didn't type "Amazon captures most of them", I typed "This book captures most of them", but amazon somehow highjacked my post when I linked it.
I have that one, worth the money. Not inclusive, but should be part of the library.

SilverCity | 02-05-2009 05:10 PM
Re: Need help with where to Start..... LDS Preparedness Manual (not affiliated with them) http://www.green-trust.org/freebooks/Preparedness.pdf

Jimfrancisco | 02-05-2009 05:32 PM
Re: Need help with where to Start..... I have all the guns and ammunition I need, all the fuel I need, all the power generators I need, and if anything goes wrong all the spares I need. My family have been doing this for almost 100 years (not mormons) I think it must be genetic... food - not so much. But I have 100 acres to shoot on, grow on, and fish from. Meds - maybe 6 months worth, as they do go "off". And the whole lot? Cost me about $3000. BO place was a hunting lodge, handed down through the family.

hypervel | 02-05-2009 05:42 PM
Re: Need help with where to Start..... Quote:
Originally Posted by RoadKing (Post 1550306) If already posted I apologize.... Truth be known, being new, and reading thread after thread is just mind boggling. So....I basically have nothing, nada, with regards to supplies, and believe I should try to aquire a minimum 6 mos to 1 year of supplies for my wife and I, for starters. For examples: If I go and buy bags of wheat etc....and I don't have a manual grinder, that stuff is pretty useless to me, yes? Should I simply buy MRE's from one source, or buy from multiple sources? The list goes on and on..... I am trying to figure out: Where to start? Who to purchase from? What 'minimaly' do I need? What is the cost range I am lookin at? (How many FRN's required) Does anyone have a comprehesive 'phased' purchasing list made up they would like to share? Thanks in Advance, RK :15_1_70v:
I didn't read any of the other posts...... 1) water 2) food 3)"security" (flexible definition) 1) water-filters and access, maybe storage 2)food-franchise McDonald's on a nearby property. Short of that, more of storable items...that IS your phase in program..."...and a can for Jesus." {that's my little thing} 3) money/assets/weapons...sometimes each is the same as the other. Get a move on. My bones are telling my time's up, but I've been known to go off a little early:452:

TTAZZMAN | 02-05-2009 05:59 PM
Re: Need help with where to Start..... Quote:
Originally Posted by hypervel (Post 1552206) I didn't read any of the other posts...... 1) water 2) food 3)"security" (flexible definition) 1) water-filters and access, maybe storage 2)food-franchise McDonald's on a nearby property. Short of that, more of storable items...that IS your phase in program..."...and a can for Jesus." {that's my little thing} 3) money/assets/weapons...sometimes each is the same as the other. Get a move on. My bones are telling my time's up, but I've been known to go off a little early:452:
:ok::ok: If i were just starting i would think just like that post #1 how can you get good drinkable water if the faucets quit working? #2 how can you get food to survive if stores arnt open #3 if you have food or water how can you protect you and your family from others who dont have those things Short Term SHTF I figure the city dwellers would need to be able to survive till the starving riot and the military takes over and provides food and water Weather Emergency and i also figure how would you survive thru a issue like the ice storms/huricanes/earthquakes etc....no power...all roads blocked so you cant drive to get ANYTHING...anywhere within walking distance has no power also...deadly weather... Long term SHTF you will have to be able to find renewable sources for all of the above on a year to year basis and have a means to produce and trade goods and services

electric-amish | 02-05-2009 07:05 PM
Re: Need help with where to Start..... http://www.werlingandsons.com/products.aspx?catID=1 Canned food--Electrical Backup--ways to cook - Water Ways out of hot zone----Cars--Bikes--Boats--underground shelter

ImaCannin | 02-05-2009 08:01 PM
Re: Need help with where to Start..... Preps or things that come in handy Solar Lantern http://www.athenabrands.com/productc...&idproduct=180 Sun Oven https://www.sunoven.com/ (Their is a lady in SLC that sells these from her home. Also a green store on 33rd and highland?(I cant remember the exact addy. Its where we got ours) You can also make your own out of a cardboard box, tin foil and a piece of glass. Back To Basics Book Amazon Amazon This is a book that shows you how to do things by hand. It is very informative and very easy to understand. Rechargeable batteries Amazon Amazon Solar Battery Charger Amazon Amazon All American Pressure Cooker/Canner Amazon Amazon Grain Mill http://www.pleasanthillgrain.com/cou...ving_mill.aspx Food Saver Amazon Amazon Food Saver Canning Jar lid sealer Amazon Amazon Canning Jars - Ace Hardware has 1/2 gallon jars, if you order them online they will deliver to the nearest Ace for free. They are great for putting up dry storage, reusable http://www.acehardware.com/product/i...Id=35257757433 Big Berky Water Purifier http://www.pleasanthillgrain.com/ber..._purifier.aspx SEEDS - you want to get non hybrid and non GMO, a lot of heirloom seed companies are running out of seeds. Seed Savers http://www.seedsavers.org/ Southern Exposure http://www.southernexposure.com/index.html Food Storage - Remember to check the ingredients, try to find stuff that does not have a lot of additives. Honeyville Grain - they are cheaper than most. Food is good. http://store.honeyvillegrain.com/ Emergency Essentials http://www.beprepared.com

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