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- - Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment (http://goldismoney.info/forums/showthread.php?t=334256)

Twisted Avatar | 12-24-2008 05:51 PM
Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Mr. Rawles. Regarding long range communications: If any SurvivalBlog readers are already ham operators they can join their county Radio Emergency Service (ARES) network.It already well established throughout the US. There are county emergency coordinators who have Same Time "meetings" on a regular basis. You might even become an Emergency Coordinator for your County. I would strongly recommend that our fellow readers get their ham Operator License no matter what. There is no longer a Morse Code requirement [for the Technician license] and the test in relatively simple . Then you can legally buy equipment, legally use it, as well as join the ARES community based organization, You will be privy to what's going on locally from a much larger perspective. If you choose, you can become FEMA certified and you will gain access to a nearly endless and very informative set of FEMA online communications. Believe me when I say the communications coming out of FEMA can be eye openers. I would also recommend that you set up an emergency backup power system to a 12 volt "base station" in your radio "shack". The 12 Volt radios use about 1 or 2 watts and a battery backup from a deep cycle battery that is solar charged will last a very very long time. I also have an older CB system in my Shack, just in case. There are still truckers that use CB radios. - Carl In Wisconsin Hello again, Mr. Rawles, I am still doing the "Ten Cent Challenge" (about a year) and I read the blog everyday. Since I last wrote to you that I was improving my Rifleman skills but I have also been working on my radio skills. I decided that getting a Ham radio license would be beneficial to me and my family and community, so I made a goal to get knowledgeable, equipped, and licensed. Before starting I hardly knew the difference between AC and DC power so I first got the Boy Scout Merit Badge books on Electricity, Electronics, and Radio. Then I picked up a manual from the Amateur Radio Relay League (ARRL) and started learning about radio. I thought your readers might be interested in knowing some details about amateur radio and it�s advantages in difficult times. The FCC issues three licenses for amateur radio: Technician, General, and Extra. Pretty much anyone can become licensed. There is no age limit. All you have to do is pass the written test for the license level you want to obtain. There is no Morse Code test anymore. The cost is $14 per test and you can check on the ARRL web site for a test site and time that is convenient for you. Just like with firearms and other tools, different radios and different frequencies and different transmission modes are good for some things but not for others. With a Technician license, you can transmit on certain frequency ranges (called �bands�) that are said to be in the Very High Frequency (VHF) and Ultra High Frequency (UHF) ranges. These frequencies really only work with line-of-site so they are good for local communications, like with search-and-rescue or talking to your buddies around town. With General and Extra licenses you can transmit on lower frequencies in what�s called the High Frequency (HF) bands. These frequencies are better for farther-than-line-of-site communications because the signals in these frequencies bounce off the atmosphere and can go quite long distances, hundreds and even thousands of miles, particularly at night. There are several modes of radio transmissions, each having advantages. Voice communication of course is the most natural mode but it also uses the most bandwidth and requires a pretty clear signal for intelligibility. Continuous Wave (CW), the mode used for Morse Code, uses a tiny amount of bandwidth and sometimes is the only way to communicate at some distances and ionospheric conditions. Morse Code is not a quaint old mode that geezers continue to do for fun. It sometimes is the only way to make contact, and it is used very frequently for long distance communication. And finally there is Digital communications which also use little bandwidth but which does require the use of some sort of computer to process the signals. There of course are many flavors of each mode and there are other lesser-used modes, like video, image, and satellite communications, but those are probably less useful in a survival situation. But they are all open to amateur radio operators. For my equipment, I opted for the most portable configurations available. VHF\UHF radios are readily available both in mobile configuration (meaning they are in a vehicle) and in portable configuration (meaning something you carry). For HF portable configurations, there are not as many options. The two leading portable HF radios are the Yaesu FT-817 and the Icom 703. I went with the Icom 703 and got all the necessary accessories to use it in the backpack configuration. So now I can walk around and make contact with people hundreds of miles away. Power is always an important consideration for radios, especially portable radios. Mobile radios can be powered by the car battery. It seems that each radio has it�s own power connector and I wanted to create some sort of standard power connector that I could use to plug everything into. It turns out that the Amateur Radio community has been dealing with the exact problem and they came up with the Andersen Powerpole connector [JWR recommended!] for DC-powered devices. They wanted a connector that was gender-less, did not require tools to connect or disconnect, and that could handle fairly high levels of amperage. I put an extremely short Powerpole line with fuses on the car battery, then connected a long Powerpole wire from this wire to the inside of the cab of my truck, and then put a four-way Powerpole splitter on the end of it all. Then each device has a Powerpole adapter with fuses than I can plug into the splitter in the cab (or any other Powerpole connector). This has worked out really well and is very modular. I have an adapter to plug any DC device into any DC power supply I know of. Since ham radios need a decent amount of power to transmit, portable radios usually need a fairly large battery pack, and often require Lithium-ion batteries. Portable power is a concern because lugging around a car battery would totally defeat the purpose of having a portable radio. When the radio receives signals it doesn�t require much power, only when it transmits. I got an Icom T90A VHF transceiver which comes with one Lithium-ion battery pack. Extra battery packs are quit expensive. What I found out is that there is an battery pack adapter that lets you put in 2 size AA batteries inside it, and it is in the exact same form as the Lithium-ion battery pack. The downside is that the voltage in this configuration only has about 2.5 V versus the 7.3 V of the supplied Lithium-ion battery pack, which also means that you can�t transmit on high power. But, it turns out that there are Lithium-ion batteries that have the same dimensions as AA batteries (but without the knob on the positive end) called �14500� batteries. They are 3.6V each so two of them together would be 7.4 V which is very close to the supplied Lithium-ion battery pack. Actually it turns out that all that�s in the supplied Lithium-ion battery pack is a couple of 14500 batteries. So rather than pay $50 for an extra battery pack, I paid about $7.50 for a couple of 14500 Lithium ion batteries. I bought a total of 20 �14500� batteries for the equivalent of 10 battery packs for about $75 rather than $500 for replaced Icom battery packs. Incidentally, almost all laptop batteries just have a similar type of battery in them called �18500.� So if you wanted to replace your laptop battery you could just carefully open the battery case and re-solder new 18500 batteries inside. They are about $4 a piece and there probably are only a few (4-6) of them in any given laptop battery. Note that Lithium-ion batteries need to be charged in a charger specifically designed for Lithium-ion batteries. And because the voltage of Lithium-ion batteries is about 3 times greater than AA batteries, you shouldn�t try to use Lithium-ion batteries in devices that only take regular AA batteries or you will probably fry something. It can take a lot of time and effort (and money) to learn how to effectively communicate using amateur radios, so why bother? I think the advantages are that you have means to communicate that do not rely on any system at all. There is no central radio system and you supply your own power so you don�t even need the power grid. You are essentially using the electromagnetic spectrum itself as the communication medium. You don�t need any other equipment besides two radios to communicate. Short distance radios like the Family Band radios you can buy at Wal-mart are good for very short distances, like just outside shouting range. They are good for around the ranch, on patrol, and in a convey. And you probably don�t really want outsiders eavesdropping on your communications. For communicating over a few to several miles, VHF radios work well. For across-town communication, city-to-neighboring-city, and rugged terrain operation, VHF is the way to go. And if there is a repeater close by, you can communicate with anyone else as long as you both can communicate with the repeater. This is why repeaters are often on mountaintops, so that people on opposite sides of the mountain can communicate. I bought a book of all the repeater locations and frequencies in the nation and I keep this with my VHF transceiver. But if you want to talk to some across the state, in the next state, or even in another country, you would need an HF radio. In the television show Jericho, the townspeople are just dying to know what�s going on outside their town. They don�t know what the governor is doing, let alone the President. They don�t know if the National Guard is coming. They don�t know what cities got hit by the bombs. They don�t know who did it. They basically had no information. If someone had an HF radio they could get all sorts of information. They could also transmit to others what they know. They could even contact family and friends to tell them that they were all right, and could find out if those family members and friends were all right, too. Shortwave receivers are better than nothing, but you are limited to only receiving information, and usually just from voice modes (no Morse Code, digital, or even some types of voice modes) from commercial and government broadcasts. You can�t ask questions. You are still largely relying on the �communication systems.� But with an HF radio, you don�t need any system at all to communicate long distance. Sometimes you want private communications and sometimes you want to be able to communicate with lots of people. Use short-distance Family Radio Service (FRS) radios for more private communications. When you want to receive news and to give out news, you want to be talking on frequencies and modes that everyone else is. This is when you�d want to use amateur radios, particular on the HF bands. Besides amateur radios, Citizen Band (CB) radios also can help with getting and giving news. I got a CB radio for $26 on Amazon and a $35 antenna from Radio Shack. This radio plugs can plug right into the cigarette lighter of the car and the antenna is just about 2 feet tall and sticks to the roof of the car with a strong magnet. No difficult installation required. No license is required to use it and there are plenty of people on the CB bands. There�s even a dedicated �emergency channel,� channel 9, that is only supposed to be used when someone has an emergency and is probably monitored more than any other channel. You get a lot of the advantages of amateur radio (like no �system� required to use it, people are already listening on it, it is highly mobile and\or portable) but for a fraction of the cost and effort. I think this is a cost-effective solution for listening to what people are saying, being able to communicate to others with no reliance on any system, and being able to call for help if needed. All for about $60 that you can even just keep in the trunk of your car if you�d rather not have it out all the time. In my last email to you, I reviewed the .22 caliber adapter for the HK91 and how I was a �Rifleman In Training.� I am still am in training, but I am going to Front Sight in a few weeks and I plan on going to an Appledseed Project Boot Camp in the spring. I am committed to do it now, whereas before I just thought it would be a good idea. I keep on trying to improve my skills and have some other things I am going to be learning which perhaps I�ll detail in future emails. I try to keep things simple and try not to get to clever with preparedness. Sometimes you just gotta walk into the trade school and ask to talk to a counselor, or buy that radio book, or sign up for a class even though you really don�t know anyone and you don�t really know what you doing. To me, it is my duty as a father and member of my community to consistently do all I can to improve my skills to help out whenever trouble strikes.- Still A Rifleman in Training Jim, I am sending you this message via my VHF ham radio sitting in my ham shack using only battery power and my laptop to reply. The connection from my radio via airwaves into the Internet is via what is called a gateway. I could also do this from my car, or on a mountain top using only batteries and a portable antenna. I could also do it via HF or UHF. I could use a mode called PSK31, and if you had a ham radio I could send it to you in this same format peer to peer with no internet connection needed. So, my point is that anyone with just a ["No Code"] Technicians license can do this. The license is $15, and a simple 35 question test. I hold what is called an Extra class license AD7VV and so can use more advanced modes to communicate. TA ASKS: DOSE ANYBODY HERE HAVE SUCH A HOOK UP OR CAN TEACH THIS TO OTHERS??? I have many friends who are doing what the writer of that letter suggested, but it takes practice. God bless you, and have a blessed Christmas season.- Michael H. Mr. Rawles, In light of yesterday's mention of ham Radio, I thought I might offer a little more information on how my fellow ready can get involved and equipped, and why. It bears mentioning up front that in most countries, Amateur Radio ("ham") is subject to some government licensure and regulation. For instance, in the US, the FCC (Federal Communications Commission) creates the laws and issues you the right to use Ham frequencies. In the US, it is illegal to transmit on the Ham bands without an FCC issued license and call sign. So follow the rules, and get licensed. It really is easy, I did it with my dad's help when I was ten years old. Now the good stuff: Ham radio is indeed a fairly robust form of communication (even capable of running off of small solar panels in the case of handheld radios), and for the most part, the Ham Radio community itself is very emergency preparedness oriented. There are numerous Ham groups across the US with the sole purpose of maintaining and practicing communication under disaster conditions, and most local area clubs participate regularly in related drills, classes, and actual disaster coordination. Becoming a "ham" involves learning some of the technical aspects of radio and electronics, and for good reason. You don't want to be without those skills, because Amateur Radio is a very do-it-yourself hobby. You have to hook up your equipment and know how to operate it. You have to understand the basics of RF theory so you can buy (or build) the right equipment.You are responsible for safety in your gear and the way you use it. But that makes it a very rewarding and open-ended hobby. It may sound daunting, but like I said, it's easy enough for kids to grasp. And the things you learn in the process are invaluable steps toward greater self-sufficiency in many other areas. Now, in the US, the FCC requires that you pass a test to be licensed as a Ham Radio operator. Learning and studying for this test is the only real effort required to become a ham. The good news is you can study much of the material for free, the testing is often free, and there is only a nominal fee for getting a license. Here are some great resources online: QRZ.com's How To - More information for those interested in pursuing a license in the US. ARRL's Exam Site Index - Find the exam site nearest you. QRZ.com Site Map - Find practice exams and lots of other information from active hams, including forum. FCC Ham Site - Information on licenses, processes, etc. Thanks, - Little Bird http://www.survivalblog.com/

mayhem | 12-24-2008 06:20 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Everything important will be local!

rogold | 12-24-2008 08:25 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment goota get me some HAM!

Bill843 | 12-25-2008 12:22 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by rogold (Post 1481296) goota get me some HAM!
Yea but as I noted in another thread--should you get a HAM license or not? You don't need any license to buy ham radios. And if the government moves to confiscate ham radios, they're going to use that list of licenses to find owners... and most likely, anyone still transmitting will be breaking a new law anyway, if they had a license before or not. ----- My gut suspicion here is that a ham radio is a good thing to have--but a ham license, not so much. Consider this other example: let's say that you had a choice on how to legally buy firearms- 1) the first way is with a background check through the local police department, 2) the other way is where the police are never notified of the sale at all. If you're concerned about freedom and privacy which way would you want to use?--especially if you think you're preparing for a time when owning or using guns won't be allowed at all? I'm not usually a fan of conspiracy theories, but the more I think about this, the more obvious it seems: Ham radio licenses are a trap, in the same way that gun registration is a trap. It's leaving a paper trail for the jackboots to follow later on. You can reach more people online than with any ham radio--and the government doesn't require any license to get online. The difference is, the government can shut down the internet anytime they want. -end-

maximumrebel1 | 12-25-2008 01:11 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment I have to agree with Bill. My knowledge of radio is very slim, but I sure as heck don't see the purpose of getting the governments permission to use one. Another thought I have been considering lately is that not only will it be important for Patriots to be able to communicate but it will be just as important if not more for the enemy to not be able to communicate. Disrupting their means of communication should be a top priority post SHTF IMO.

Zusn | 12-25-2008 03:25 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment TA, I talked a little bit about HAM radios in another thread http://goldismoney.info/forums/showthread.php?t=331785 Read my post (#5). Find a club, join it and learn. Any member of a HAM radio club will be more than happy to teach you everything they know. It's too hard trying to explain everything online. People don't realize what can be done via radio these days (especially with computers). Heck, just yesterday, I traveled over a mountain pass to eastern WA. I had my Icom T7H and a handheld CB. The CB is just for listening to truckers talk, which helped alert me to an accident up ahead. My HAM radio allowed me to talk with other operators so I could get road condition reports, etc. I was also able to monitor the state patrol and hear about all of the issues on the various highways. I was kept up to date on what was happening, while everyone else was sticking their heads out their windows trying to see what the hold up was.

Zusn | 12-25-2008 03:42 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill843 (Post 1481442) Yea but as I noted in another thread--should you get a HAM license or not? You don't need any license to buy ham radios. And if the government moves to confiscate ham radios, they're going to use that list of licenses to find owners... and most likely, anyone still transmitting will be breaking a new law anyway, if they had a license before or not. ----- My gut suspicion here is that a ham radio is a good thing to have--but a ham license, not so much. Consider this other example: let's say that you had a choice on how to legally buy firearms- 1) the first way is with a background check through the local police department, 2) the other way is where the police are never notified of the sale at all. If you're concerned about freedom and privacy which way would you want to use?--especially if you think you're preparing for a time when owning or using guns won't be allowed at all? I'm not usually a fan of conspiracy theories, but the more I think about this, the more obvious it seems: Ham radio licenses are a trap, in the same way that gun registration is a trap. It's leaving a paper trail for the jackboots to follow later on. You can reach more people online than with any ham radio--and the government doesn't require any license to get online. The difference is, the government can shut down the internet anytime they want. -end-
A HAM radio license does not equal gun registration. A HAM radio license is equivalent to a drivers license. All it says is that you're allowed to operate on these frequencies. No one knows if you have a radio, or how many. It would be a HUGE waste of time knocking on the door of every license holder looking to take their radios. I have my concealed carry permit. I remember my friend trying to talk me out of getting it 10 years ago because my fingerprints would be "in the system". Several times in the last 10 years was I glad I had my sidearm with me. I think if the .gov had to go after a group of people, it'd be gun owners before radio operators. Anyway, most gun owners on this forum wouldn't give up (all) of their guns if the government came for them and made them illegal, so why couldn't you do the same if they came for the radios? Especially when you can make radios like this! http://www.kd5om.com/images/big-rockmite.jpg Rockmite 20 meter transceiver: How about a 1/3rd watt (that's right, about 300 milli-watt) CW-QRPp transceiver that fits inside an Altoids tin? Yes, you can work 1,000s of miles with less than one watt of RF power with the proper antenna. This fun little radio comes with an iambic CW keyer and dual frequency crystal controlled direct conversion transceiver. Available from Small Wonder Labs in 20, 30, 40 and 80 meter versions and cost only $27.00 less the Altoids tin. You also supply the connectors and switches which are still available at Radio Shack, Mouser and many surplus outlets. There is a Yahoo Group where you can find plenty of help and boat-loads of modifications. I refused to be paralyzed in fear of what the government "may" do. All we can do is plan accordingly for what we think the future holds. I see no threat from the government in regards to HAM radio. If one does arise, I'll deal with it when it comes. Trying to stop radio transmissions will be about as successful as the war on drugs, terror, etc. It can be criminalized, but cannot be stopped.

Twisted Avatar | 12-25-2008 08:47 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill843 (Post 1481442) You can reach more people online than with any ham radio--and the government doesn't require any license to get online. The difference is, the government can shut down the internet anytime they want.
That is a most brillant point that bears repeating. T

Twisted Avatar | 12-25-2008 08:52 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Zusn (Post 1481504) TA, I talked a little bit about HAM radios in another thread http://goldismoney.info/forums/showthread.php?t=331785 Read my post (#5). Find a club, join it and learn. Any member of a HAM radio club will be more than happy to teach you everything they know. It's too hard trying to explain everything online. People don't realize what can be done via radio these days (especially with computers). Heck, just yesterday, I traveled over a mountain pass to eastern WA. I had my Icom T7H and a handheld CB. The CB is just for listening to truckers talk, which helped alert me to an accident up ahead. My HAM radio allowed me to talk with other operators so I could get road condition reports, etc. I was also able to monitor the state patrol and hear about all of the issues on the various highways. I was kept up to date on what was happening, while everyone else was sticking their heads out their windows trying to see what the hold up was.
Wow... That is a MOST AMAZING SKILL TO HAVE AND CULTIVATE. If the time allows I will find a local club and try and get something going. Thanks Z :ok: T

ruprick | 12-25-2008 09:17 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment A good starting point is to first become a listener....I really enjoy shortwave listening and experimentation with antenna construction....all homemade stuff that costs nearly nothing. Also, listening is a very cheap hobby. Me and others have placed quite a fer posts here on GIM....but feel free to ask any questions. Antenna is the key to listening and transmission......$50 in materials can make an antenna that turns a $100 radio into a better rig than a $5000 commercial radio. Sony has a nice little portable for about $150. You can get a serious Icom radio for about $600. Just about every nation in the world has english broadcasts you can listen to daily....some very good programming. I listen to China, Tiawan, and the Radio Netherlands just about every day. Russia, Isreal, India, and North Korea as well. The quality and depth of programming is fantastic.....you can tell it is not the manipulated MSM we get over here at home. Start listening ....you will learn a lot.....like walking prior to running. My wild bought me the "Passport to World Band Radio" 2009 = 25th edition.....she gets me one every year ....I'll spend a few hours with it today and use it all year long. I love low cost educational hobbies.

Lt Dan | 12-25-2008 09:45 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Since my radio repair days in the Navy, I've wanted to do the HAM thing, just never took the time or money to get involved. Maybe I'll look into it. It'd be kind of nice to have a GIM club of "HAMS" to talk to besides the internet.

maximumrebel1 | 12-25-2008 11:52 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Zusn (Post 1481508) A HAM radio license does not equal gun registration. A HAM radio license is equivalent to a drivers license. All it says is that you're allowed to operate on these frequencies. No one knows if you have a radio, or how many. It would be a HUGE waste of time knocking on the door of every license holder looking to take their radios.
I don't believe in the need to get the Governments permission to operate a car. However I do drive for a living so I do have a drivers license the risk vs. reward is pretty high so I'm not going to take that step. My question is what is the purpose of getting a license other than having big brothers permission to use the frequencies that they don't own? If you can monitor chatter from FEMA and other government orgs I would definitely think you would be on a list of doors to kick in, you might not be as high as someone with a Class III license but you are on the list.

unalga | 12-25-2008 12:15 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment I have to agree that in the case of total meltdown, obody is going to care if you have a license if you can help out with comms.

Bill843 | 12-25-2008 07:01 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment If you wanted to get a ham radio to jabber on all the time, then a license would make sense--because without it (even now) you'd eventually get caught. And you can use one for listening as much as you want--that's not illegal or even generally detectable. Otherwise, all you'd need to do is maybe do a transmission test once a year or two, to make certain things are all working regularly. That would take maybe five or ten seconds of airtime, and a volunteer a few miles away with a shortwave receiver. If you pick a frequency that's clear at that time of day in your area, the chances of getting caught are practically zero. ------ Most of the value of a shortwave radio is in being able to listen. Just having a decent radio and a good (portable/concealable) antenna setup is way better than not knowing at all. -end-

CajunCoin | 12-25-2008 07:44 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Zusn (Post 1481508) A HAM radio license does not equal gun registration. A HAM radio license is equivalent to a drivers license. All it says is that you're allowed to operate on these frequencies. No one knows if you have a radio, or how many. It would be a HUGE waste of time knocking on the door of every license holder looking to take their radios. I have my concealed carry permit. I remember my friend trying to talk me out of getting it 10 years ago because my fingerprints would be "in the system". Several times in the last 10 years was I glad I had my sidearm with me. I think if the .gov had to go after a group of people, it'd be gun owners before radio operators. Anyway, most gun owners on this forum wouldn't give up (all) of their guns if the government came for them and made them illegal, so why couldn't you do the same if they came for the radios? Especially when you can make radios like this! http://www.kd5om.com/images/big-rockmite.jpg Rockmite 20 meter transceiver: How about a 1/3rd watt (that's right, about 300 milli-watt) CW-QRPp transceiver that fits inside an Altoids tin? Yes, you can work 1,000s of miles with less than one watt of RF power with the proper antenna. This fun little radio comes with an iambic CW keyer and dual frequency crystal controlled direct conversion transceiver. Available from Small Wonder Labs in 20, 30, 40 and 80 meter versions and cost only $27.00 less the Altoids tin. You also supply the connectors and switches which are still available at Radio Shack, Mouser and many surplus outlets. There is a Yahoo Group where you can find plenty of help and boat-loads of modifications. I refused to be paralyzed in fear of what the government "may" do. All we can do is plan accordingly for what we think the future holds. I see no threat from the government in regards to HAM radio. If one does arise, I'll deal with it when it comes. Trying to stop radio transmissions will be about as successful as the war on drugs, terror, etc. It can be criminalized, but cannot be stopped.
As a gun owner, ham radio operator, ex-military, taxpayor, etc., I am sure I am in some list somewhere, but to worry about it is futile, the risk for not having the "Ham License" is fines and banishment from using radios, so the license is only a statement that you know how to use the damn thing without causing trouble to other radio services. If ever asked about my radios during confiscation, My pet alligator et'em and he is now shitting penta tubes!!!!:452:

Zusn | 12-26-2008 12:58 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by CajunCoin (Post 1482180) As a gun owner, ham radio operator, ex-military, taxpayor, etc., I am sure I am in some list somewhere, but to worry about it is futile, the risk for not having the "Ham License" is fines and banishment from using radios, so the license is only a statement that you know how to use the damn thing without causing trouble to other radio services. If ever asked about my radios during confiscation, My pet alligator et'em and he is now shitting penta tubes!!!!:452:
My radio got lost along with my guns in that boating accident everyone seems to be having Quote:
Originally Posted by maximumrebel1 I don't believe in the need to get the Governments permission to operate a car. However I do drive for a living so I do have a drivers license the risk vs. reward is pretty high so I'm not going to take that step.
I agree with you on that Quote:
My question is what is the purpose of getting a license other than having big brothers permission to use the frequencies that they don't own?
No other HAM will talk to you if you don't have a valid callsign or no callsign. The only option for the non-licensed operator is to communicate with other non-licensed operators. You will piss off the HAM operators and you will find yourself on a list you don't want to be on.(FCC) They will trace your location, record your transmissions of your illegal broadcasts and fine you. Is that worth skipping out on the $14 for a 10 year license and a multiple choice test that you could pass with 100% after a week of studying? In the mean time, the pissed off HAMs might jam your signals or do other things to disrupt your communications. I don't condone that activity, but those guys are very protective of the frequency bands. Quote:
If you can monitor chatter from FEMA and other government orgs I would definitely think you would be on a list of doors to kick in, you might not be as high as someone with a Class III license but you are on the list.
You can buy a high end scanner and monitor every frequency out there. No license is required to buy any equipment. As long as no broadcasting occurs, no license is required. No one will know you own the scanner. If you want to operate illegally, stay mobile. Just ask any trucker running their CB through a 500watt amplifier. WTSHTF, licenses won't matter. But like I said before, it's good to have lots of practice setting up and using equipment. Practice you won't get minus the license.

CajunCoin | 12-26-2008 11:51 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Zusn (Post 1482823) My radio got lost along with my guns in that boating accident everyone seems to be having I agree with you on that No other HAM will talk to you if you don't have a valid callsign or no callsign. The only option for the non-licensed operator is to communicate with other non-licensed operators. You will piss off the HAM operators and you will find yourself on a list you don't want to be on.(FCC) They will trace your location, record your transmissions of your illegal broadcasts and fine you. Is that worth skipping out on the $14 for a 10 year license and a multiple choice test that you could pass with 100% after a week of studying? In the mean time, the pissed off HAMs might jam your signals or do other things to disrupt your communications. I don't condone that activity, but those guys are very protective of the frequency bands. You can buy a high end scanner and monitor every frequency out there. No license is required to buy any equipment. As long as no broadcasting occurs, no license is required. No one will know you own the scanner. If you want to operate illegally, stay mobile. Just ask any trucker running their CB through a 500watt amplifier. WTSHTF, licenses won't matter. But like I said before, it's good to have lots of practice setting up and using equipment. Practice you won't get minus the license.
The List you will end up on by not having the license will be the FCC/DHS illegal signal report, the fines usually start at $$$$ and can run upto $10K per day, not worth the hassle. check out FCC.gov enforcement stuff, even the truck drivers occasionally catch flak for real hot "CBs". Cajuncoin, Ham radio OP ADV Class orphan

Tallships | 12-27-2008 01:06 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment I once knew a guy who would spout out other peoples call numbers he heard on other channels as his license. Nobody ever called him on it.

CajunCoin | 12-27-2008 01:25 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallships (Post 1483565) I once knew a guy who would spout out other peoples call numbers he heard on other channels as his license. Nobody ever called him on it.
Bootleggers are widely known and suspected, yeah, but as a ham I don't suggest lawbreaking as a regular course of action, IF something does go wrong and could, however slim, the consequences would not be pretty. GIMers sometimes discuss controversial subjects and when we advocate or suggest actions which could bring on problems, as adults, we must sometimes speak up and put DISCLAIMERS since it should be the policy of the forum to facilitate discussion not to suggest actions which could place someone in a precarious legal position. sorry to hi-jack the thread, let us return to discussion of Amateur Radio.

Tallships | 12-27-2008 01:37 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by CajunCoin (Post 1483579) Bootleggers are widely known and suspected, yeah, but as a ham I don't suggest lawbreaking as a regular course of action, IF something does go wrong and could, however slim, the consequences would not be pretty. GIMers sometimes discuss controversial subjects and when we advocate or suggest actions which could bring on problems, as adults, we must sometimes speak up and put DISCLAIMERS since it should be the policy of the forum to facilitate discussion not to suggest actions which could place someone in a precarious legal position. sorry to hi-jack the thread, let us return to discussion of Amateur Radio.
He knew the lingo, and he was good at it, and he did not play games. He bought a special c.b. that was modified to include pretty much the entire spectrum. He even had top secret channels no-one was supposed to get. Some really good locally famous ham engineer had built the unit, and when he died his wife sold it to my friend for peanuts. It must have had 20-30 dip switches on the back, and came with a notebook on how to use them. It was a great rig, but he came on hard times and had to sell it.

CajunCoin | 12-27-2008 03:16 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallships (Post 1483583) He knew the lingo, and he was good at it, and he did not play games. He bought a special c.b. that was modified to include pretty much the entire spectrum. He even had top secret channels no-one was supposed to get. Some really good locally famous ham engineer had built the unit, and when he died his wife sold it to my friend for peanuts. It must have had 20-30 dip switches on the back, and came with a notebook on how to use them. It was a great rig, but he came on hard times and had to sell it.
What you are talking about is an "EXPORT RADIO" wich is a suped up CB set to transmit above or below the CB Band which in the US runs 26.900 to 27.405 in 40 Channels broken into 10 khz spacings with a few skipped areas, in the old days, this was termed CRYSTAL CONTROL, which with the advent of Freq Sysnc Technology allowed people to add a signal injected into the frequency controller and wander from about 24 MHZ to 32 MHZ easily. However what some "Ham Engineers" don't realize is that the allocations for some of these frequencies are reserved to the DOD (Dept of Defense) most notably 27.410 to 27.999 MHZ, 25.500 to 26.900 MHZ which is termed the "FREEBAND" by the folks who play there, great place to play if the SHTF and the Patriot boys are in the middle of prime US GOVT Territory!!! Radio Spectrum has many different users and without the specialized knowledge about Radio Spectrum Allocation Rules/Regulations/Laws, it is very easy to wander into the wrong neighborhood where you will stick out like a sore thumb. Study the Chart, it may save you some grief. I recommend that the first thing radio enthusiasts study is the NTIA allocation chart for the USA to learn what lives in what part of the Radio Spectrum, just recently, somebody got a "ham set" and decided to set up a homenet at 6.800+/_ not realizing the frequency is an aeronautical HF Freq used by Airlines around the world and the suprize that came with the frequency was a free visit from the FCC and US Marshalls Office. BTW-If you get a visit from the FCC and it is just the Agents, they do have the right to inspect any and all radio "TRANSMITTING" installations, but if the bring US Marshalls, you are now in deep DO-DO. Friendly reminder. Anyhow, hinding in plain sight as a licensed ham, I am able to do more than trying to be stealthy due to the fact several special rules or laws apply to Hams::coolbeer: 1. Possession of High powered radio gear is allowed. 2. Handheld radios which can recieve police/fire/secret whatever???? can be possessed in car/mobile/pedestrian situations are preempted by Federal Law, legal to posses and use. NOTE: SEVERAL STATES IN THE USA PROHIBIT SCANNERS IN CARS OR MOBILE/PEDESTRIAN SITUATIONS Some states are real @sshats about this one, I went through a police check point in Michigan, Barney Fife thought he hd a live one and wanted to write, when I flipped open my FCC Amateur Radio License, BARNEY's eyes dropped and knew he had been had, I waived was thru the checkpoint. 3. Since ham radio is utilized in widespread SHTF, the ability to blend in and lend a hand has gotten me plenty of MREs and neat stuff. Thank you Uncle Sugar for my food stash. 4. In an emergency, you can use any Frequency WITHOUT LIMITATION to get help, A ham with a broken leg used a handheld which he on the spot modified to transmit on the San Diego Sheriff's freq (155 MHZ). the Sheriffs office tried to act like @sshats but the FCC officer who the SDSO called to meeting shut down the whipping and Ticket session and asked where the radio was and when the SDSO said they destroyed it, they had to buy another to replace it!!:thumb.aspx: In the days of 5/13/20 WPM Morse, it kept a lot of good otherwise qualified folks out of Amateur Radio, now with the licensing only consisting of a written test, I recommend that a family get everyone licensed since access to a communication system which is not dependent on Wireline/Wireless Commercial service. The Best bet is to have a VHF/UHF base with a 50 watt transciever with battery/solar backup along with mobiles in each vehicle and handhelds for each member of the family licensed. An HF system set up to run 100 watts will cover the nation/worldwide with very few problems, the practice you need is acquiring the operating skills to use voice/digital methods equally. Code is not hard to learn slow code for back up and PSK31 for rapid transfer stuff. Exotic stuff like high power freeband CBs or tricked out radios on "Secret Channels" (WHICH REALLY DON'T EXIST) can just bring attention since their operation will more than likely will step on folks who do not like to be bothered. Never Peek into a bear's den, lest you become the next meal! For you are tasty and have lots of fat for long winter's night. Cajuncoin, ham radio op, GROL holder, electronics tech extraordinaire :RockOn::coolbeer:

Twisted Avatar | 12-27-2008 03:29 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Wow Cajun thanks for all the feedback!!! Hat tip sir:ok: T

Lt Dan | 12-27-2008 04:11 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Yes, thanks for all the info. You guys might have talked me into trying for my license. I've ordered a couple books to study. Anyone who could help me out can PM me if they live in Ohio or area and know where I could get a hold of a local ham guy to help me get started it would be greatly appreciated.

CajunCoin | 12-27-2008 04:58 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Lt Dan (Post 1484173) Yes, thanks for all the info. You guys might have talked me into trying for my license. I've ordered a couple books to study. Anyone who could help me out can PM me if they live in Ohio or area and know where I could get a hold of a local ham guy to help me get started it would be greatly appreciated.
WWW.ARRL.ORG WWW.W5YI.COM Study the books, they are very easy and look for a VE (Volunteer Examiner) in you area for a test session, OHIO should not be very hard, radioactive Hams all over the place look for under the above websites for VE info. PM me if any questions or you get stumped, testing is very easy now, all you have to have is 3 hams certified as VEs and your are ready for a test session. Our Club tests every first monday of the month in Thibodaux, Louisiana and you are more than welcome, its 71 degrees today and don't you need an excuse to visit the warm sunny south?

Lt Dan | 12-27-2008 06:08 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by CajunCoin (Post 1484217) WWW.ARRL.ORG WWW.W5YI.COM Study the books, they are very easy and look for a VE (Volunteer Examiner) in you area for a test session, OHIO should not be very hard, radioactive Hams all over the place look for under the above websites for VE info. PM me if any questions or you get stumped, testing is very easy now, all you have to have is 3 hams certified as VEs and your are ready for a test session. Our Club tests every first monday of the month in Thibodaux, Louisiana and you are more than welcome, its 71 degrees today and don't you need an excuse to visit the warm sunny south?
Thanks for the info. I'll bookmark those sites and when it gets cold and snow up to my ...,:36_1_63: I'll crack those books. There are a few clubs that I found on the net, but quite a distance, almost 50 miles. Talk about the warm sunny south, here in mid "Southern" :shine:Ohio, we had 70's and sunny most of the day. Worked out in the unheated shop with only short sleeves.

CajunCoin | 12-27-2008 06:12 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Lt Dan (Post 1484284) Thanks for the info. I'll bookmark those sites and when it gets cold and snow up to my ...,:36_1_63: I'll crack those books. There are a few clubs that I found on the net, but quite a distance, almost 50 miles. Talk about the warm sunny south, here in mid "Southern" :shine:Ohio, we had 70's and sunny most of the day. Worked out in the unheated shop with only short sleeves.
If you are not too far from Dayton, you are near the Center of the Ham Radio Universe. Good Luck, see you on the bands. Cajun

Tallships | 12-27-2008 10:38 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by CajunCoin (Post 1484126) What you are talking about is an "EXPORT RADIO" wich is a suped up CB set to transmit above or below the CB Band which in the US runs 26.900 to 27.405 in 40 Channels broken into 10 khz spacings with a few skipped areas, in the old days, this was termed CRYSTAL CONTROL, which with the advent of Freq Sysnc Technology allowed people to add a signal injected into the frequency controller and wander from about 24 MHZ to 32 MHZ easily. However what some "Ham Engineers" don't realize is that the allocations for some of these frequencies are reserved to the DOD (Dept of Defense) most notably 27.410 to 27.999 MHZ, 25.500 to 26.900 MHZ which is termed the "FREEBAND" by the folks who play there, great place to play if the SHTF and the Patriot boys are in the middle of prime US GOVT Territory!!! Radio Spectrum has many different users and without the specialized knowledge about Radio Spectrum Allocation Rules/Regulations/Laws, it is very easy to wander into the wrong neighborhood where you will stick out like a sore thumb. Study the Chart, it may save you some grief. I recommend that the first thing radio enthusiasts study is the NTIA allocation chart for the USA to learn what lives in what part of the Radio Spectrum, just recently, somebody got a "ham set" and decided to set up a homenet at 6.800+/_ not realizing the frequency is an aeronautical HF Freq used by Airlines around the world and the suprize that came with the frequency was a free visit from the FCC and US Marshalls Office. BTW-If you get a visit from the FCC and it is just the Agents, they do have the right to inspect any and all radio "TRANSMITTING" installations, but if the bring US Marshalls, you are now in deep DO-DO. Friendly reminder. Anyhow, hinding in plain sight as a licensed ham, I am able to do more than trying to be stealthy due to the fact several special rules or laws apply to Hams::coolbeer: 1. Possession of High powered radio gear is allowed. 2. Handheld radios which can recieve police/fire/secret whatever???? can be possessed in car/mobile/pedestrian situations are preempted by Federal Law, legal to posses and use. NOTE: SEVERAL STATES IN THE USA PROHIBIT SCANNERS IN CARS OR MOBILE/PEDESTRIAN SITUATIONS Some states are real @sshats about this one, I went through a police check point in Michigan, Barney Fife thought he hd a live one and wanted to write, when I flipped open my FCC Amateur Radio License, BARNEY's eyes dropped and knew he had been had, I waived was thru the checkpoint. 3. Since ham radio is utilized in widespread SHTF, the ability to blend in and lend a hand has gotten me plenty of MREs and neat stuff. Thank you Uncle Sugar for my food stash. 4. In an emergency, you can use any Frequency WITHOUT LIMITATION to get help, A ham with a broken leg used a handheld which he on the spot modified to transmit on the San Diego Sheriff's freq (155 MHZ). the Sheriffs office tried to act like @sshats but the FCC officer who the SDSO called to meeting shut down the whipping and Ticket session and asked where the radio was and when the SDSO said they destroyed it, they had to buy another to replace it!!:thumb.aspx: In the days of 5/13/20 WPM Morse, it kept a lot of good otherwise qualified folks out of Amateur Radio, now with the licensing only consisting of a written test, I recommend that a family get everyone licensed since access to a communication system which is not dependent on Wireline/Wireless Commercial service. The Best bet is to have a VHF/UHF base with a 50 watt transciever with battery/solar backup along with mobiles in each vehicle and handhelds for each member of the family licensed. An HF system set up to run 100 watts will cover the nation/worldwide with very few problems, the practice you need is acquiring the operating skills to use voice/digital methods equally. Code is not hard to learn slow code for back up and PSK31 for rapid transfer stuff. Exotic stuff like high power freeband CBs or tricked out radios on "Secret Channels" (WHICH REALLY DON'T EXIST) can just bring attention since their operation will more than likely will step on folks who do not like to be bothered. Never Peek into a bear's den, lest you become the next meal! For you are tasty and have lots of fat for long winter's night. Cajuncoin, ham radio op, GROL holder, electronics tech extraordinaire :RockOn::coolbeer:
Lotsa good info there. My friend never talked on the "secret channels". We just listened for the most part. He wisely kept the mic locked in his safe so his friends didnt get him in trouble. I only have a shortwave reciever. I cannot transmit at all. I occasionally listen to the ham bands, but mostly listen to the news from other parts of the globe so I can filter out the shills I hear on cnn.

Bill843 | 12-28-2008 08:20 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by CajunCoin (Post 1484126) ... Anyhow, hinding in plain sight as a licensed ham, I am able to do more than trying to be stealthy due to the fact several special rules or laws apply to Hams::coolbeer: ...
... Anyhow, hinding in plain sight as a licensed Australian gun owner, I am able to do more than trying to be stealthy due to the fact several special rules or laws apply to licensed Australian gun owners ::coolbeer: ... Quote:
...2. Handheld radios which can recieve police/fire/secret whatever???? can be possessed in car/mobile/pedestrian situations are preempted by Federal Law, legal to posses and use. NOTE: SEVERAL STATES IN THE USA PROHIBIT SCANNERS IN CARS OR MOBILE/PEDESTRIAN SITUATIONS Some states are real @sshats about this one, I went through a police check point in Michigan, Barney Fife thought he hd a live one and wanted to write, when I flipped open my FCC Amateur Radio License, BARNEY's eyes dropped and knew he had been had, I waived was thru the checkpoint. ...
First off--a scanner ban is dumb either way, because criminals won't worry about being licensed for a scanner, just like they don't worry about having concealed-carry permits. Your example is just more proof of bureaucrat pandering and idiocy (theirs, not yours), and isn't hardly any moral victory. "Ha ha, that cop said 'show me your papers', so I whipped my papers out, and maaan, you shouda seen the look on his face!" Secondly,,, if you haven't noticed, most of the countries that have prohibited amateur radio fairly recently (in the last 25-30 years) did so because of uprisings against the government. And the US is on the verge of the worst economic situation since the first great depression. ------ I'd agree there's a lot to know before transmitting with one now--but if you're only planning on using it after amateur radios get banned anyway, then getting a ham license is worse than useless. It's giving the police a roadmap to your door. -end-

CajunCoin | 12-29-2008 12:11 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill843 (Post 1485726) ... Anyhow, hinding in plain sight as a licensed Australian gun owner, I am able to do more than trying to be stealthy due to the fact several special rules or laws apply to licensed Australian gun owners ::coolbeer: ... First off--a scanner ban is dumb either way, because criminals won't worry about being licensed for a scanner, just like they don't worry about having concealed-carry permits. Your example is just more proof of bureaucrat pandering and idiocy (theirs, not yours), and isn't hardly any moral victory. "Ha ha, that cop said 'show me your papers', so I whipped my papers out, and maaan, you shouda seen the look on his face!" Secondly,,, if you haven't noticed, most of the countries that have prohibited amateur radio fairly recently (in the last 25-30 years) did so because of uprisings against the government. And the US is on the verge of the worst economic situation since the first great depression. ------ I'd agree there's a lot to know before transmitting with one now--but if you're only planning on using it after amateur radios get banned anyway, then getting a ham license is worse than useless. It's giving the police a roadmap to your door. -end-
Gun laws are stupid also since criminals do not care about the "restrictions" but most States here in the States keep Scanner Bans and such to give them more ammunition if they catch someone without a ham license on the road listening to a scanner they can use that as a Fourth Amendment (relates to searches and seizures) excuse to dig further. Bureaucrats dream this stuff up with an eye to cutting down on "crime" but most scanner laws here in the USA were dreamed up by State or Local Authorities to cut down on errant tow truck drivers, ambulance chasers and looki-lous who want to rubberneck. Hams (at least in the USA) are pretty much self policing meaning we do not tolerate the wannabes, scofflaws or problem children to a high degree. The USA has only shut down Ham Radio in two instances, WW1 from 1917-1918 and WW2 from Dec 7, 1941 to January 1945 when the band were relinquished back to the Hams. The FCC (Regulatory Folks in the USA) Kept on giving Ham Tests and issuing Callsigns during WW2. For the FCC to ban Ham Radio would have to take a REAL SHTF or TEOTAWKI when I don't think the "Police" will be preoccupied with finding an errant radio transmitter. Local Police ain't got a clue what ham radio is and they think it is a sandwich of the Porcine nature!!! LOL The FCC is our regulatory agency in the USA in charge of the "RADIO" matters and and unless they are tasked directly with extra personnel, 600,000+ Hams are going to be a big order to get their radios. In WW2, the Hams were asked to donate their gear for the war effort but most of the gear was too complex for ordinary use by specialty trained folks and was returned to the hams (My uncle got his gear back but he was already in the signal corps and Granny stored it in the Washroom for his eventual return. (Which he did, Thank God). Ham Licenses only require a mailing address in the USA, as long as the FCC can send you a letter so it reaches you, it usually is not a roadmap but a PO BOX or mailing service which will require some real leg work, might have to abandon the donut and coffee shop routine. Since local police do not care about Ham Radio (But they can enforce CB Law if their Jurisdiction so wishes) I do not fear confiscation of radios, nobody knows what I have or in what quantity. But to illegally operate now is foolish viewed with the current take on Radio Law.

Tallships | 12-29-2008 02:33 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment As a kid, I worked in the local grocery store in town. It was the only place in the area back in the 80's that was open 24-7, so they had a contract with the local radio station to monitor and report signal failures and other problems at night, when the station just played tapes (unmanned). We could change power to the transmitter from inside the store as the antennae was behind the store. I had to take a test and I got a card from the FCC to be able to legally dink with it, but I never did have to. I don't even remember what the license was called.

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CajunCoin | 12-29-2008 03:39 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallships (Post 1486621) As a kid, I worked in the local grocery store in town. It was the only place in the area back in the 80's that was open 24-7, so they had a contract with the local radio station to monitor and report signal failures and other problems at night, when the station just played tapes (unmanned). We could change power to the transmitter from inside the store as the antennae was behind the store. I had to take a test and I got a card from the FCC to be able to legally dink with it, but I never did have to. I don't even remember what the license was called.
You had an element 3 part 9 Broadcast License, which allowed you to adjust power, antenna and allowed you to turn on and off the radio. A Radio operator you to operate the controls of a broadcast station and adjust what you needed to keep the station on line. Commonly called a Jockey License.

Lt Dan | 01-10-2009 08:46 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Just thought this thread deserved a bump. Got the study materials for taking the test and am working my way through it now.

Twisted Avatar | 01-10-2009 10:44 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Lt Dan (Post 1505294) Just thought this thread deserved a bump. Got the study materials for taking the test and am working my way through it now.
Buy all means keep us posted......... this is something I have on my hit list to take up. T

JohnPA | 01-10-2009 11:06 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment I have arrived at this discussion late. Cajuncoin has given excellent information regarding ham radio. Add my dittos to his posts. JPA-FCC Licensed Extra Class Amateur Radio Operator

Lt Dan | 01-10-2009 02:16 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnPA (Post 1505396) I have arrived at this discussion late. Cajuncoin has given excellent information regarding ham radio. Add my dittos to his posts. JPA-FCC Licensed Extra Class Amateur Radio Operator
Welcome to the thread! This thread has been the renewal of my interest in ham radio. So much so that, I ordered the ARRL "Ham Radio License Manual" for level 1 tech license, also the handbook because I am interested in the technical side of the operations. Kind of OTOH, but I went out and bought a SW receiver, a junk yard CB($15), a hand held CB and a scanner. CB is not impressing me at all, there seems to be a total lack of orderliness to it and no adherence to regulations. It does have it's place though for emergency channel 9 and listening in to truckers if you're traveling. What I need now is a radio that will receive hf usb, & lsb signals as the SW is picking up these frequencies that are garbled, I suspect are Hams talking. Even the cw signals aren't coming through like I think they should. Fun listening to other countries on the SW all the same. Any advice on what radio I should buy next? This is a budget setup!!! No top dollar stuff please. Since I plan to get my license, even a transceiver might be ok, but it might tempt me to key up prematurely. I haven't met any local hams yet to guide me, so if anyone knows of other hams in the area of south central Ohio, you could PM me about, it would be appreciated. Get their permission for me to contact them for a meet up someplace or something.

Lt Dan | 01-10-2009 02:36 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Twisted Avatar (Post 1505379) Buy all means keep us posted......... this is something I have on my hit list to take up. T
TA, To do this you will have to have the other half of your brain busy at the books while you post here with the other half!:111: :signs14: I know I've spent a lot less time online since I started this pursuit. Just drop in to see what's going on and not posting much.:s1:

Tragedy Trousers | 01-10-2009 03:05 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Lt Dan (Post 1505584) What I need now is a radio that will receive hf usb, & lsb signals as the SW is picking up these frequencies that are garbled, I suspect are Hams talking. Even the cw signals aren't coming through like I think they should. Fun listening to other countries on the SW all the same. Any advice on what radio I should buy next? This is a budget setup!!! No top dollar stuff please. Since I plan to get my license, even a transceiver might be ok, but it might tempt me to key up prematurely. I haven't met any local hams yet to guide me, so if anyone knows of other hams in the area of south central Ohio, you could PM me about, it would be appreciated. Get their permission for me to contact them for a meet up someplace or something.
You dont want to go too cheap otherwise as you have found out your not going to get the audio quality. Heres a nice HF Transceiver currently bidding under 300 which will also get the WARC bands. http://cgi.ebay.com/YAESU-FT-101ZD-M...3%3A1|294%3A50

CajunCoin | 01-10-2009 03:52 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Tragedy Trousers (Post 1505631) You dont want to go too cheap otherwise as you have found out your not going to get the audio quality. Heres a nice HF Transceiver currently bidding under 300 which will also get the WARC bands. http://cgi.ebay.com/YAESU-FT-101ZD-M...3%3A1|294%3A50
Bwst thing is to get his Tech License and get his feet wet slowly, I would recommend a new Radio when buying your first Radio due to the fact most used stuff might have warts and it is no fun with a crippled radio getting on the air. A handheld or VHF/UHF 144/440 MHz is the starter place to be in radio and with that he can branch out. I live in S. Louisiana and he lives in Ohio so trying to be an ELMER (MENTOR in ham speak) is hard but we are here for you LT. Dan. You can get a 2 meter radio for about $175.00 new and a VHF/UHF model will run you 300+/- do not try to buy everything at once, a little at a time will do it. Antennas can be simple or elaborate, wire is cheap and coax while not a bargain, can be had pretty easily. HF rigs can get pricey but a good basic rig which should allow you to work SSB/CW/DIGITAL like the Alinco DX-70th runs about 700 bucks. Once you get experience about radios, a tube type radio backup can be had for little or nothing at a ham fest with the ability to test it out on the spot with electricity and a dummy load. Good hunting and Good DX.

Lt Dan | 01-10-2009 04:41 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Yes, I did think of ePray, but if I'm going to buy used, I'd rather do it at the Ham thing in Dayton this spring. By that time I hope to have my license. Until then, I do think the idea of a hand held 2 meter or maybe extend the budget a bit and get a mobile that would suffice for getting on the air, getting experience, make a few friends, learn as I go...

Emc2 | 01-11-2009 02:00 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote from T-Avatar: Jim, I am sending you this message via my VHF ham radio sitting in my ham shack using only battery power and my laptop to reply. The connection from my radio via airwaves into the Internet is via what is called a gateway. I could also do this from my car, or on a mountain top using only batteries and a portable antenna. I could also do it via HF or UHF. I could use a mode called PSK31, and if you had a ham radio I could send it to you in this same format peer to peer with no internet connection needed. So, my point is that anyone with just a ["No Code"] Technicians license can do this. The license is $15, and a simple 35 question test. I hold what is called an Extra class license AD7VV and so can use more advanced modes to communicate. " I would love to learn more about how to get to the internet thru HAM radio using a wireless-capable computer!

Twisted Avatar | 01-11-2009 02:29 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment I agree THAT is a awesome set up. Just think.............GIM FOREVER!!!!

Emc2 | 01-13-2009 12:35 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment oh wow; here's some info on internet via shortwave; reading about this evoked memories of my first ventures with the usenets and peer-to-peer connections but those were via phonelines; these are all via shortwave. Called 'packet radio' and 'PSK31': http://www.choisser.com/packet/part01.html http://www.arrl.org/tis/info/HTML/psk31/index.html http://www.on4kst.com/chat/start.php ....or actually, is PSK31 actually high-frequency? is HF the opposite of shortwave?

Fullpower | 01-13-2009 12:59 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment HF = shortwave. The frequency range from 3 megacycles through 30 megacycles is known as High Frequency or HF.

Zusn | 01-13-2009 03:04 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Fullpower (Post 1509024) HF = shortwave. The frequency range from 3 megacycles through 30 megacycles is known as High Frequency or HF.
You talk like my electronics instructor did. I guess old habits die hard, hehehe :smile:

Lt Dan | 01-13-2009 07:35 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Did some searching on PSK31. I use Linux on my computer, so I wanted to know if there was Linux software support for PSK31. Turns out there is and also for the Mac users. The only other hardware requirement for the computer that I found, was you need a sound card. Don't know why the one built into the MB wouldn't do the same thing. I'm still studying those tech license questions, checking on locations for testing as I progress.

Lt Dan | 01-16-2009 09:35 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Update; I found a local club (about 15 miles) that is not in the ARRL list of clubs but is now affiliated. I went to their meeting last night, introduced myself, and got to know a few of the Hams. turns out they will be having a test day next month on the Saturday after their next meeting. So, if I don't make the out of town test date Feb 2nd, I should be ready for the exam by the local date. Just thought the Hams here would be interested in my status. Nice - friendly group at the meeting last night. Made me feel welcome, offered any help I might need getting set up.

Tallships | 01-16-2009 10:22 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Lt Dan (Post 1514712) Update; I found a local club (about 15 miles) that is not in the ARRL list of clubs but is now affiliated. I went to their meeting last night, introduced myself, and got to know a few of the Hams. turns out they will be having a test day next month on the Saturday after their next meeting. So, if I don't make the out of town test date Feb 2nd, I should be ready for the exam by the local date. Just thought the Hams here would be interested in my status. Nice - friendly group at the meeting last night. Made me feel welcome, offered any help I might need getting set up.
good luck. Hope you ace it.:565:

DrillAndFill | 01-16-2009 11:57 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment I used to think that a low-power CW rig is the only required item, since if you have 5-10 watts and a high dipole or, better, a beam, you can work most of the country. But now that PSK31 is so popular, you should have something with SSB capability and easy access for using PSK31. Of course, I have never used PSK31 in my own shack, but every time I see a friend cranking away I'm surprised at how good it is. I sometimes think of hooking up my laptop to the radio, but then I see the paddles, turn on 30 meters and away I go.

Tallships | 01-16-2009 12:44 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment I dont know a whole lot about this, but is that what those modem like sounds are on the shortwave bands? Are these coded, or can you just put them into a modem and listen to them? What goods would I need to make this happen? I am also interested in getting shortwave t.v. and know nothing about it. Any help would be appreciated.

Tallships | 01-16-2009 12:47 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Think I have found out. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PSK31 very interesting. I bet this could be used on cbs and frs too ?

Zusn | 01-16-2009 01:57 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Lt Dan (Post 1514712) Just thought the Hams here would be interested in my status. Nice - friendly group at the meeting last night. Made me feel welcome, offered any help I might need getting set up.
I have yet to meet a bad group. Sure you'll find the jerks on the air, but that's to be expected. When it comes to ham groups, they are very helpful and happy that other people are interested in radio. A good ham group is the foundation for new operators. I'm glad you found one Lt. Dan, let us know how the test goes! Remember, there are practice tests on www.qrz.com

DrillAndFill | 01-16-2009 02:17 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallships (Post 1514976) http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PSK31 very interesting. I bet this could be used on cbs and frs too ?
Not gonna happen on FRS, because PSK31 uses single sideband modulation, as opposed to FM. The article mentioned something I hadn't thought of: polar propagation will mess with PSK31, since PSK31 is phase modulated. Man, polar propagation can warp the timing of signals unbelievably! I have seen successful PSK31 communication under circumstances in which I could discern nothing on the frequency. If you're hearing lots of digital beeps, it's not PSK31. PSK31 is pretty amazing: dump error correction and all sorts of things become possible. You see few errors in the transmissions, anyway, even under poor conditions.

Zusn | 01-16-2009 02:30 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallships (Post 1514976) Think I have found out. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PSK31 very interesting. I bet this could be used on cbs and frs too ?
Sort of, legally no. The amateur bands are laid out for the different forms of communication. http://www.arrl.org/FandES/field/reg...ands_color.pdf I wouldn't mess with data over CB and FRS. The amateur bands have so much more to offer.

Lt Dan | 01-16-2009 02:33 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Got interested to see what PSK31 was all about and checked out the link. I had heard of it, but was unsure if, since it works with a computer, if it would work with my OS (Linux). Not a problem, free downloads of what I'd need to run with it. Not sure about if I could use it with a tech license or not, but It'll take me a while to get my "shack" equipped for anything other than 2M to start anyway. Figure on upgrading to general soon as I can, not sure about extra as there is so much I need to know before I can do that. "Gotta learn to wade before I go for the swim."

teacher | 01-17-2009 11:17 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Zusn (Post 1481508) A HAM radio license does not equal gun registration. A HAM radio license is equivalent to a drivers license. All it says is that you're allowed to operate on these frequencies. No one knows if you have a radio, or how many. It would be a HUGE waste of time knocking on the door of every license holder looking to take their radios.
This is an interesting point. I believe statistics suggest that thousands, even tens of thousands actually earn a license but never own or operate their own radio, much less set up a permanent station at home capable of making phone call connections over radio waves. Quote:
Originally Posted by Bill843 (Post 1481442) Yea but as I noted in another thread--should you get a HAM license or not?
The idea behind licensing the Amateur radio operator includes a learning concept that evolves over time. Hams themselves are responsible for the entire testing process and the hobby is intended to be self-regulated. The fact is that radio operators are sharing frequencies where poor operating skill can interfere with other communications systems. Since the idea is to practice radio operations on a regular enough basis, so as to be proficient during emergencies, skilled operating practices are appropriate. Further, radio equipment can include high power devices which could cause serious harm. The thought that an operator would spend some time thinking about this seems a good idea. I�ve made Ham radio a part of our middle school math and science curriculum for years, reinforcing the use of formulas, making connections between math and geography, science and writing. Our school club has seen kids as young as the fourth grade pass the license exam and we�ve seen these same kids operate the school station capably. The entry level exam is 35 multiple choice questions; you need to get 26 right to pass. Many GIM types could surely cram and pass after a weekend or two of study. For others, local clubs offer free classes that introduce the hobby, demonstrate radio operations and help prepare you for the exam. The book our club uses is really written for adults. Our students read it in class and with their parents at home. It includes every question in the pool, some six hundred multiple choice questions and their answers. There will be no surprises on the exam.

Lt Dan | 01-18-2009 09:19 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Zusn (Post 1515060) Remember, there are practice tests on www.qrz.com
I got up the courage to try the test tonight. Keep in mind I have not finished studying all the test manual yet. I only took it once as a matter of practice, I'll probably not take it more than once or twice a day. I scored a passing grade the first try, 89.X % I've two weeks left until the test date, only weather or some other emergency will keep me from making that test date. I'd like to ace it, but a score like I got on the sample test would make me happy. I might be ready for the general test before I thought.

CajunCoin | 01-18-2009 11:45 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Lt Dan (Post 1517870) I got up the courage to try the test tonight. Keep in mind I have not finished studying all the test manual yet. I only took it once as a matter of practice, I'll probably not take it more than once or twice a day. I scored a passing grade the first try, 89.X % I've two weeks left until the test date, only weather or some other emergency will keep me from making that test date. I'd like to ace it, but a score like I got on the sample test would make me happy. I might be ready for the general test before I thought.
Nothing to be ashamed about, 89% is well above passing and means you have a grasp of the subject matter. just study the Technician Class and get it down and then you can work on the General. Good Lucke CU on the bands.

Dave Thomas | 01-19-2009 01:38 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Oh and don't worry about licensing when buying a radio. You don't need a license to buy a ham radio. I think you may for an amplifier that goes up on 10 meters, but if you want one, just buy one. Just don't transmit, unless TSHTF that is. Oh and it helps to learn how to use it too, just so you don't blow it up.

lessoil=+pm | 01-19-2009 01:59 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Thomas (Post 1518201) Oh and don't worry about licensing when buying a radio. You don't need a license to buy a ham radio. I think you may for an amplifier that goes up on 10 meters, but if you want one, just buy one. Just don't transmit, unless TSHTF that is. Oh and it helps to learn how to use it too, just so you don't blow it up.
got some recommendations for radios for shtf & budget? not looking for a hobby but am down in a valley & info will be premo.

Lt Dan | 01-19-2009 08:22 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by lessoil=+pm (Post 1518238) got some recommendations for radios for shtf & budget? not looking for a hobby but am down in a valley & info will be premo.
Here is some options for two-way radio communications. You can get a ham license as well and open up a more reliable two-way world as well. You don't have to have a lot of money to get into it. You can buy a radio for what you'd pay for a high end CB. If your main concern is finding out what is going on out in the world, get a real good shortwave radio, one that will receive CW, SSB, all SW bands plus standard AM and FM signals. Especially insist on SSB, as my Grundig S350DL from Radio Shack doesn't have it and I'm disappointed. To receive SW you'll need a good antenna living down in the valley. With 2M ham and a near by repeater on a hill top, you should be able to call out as long as the repeater stays up. GMRS also uses repeaters, but they are more for special purpose use and you'll need to get a license to operate on that service as well. I don't believe you'll have to take a test for it, just apply and follow some guidelines. I know I'm no expert on this, just some things I've personally checked into. Hope that helped.

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lessoil=+pm | 01-19-2009 08:57 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Lt Dan (Post 1518477) Here is some options for two-way radio communications. You can get a ham license as well and open up a more reliable two-way world as well. You don't have to have a lot of money to get into it. You can buy a radio for what you'd pay for a high end CB. If your main concern is finding out what is going on out in the world, get a real good shortwave radio, one that will receive CW, SSB, all SW bands plus standard AM and FM signals. Especially insist on SSB, as my Grundig S350DL from Radio Shack doesn't have it and I'm disappointed. To receive SW you'll need a good antenna living down in the valley. With 2M ham and a near by repeater on a hill top, you should be able to call out as long as the repeater stays up. GMRS also uses repeaters, but they are more for special purpose use and you'll need to get a license to operate on that service as well. I don't believe you'll have to take a test for it, just apply and follow some guidelines. I know I'm no expert on this, just some things I've personally checked into. Hope that helped.
thanks lt. dan i'll digest- as i am so new & check out u'r link. i've read a part of a test study & know electric basics so i may get more involved or even take the test. as a young kid we had an old zenth that had bands that got ship to shore + other bands & i got london once- don't remember what happened to the radio but it was fascinating the few times i was left to 'play' around with it. thanks again; good luck on u'r test!

teacher | 01-19-2009 11:03 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Thomas (Post 1518201) Oh and don't worry about licensing when buying a radio... Oh and it helps to learn how to use it too, just so you don't blow it up.
I guess if you are past child rearing age, your kids are grown and you are no longer worried about harming your wife, neighbors or causing interference on their TVs and wireless phones, I could see why you are not worried about a license. Honestly, the time one invests into studying for a license will pay dividends later when it comes time to depend on the radio equipment. And if your goal is to actually communicate, long distances, you're going to want an antenna, you know, those big things that sit above hundreds of thousands of licensed radio operator's houses all over the country. This image I found online showing someone�s HF beam, an antenna designed to optimize long distance communications. http://goldismoney.info/forums/pictu...&pictureid=432 I found this image online too showing VHF and UHF antennas designed for local communications. http://goldismoney.info/forums/pictu...&pictureid=433

teacher | 01-19-2009 12:35 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment http://goldismoney.info/forums/pictu...&pictureid=434 This image was taken in my math classroom during a week long amateur radio contest for school kids a few years ago. We are projecting the PSK computer screen on the electronic whiteboard. The radio station is being operated by a few students while others monitor the communication as they measure the distance between the two stations on a map using scales and ratios; a connection between Ham radio, math and geography. The PSK display shows three main windows. The bottom third shows the waterfall. In this case, the radio was transmitting around 14.070 mHz, what we call 20-meter PSK. The left window shows communication between our school station and the other operator, in this case northwest Texas. Our side of the conversation is green text. The window to the right shows other communications taking place. The concept behind PSK, a digital communications mode, is that it doesn�t take up very much bandwidth. A voice communication would require the entire yellow spectrum in the display, where as here, in PSK mode, the yellow spectrum actually represents a dozen or more separate, two-way communications. You can see them as thicker yellow bands in the waterfall. If the image is clear enough for you, you�ll also notice some of the thickest bands have red lines in them. This indicates that the operator is overdriving his or her transmitter and is for sure causing interference for those communicating on either side, slightly higher or lower in frequency. It is also possible that the transmitter may live a much shorter life; in PSK mode it is necessary that you run your transmitter at 50% power. In this case, more is less. http://goldismoney.info/forums/pictu...&pictureid=435 This second image shows the operating station. The laptop is running free software called DigiPan. We are using the sound card built into the computer to convert our digital signal into analog signals for our transmitter. A "black box" provides software control of the radio, mainly switching back and forth between transmit and receive; we are using a RigBlaster. You can see the transmitter is mounted under the shelf and a 20-amp power supply is sitting just above it.

Zusn | 01-19-2009 05:36 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by teacher (Post 1516792) I�ve made Ham radio a part of our middle school math and science curriculum for years, reinforcing the use of formulas, making connections between math and geography, science and writing. Our school club has seen kids as young as the fourth grade pass the license exam and we�ve seen these same kids operate the school station capably.
That has to be one of the neatest things I've read in a while. My hat is off to you sir!

Lt Dan | 01-22-2009 12:32 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Bump! I know there were or is a lot of old timers in Ham radio that resisted the change in the licensing process by doing away with Morse code requirement. I don't blame them in a way, however with all the technical changes we have at our disposal, it is still a challenge to learn new method of communicating. One look at the equipment used 50 odd years ago and then today, reflect many changes. Most of the equipment back then was designed for CW. A lot of the time, it was either Mil-surp, or homebrewed. Today, especially in emergency radio, the need to pass that info as fast as possible to anyone who might be listening in makes voice comms that much more necessary. IMO. So, just to keep this thread alive for now, I'm doing quite well with my studies for my tech test. In fact I could probably pass it now, but the next date for me to try is Feb 2nd. What then? Well start studying for the test for General license. I may give my brain a rest for a week or two, but I've already picked out the study material for the next step. First I'll need a entry level rig. I've been looking at handhelds, but think I may spend a little extra and get a portable. Any opinions beside what has already been given. Pros? Cons? Favorite brands?

Tallships | 01-22-2009 04:26 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment I took that practice test without even studying and got about 80% right. Did have some lucky guesses with the multiple choice.

Zusn | 01-22-2009 05:26 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Lt Dan (Post 1524927) What then? Well start studying for the test for General license. I may give my brain a rest for a week or two, but I've already picked out the study material for the next step. First I'll need a entry level rig. I've been looking at handhelds, but think I may spend a little extra and get a portable. Any opinions beside what has already been given. Pros? Cons? Favorite brands?
Keep an eye on craigslist. I've seen some pretty good stuff on there for great prices. If I were on a budget and looking for my first rig, I'd start there. There are three main commercial brands that you'll hear the most about. Icom, Yaesu and Kenwood. They all make/made good radios. Plenty of reviews out there on just about every model. I prefer Icom. I have a T7H handheld and 2100H for the car. Can't go wrong with Yaesu either. I'm not too familiar with Kenwood and I don't hear much about them.

Lt Dan | 01-22-2009 05:51 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment This is one I'm considering: <table border="0" width="100%"><tbody><tr><td class="bluehead"> Yaesu FT857D Information </td> <td width="31%"></td> </tr> </tbody></table> <table border="0"> <tbody><tr> <td> http://www.aesham.com/display_graphics/ft857.gif </td> </tr> <tr> <td> Click the image for a larger view </td> </tr> </tbody></table> Click Here For Prices & Accessories Ultra-compact, HF/VHF/UHF 100WAll-Mode Mobile, Blends leading-edge technologies of the FT-897 and MARK-V into the smallest full-power HF multi-mode. Now includes 60M! Unique ergonomics deliver unmatched ease of use with an ultra-compact design featuring a large,main tuning dial. Covers HF, 50, 144 and 430 MHz, with 0.1�56, 76�108, 118-164 and 430-470 MHz receive. Power: 100W HF/6M, 50W 2M, 20W 70cm. 200 memories (10 groups); Enhanced performance with installed DSP board; Large, multi-color dot matrix display; IF shift; Noise blanker; IPO; AGC; CTCSS/DCS; Auto repeater shift; SmartSearch�; Spectrum scope; ARTS�; Optional remote-head operation and remote control microphone. Click Here For Specifications Amateur Electronic Supply

Zusn | 01-22-2009 06:54 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Lt Dan (Post 1525698) This is one I'm considering: <table border="0" width="100%"><tbody><tr><td class="bluehead"> Yaesu FT857D Information </td> <td width="31%"></td> </tr> </tbody></table> <table border="0"> <tbody><tr> <td> http://www.aesham.com/display_graphics/ft857.gif </td> </tr> <tr> <td> Click the image for a larger view </td> </tr> </tbody></table> Click Here For Prices & Accessories Ultra-compact, HF/VHF/UHF 100WAll-Mode Mobile, Blends leading-edge technologies of the FT-897 and MARK-V into the smallest full-power HF multi-mode. Now includes 60M! Unique ergonomics deliver unmatched ease of use with an ultra-compact design featuring a large,main tuning dial. Covers HF, 50, 144 and 430 MHz, with 0.1�56, 76�108, 118-164 and 430-470 MHz receive. Power: 100W HF/6M, 50W 2M, 20W 70cm. 200 memories (10 groups); Enhanced performance with installed DSP board; Large, multi-color dot matrix display; IF shift; Noise blanker; IPO; AGC; CTCSS/DCS; Auto repeater shift; SmartSearch�; Spectrum scope; ARTS�; Optional remote-head operation and remote control microphone. Click Here For Specifications Amateur Electronic Supply
That rig is awesome! If I had the money, I'd own 2 of them!! If you get that, I'll be very jealous :adore:

Lt Dan | 01-22-2009 07:27 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment A guy can dream! I'm hoping for something that will do more than just be a high priced walkie talkie and take me into the general license and beyond. Of course, realistically I should just buy a handheld to start, as I'll probably want one of those anyway.

teacher | 01-23-2009 09:16 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Lt Dan (Post 1525698) This is one I'm considering: Yaesu FT857D
I agree, this is an excellent radio. When we purchased an HF rig for our school club we considered it but choose a Kenwood Rig instead. The reason was ease of use -- the FT857 uses lots of menus, and many functions require you to drill down through the menus. We choose the Kenwood TS-570S. It is an all mode HF plus 6-meter rig. We use it for PSK and voice. It has more knobs on the front panel making it an earlier rig to operate for our students. http://goldismoney.info/forums/pictu...&pictureid=465 While this rig has a larger footprint and table pads for sitting on a table, this is a mobile rig and it comes with a mounting bracket. Most Hams tell new Technicians to buy an HT that works both 2-meter and 70cm. This was my first radio as well. Again, those drill down menus play a big roll so spending some time with the radio in your hand, chatting a bit with a sales person, how does it feel... Good luck!

Lt Dan | 01-23-2009 10:50 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment So, Icom, Yaesu and Kenwood are the ones to look at. There is a Universal Radio store within easy driving distance from my home. I believe they sell all those brands. I want hands on feel before I actually buy. Guys at the local club might even have something extra laying around they would sell me at a bargain price that would get me started. Give them a reason to upgrade their rig. I've determined to not buy until I can legally try.

teacher | 01-24-2009 02:44 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Lt Dan (Post 1527047) So, Icom, Yaesu and Kenwood are the ones to look at.
Yes, these companies all have excellent reputations but there are other brands, some cheaper, that may offer excellent HTs and other rigs. I've been buying and selling HTs and mobile rigs for years on eBay, although not as much in recent years. I've also bought several used rigs from people at Ham Radio "Flea Markets" and had outstanding luck -- the radios actually worked even though they were used. Quote:
I've determined to not buy until I can legally try.
This can be a great motivator, but so can buying a radio and listening in on simplex channels and repeaters. With the HT antenna your range is line of site. It can be a fun project to map your coverage area. When you hear a call sign you can look it up at www.qrz.com and plot it. You can also connect an external antenna to your HT, either in the car or at home. You could buy just the HT (some offer 6-meters as well and that might be fun), a mobile antenna and say a base antenna for the house. 73s

Lt Dan | 01-29-2009 07:14 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Thanks Teacher and all the rest of you hams or others, decided a bump was in order. Weather permitting, the test is fast approaching. Monday evening coming up. Getting anxious to get it done. Think I'm ready. Been doing those test at QRZ.com and only once in a while do I miss one or two questions in a test. Most results are 100%, but not all, so I continue to study. Looking forward to shopping for my first radio, studying for my general exam, setting up some type of shack. Lots of other things too, any ham would understand. I'll keep y'all posted.

lessoil=+pm | 01-30-2009 07:09 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment good luck with the weather dan[& with the test!].

Twisted Avatar | 02-01-2009 08:14 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Rather than start a new thread I think this info ties in nicely with what is being shared . Hat tip to everyone who contributed :ok: Building a Low-Cost, Low-Profile Shortwave Dipole Antenna, by Jerry the Generator Guy First, you decided to get your own shortwave receiver. You wanted to be able to listen to unfiltered worldwide news. Applause, and a pat on the back, for taking a positive step. However, an unexpected problem may soon surface. Any internal ferrite or wand/rod antenna, like what the radio came with, will only effectively receive strong signals. Unfortunately, it can’t do a good job on weak signals. The obvious solution is to add an external antenna. But it may be spotted by the neighborhood or local “whiners” may complain that your obnoxious visible antenna is interfering with their television or radio reception. The fact that you are only receiving won’t stop their perception that it’s your fault. A second issue is that the “typical" outdoor antenna may not survive severe weather. It may fail in high wind/snow/ice. Another negative is that any antenna wire in the wind will pick up static charges when dust hits the antenna. This dust hitting the antenna is what causes the “pop” sound in the audio during a storm. This electrostatic discharge (ESD) travels down the lead in wire and may weaken or damage the front end [electronic section] of the receiver. If you have an outside antenna a good antenna discharge unit is strongly recommended. Is there a satisfactory solution for these problems? Yes! First determine what lengths of wire would be needed for a tuned dipole antenna to receive each desired frequency. Many Ham or Shortwave books either tell you how to calculate the desired dipole wire length or provide a suggested length data table for you. If you are fortunate the manual with the receiver may provide these parameters. My low cost recommended solution follows: I bought some 4 -conductor telephone cable and some 50 ohm TV coax cable at the local Home Depot. The 50 ohm cable is routed from the receiver to the center of the antenna. Cut the telephone wire at the center of the total length. Strip the insulation back slightly on all of the center wires. Solder [using electrical - not plumber type solder] the center conductor to one of the wire groups. Solder the coax shield to the other set of wires. Measure the desired distance from the center to the desired endpoint for a specific dipole. Carefully slit the outer cover of the phone cable at that location. Cut and remove the balance of an individual colored wire. Cutting the dipole for the lowest frequency first [ longest length ] will make removing the extra wire lengths easier. Measure, cut and repeat the same steps at the other side of the antenna. Note: Some books will suggest reducing the length of the antenna wire elements by 5%. This reduction is to compensate for the “close” distance to the other dipoles. Precise tune lengths are needed for transmitting but may not be necessary if the antenna is used for an entire shortwave band. The generic “rule of thumb” for most receiving antennas is the more wire available for signal pickup the better. Repeat this process for the other three wires. Cover the soldered connections with electrical tape. Fasten the antenna in a straight line along the cornice or eave of the house. Paint or stain to match the color nearby and it looks like it has been there forever. Note: If four tuned lengths aren’t enough - then the same approach could be done with 8-conductor unshielded computer network cable. You now have a good antenna to pick up those weaker signals. In addition, the house now protects the antenna from any severe weather effects. If a nosey “snooper” comes by all that they will see is a “telephone” wire. Permalink - Email This

Dave Thomas | 02-01-2009 07:28 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by teacher (Post 1518736) I guess if you are past child rearing age, your kids are grown and you are no longer worried about harming your wife, neighbors or causing interference on their TVs and wireless phones, I could see why you are not worried about a license. Honestly, the time one invests into studying for a license will pay dividends later when it comes time to depend on the radio equipment. And if your goal is to actually communicate, long distances, you're going to want an antenna, you know, those big things that sit above hundreds of thousands of licensed radio operator's houses all over the country.
Yeah, I guess. But I won't let licensing preclude someone from running out a buying a radio and jumping in with both feet. Ham radio is rife with the holier than thou types, really chock full of all American lawyer types. I've been weened from a tender age by folks that had really good technical skill, but when it came to regulation or laws, they were more on the pirate side than anything else. I was also taught by straight lace "Riley is going to come to your house and paddle you, if I don't hear you ID every ten minutes!" Folks as well. I got the most enjoyment from actually building my radios. I never really gave much thought to regulation, other than the laws of physics. Wasting power outside the band you want to transmit is just plain old silly. I guess I found it really self evident. Oh and I didn't mean to turn anyone off as in not erecting a proper antenna. By all means study antenna theory. I was more or less trying to just give the impression that one does not need a 1600 ft beverage antenna, or some monster with gigantic capacity hats to start listening to radio. For a while I lived in an apartment, I had a slinky dipole, and tuned it up with a Z match. It wasn't the most efficient antenna in the world but it worked. A good book to get your hands on is the ARRL antenna book, or W1FB's antenna notebook. Wire antennas are great, because they are cheap, and they work. And listening to the radio doesn't mean you have to kill your wife or kids either. Remember, millions of citizen band operators procreate on a regular basis.

Lt Dan | 02-02-2009 11:54 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by lessoil=+pm (Post 1539647) good luck with the weather dan[& with the test!].
Weather looks like it will be a go for tonight. I'll post pass :biggrin: or fail results :censored: later. Another test coming up in 2&1/2 weeks if not. TA, thanks for that bit on antennas, never thought of using 4-pair telephone wire for making a dipole for shortwave. Dave T, while I understand your feeling on hams, my military training in proper radio procedures is drilled into my brain the desire to do this the right way. While there is nothing wrong with tinkering around with radios and listening in, I think any attempt to trespass into the ham bands without the proper license would be like hunting on private land without a proper permit. JMO :15_1_70v:

Lt Dan | 02-02-2009 07:32 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Got back from taking the test less than an hour ago. I PASSED! Guy said I missed one question. Can't imagine missing any, I was sure I got them all right, but there was that one I didn't remember being in the practice tests., Oh well! He said I should have my call sign sometime this evening. FCC is all automated or always open....

MNeagle | 02-02-2009 07:42 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Congratulations!

Tallships | 02-02-2009 08:00 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Lt Dan (Post 1545919) Got back from taking the test less than an hour ago. I PASSED! Guy said I missed one question. Can't imagine missing any, I was sure I got them all right, but there was that one I didn't remember being in the practice tests., Oh well! He said I should have my call sign sometime this evening. FCC is all automated or always open....
That rocks. What was the question you missed?

Twisted Avatar | 02-02-2009 08:05 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment 1 Attachment(s) Quote:
Originally Posted by Lt Dan (Post 1545919) Got back from taking the test less than an hour ago. I PASSED! Guy said I missed one question. Can't imagine missing any, I was sure I got them all right, but there was that one I didn't remember being in the practice tests., Oh well! He said I should have my call sign sometime this evening. FCC is all automated or always open....
........................

Lt Dan | 02-02-2009 08:40 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Tallships (Post 1545957) That rocks. What was the question you missed?
I didn't ask, they didn't say. It all seemed immaterial at the time. There were several others in the process of taking their exams at the time. Anyway, now it's start on the next stage.

CajunCoin | 02-02-2009 09:54 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment 7 Quote:
Originally Posted by Lt Dan (Post 1545919) Got back from taking the test less than an hour ago. I PASSED! Guy said I missed one question. Can't imagine missing any, I was sure I got them all right, but there was that one I didn't remember being in the practice tests., Oh well! He said I should have my call sign sometime this evening. FCC is all automated or always open....
:15_1_70v::15_1_70v::15_1_70v::15_1_70v:ok::ok:: FB OM, glad to have you on the bands, you are the man of the hour, now, starts an addiction that lasts the rest of your life.:10_1_20: 73s de Cajuncoin:553:

lessoil=+pm | 02-02-2009 10:43 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment congrats Lt. Dan!

Zusn | 02-03-2009 12:29 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Awesome job Dan!!!

leadfoot | 02-04-2009 05:46 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Lt Dan (Post 1545919) Got back from taking the test less than an hour ago. I PASSED! Guy said I missed one question. Can't imagine missing any, I was sure I got them all right, but there was that one I didn't remember being in the practice tests., Oh well! He said I should have my call sign sometime this evening. FCC is all automated or always open....
Congrats. They told me it would take 4 to 6 days for my license to appear online.

leadfoot | 02-04-2009 06:09 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment I'm in the hunt as well for a good all-band, all-mode (DC to light) mobile/portable rig. That FT-857 you're considering looks interesting. Eham.net is one of my favorite review sites and this rates a 4.5/5. However, below is one review that highlights a theme that runs through many of the reviews on this rig - even from those that gave it a 5/5. http://www.eham.net/reviews/detail/3046 Quote:
Hmmm... This was my first ever hf radio, and I can't quite figure out what I think about it. When I first bought it, I had no idea what I wanted to do with it. Rtty? SSB? CW? I had no clue, so bought the radio that could "do it all". I was really excited when I got it, but I realized that it did everything, but not necessarily well. I started to get into cw, but I realized that the receiver wasn't too sensitive and I was having a hard time pulling anything out. I got the 500 hz filter (1/6 the cost of the radio!) and that helped with qrm, but it didn't do much else. Before you buy this radio, think about what you want to do with it. I didn't know what I wanted to do with it, but I liked it because it was small. It turns out, smaller is not necessarily better! More menus, more functions per button, less knobs... the list goes on and on. The functionality seems to go down with the smaller size. If you are looking for a jack-of-all-trades radio that you can put into your car, this radio is for you! But if you are looking for a cheap, introductory base station (like me), find a normal-sized, used rig. There are cheaper, better options for a base statio. This is defidently very cheap for a new radio, though! I hope that this review helped you without being excessively long. I also want to remind you that you should not take what I think as fact. Go to a friends house or a dealer and give the knob a twirl. Find out for yourself what it is like and if it fits your criteria. Also, think about what you would like to do with it.
Here's the page that lists all the ratings for HF rigs. I'm sorting by score looking at the ones that have good scores and more than just a couple of reviewers. http://www.eham.net/reviews/products/14 By that criteria, the Icom IC-751A (now unfortunately retired) and the Elecraft K2 show just how good a rig can be though both have shortcomings as well. Good luck.

Lt Dan | 02-04-2009 08:54 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Update: I went yesterday to a Universal Radio store and let the sales guy talk me into a Yaesu VX-170. While it is very well built, not too tiny, easy to work with, I've yet to be able to pull in any stations in the ham 2M band, while just scanning the freqs inside my house. That is without an external antenna. I fear I will have to get in contact with one of the local guys to help me out a bit. I think from my location, I'm only in a kind of blind stop from the repeater towers. I know the radio will receive because I can dial in the weather station freqs and hear them fine. I did pick up a magnet antenna for my truck, so when I head in town I'll test it out in a mobile setting. I've also picked up people talking above the ham range, of course transmit is only for the ham freqs. The reason I let the guy talk me into a 2M and not a duel or tri-band was 2M seems to be the most active. Well maybe for where he lives! He could be right of course! I also bought a drop-in charger so it can be ready to go in a short time. May add a car charger and spare battery as well. OTT, I need to climb up on the roof and see if I can pull in the repeaters around that way. Then I'd at least know if it is worth putting an antenna up there or not. More incentive to get my General license, so I can extend my range. Can't wait until Dayton in May. I many have to look for a test location sooner. Already have the General Manual headed my way, so I can not only do the exams online but read the book. That combo worked out great for me for my tech license

DMac00 | 02-04-2009 12:30 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Emc2 (Post 1506653) I would love to learn more about how to get to the internet thru HAM radio using a wireless-capable computer!
This is sweet tech. I havent looked into it before. You can be dang sure I will now! Some initial research: http://www.qsl.net/kb9mwr/projects/wireless/plan.html Quote:
High Speed Multi Media Using Part 15 Wireless EthernetDevices For Amateur Radio <b>Background:</b> The 13 centimeter band, 2300-2450 and 5250-5650MHz became available for amateur use in 1945.&nbsp;&nbsp; The 5 centimeter band was realigned to the present allocation, 5650 to 5925 in 1968.&nbsp; The 33 centimeter, 902-928 MHz was allocated to the amateur radio service in 1985. At the same time of the 33 centimeter allocation, the FCC opened the industrial, scientific and medical (ISM) bands to Part 15 radio use in 1985.&nbsp; Prior to about 1980, the ISM bands were considered unacceptable for radio communication because of harmful interference created by such equipment. But several companies and industry groups petitioned the FCC and showed that by using spread spectrum modulation, low-power radios could coexist with ISM radiators.&nbsp; (It should be noted that using unlicensed equipment to provide services to third parties wasn�t in this original scope.)</p> <p>By 1995 it was realized that the complete system authorization rules of Part 15.247 were burdensome for device-based service providers that were starting to emerge. At that time a few new unlicensed bands were created to address this. These include the Unlicensed PCS band, and the more common Unlicensed National Information Infrastructure (U-NII) bands, which has it�s own rules in Part 15.401 to 15.407 There are three U-NII bands, each to address the mixed use. The first 5 GHz chunk is for indoor use with integrated antenna like the original Part 15/ISM sharing scope. The second chunk is for mixed use, and the third for outdoor use with provisions for a user-installable antenna.</p> <p><a href="amprnet.html">Packet radio and the use of TCP/IP</a> for wireless networking by radio amateurs began in the 1970's.&nbsp; This was about the same time Defense Advanced Research Projects Agency (DARPA) was becoming the fundamental pioneer in the call for a global network that later became the internet.&nbsp; (DARPA is an agency of the United States Department of Defense responsible for the development of new technology for use by the military)</p> In 1981 the FCC authorized spread spectrum&nbsp; on amateur frequencies.&nbsp; In 1989 Al Broscius, N3FCT suggested the use of Part 15 Spread Spectrum wireless ethernet devices that were becoming available for amateur packet radio use.&nbsp;&nbsp; <a href="ss_pr.html">Implications for the Radio Amateur</a>- an excerpt from "License-Free Spread Spectrum Packet Radio" by N3FCT in 1989</p> There are numerous manufactures of these spread spectrum networking devices. They operate on the shared 900 MHz <font size="2">(33 cm)</font>, 2.4 <font size="2">(13 cm)</font> and 5.7 <font size="2">(5 cm)</font> GHz bands with speeds between 1 and 54 Mbps. <a href="Wireless_Product_Directory.pdf">1998 Wireless LAN product/feature comparison</a>- by Barry McLarnon, VE3JF (dated) <font size="-1">(mirrored in 1998 from http://hydra.carleton.ca/info/)</font> <br> <a href="allocations.html">Amateur Band Allocations and Permissible Power Comparison</a> - for the 900 MHz, 2.4 &amp; 5.7 GHz bands&nbsp;<br> In early 1997 <a href="http://www.tapr.org/"> TAPR</a> began development of a 1 watt, 128 Kbps 900 MHz FHSS radio, suggesting this is the future for amateur packet radio. In late 1999 the FCC relaxed Amateur Spread Spectrum rules. Now allowing any commercially available Part 15 SS device to be reclassified under Part 97. (Prior only certain spreading codes where allowed.&nbsp; However from roughly 1996 to 1998, <a href="http://www.tapr.org/"> TAPR</a> encouraged hams interested in spread spectrum experimentation using commonly available hardware to obtain special temporary authorization (STA) from the FCC.) <a href="part97.html">Part 97.311</a>- current Amateur spread spectrum rules In late 1999 we formed <a href="http://www.qsl.net/n9zia/">GBPPR</a> to encourage advancement in packet radio using readily available - off the shelf hardware.&nbsp;&nbsp; Some of our <a href="http://www.qsl.net/kb9mwr/projects/wireless/ham80211news.html">media attention</a> included CQ and QST magazines, postings to Slashdot and QRZ.&nbsp; From this our more well noticed work included:</p><p>&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp;&nbsp; <a href="http://www.qsl.net/n9zia/wireless/appendixE.html">915 MHz BDA schematic</a>, <a href="http://www.qsl.net/n9zia/wireless/appendixB.html">2.4 GHz BDA schematic</a>, <a href="http://www.qsl.net/n9zia/wireless/page09.html">Interactive Wireless Design Utilities</a> In mid 2001 the <a href="http://www.arrl.org/hsmm/">ARRL's High Speed Multimedia Working Group</a> (HSMM) was formed &amp; began encouraging widespread use of spread spectrum modes of communications such as IEEE 802.11 on amateur radio frequencies.&nbsp; Unveiled at Dayton 2002 was <a href="http://www.icomamerica.com/amateur/dstar/">Icom's 1.2 GHz Digital D-Star system</a>.&nbsp; In the fall of 2002 <a href="http://www.tapr.org/">TAPR</a> announced it would discontinue it's stalled <a href="http://www.tapr.org/fhss_project.html">900 MHz FHSS radio efforts</a>.&nbsp; In March 2006, the ARRL <a href="http://www2.arrl.org/news/stories/2006/03/20/100/?nc=1">requested to drop the automatic power control requirement</a> on amateur spread spectrum above 1 watt, as it impractical and deters experimentation.&nbsp; Shortly thereafter, the <a href="hsmm.html">HSMM working group fell apart</a> due to dissatisfaction and friction with their recommendations to the ARRL board of directors. In June 2004, open source advocates discovered that the Linksys WRT54 series routers are based on Linux components and thusly asked for the source code to be released.&nbsp; This opened the door for aftermarket/third-party firmware developments.</p> In 2006 an informal hardware abstraction layer (HAL) driver is reached with the Atheros wireless chipset.&nbsp; This as instigated by open source advocates, and benefits hams.&nbsp; It enables operation outside the Part 15 overlap using&nbsp; reflashed/enabled consumer-grade Atheros chipset based gear.&nbsp; (A formal open HAL is reached with the manufacture in July 2007)</p> <p>In 2005 pending the Atheros HAL hacking, a company called Ubiquiti Networks emerges.&nbsp; Their "frequency freedom technology" uses onboard transverters opening the possibility of 400MHz to 9GHz integrated radio technology.&nbsp; In August 2007, they release a competing WiMax product.&nbsp; The XR3; specifically designed for long-distance, outdoor broadband wireless applications.&nbsp; This worked out well for us hams, a their XR3-3.5 version yields over thirty 3 GHz non-overlapping full-width channels unshared with Part 15 unlicensed devices.</p> <b>Today:</b> We know it is possible as unlicensed Part 15 devices to obtain omnidirectional ranges up to about 5 miles and directional ranges up to about 17 miles using high gain antennas. We should also realize that greater communication ranges are possible (if necessary) by reclassifying these devices under Part 97. We are then allowed to <a href="modify.html"> modify them</a> using pre-amps, RF amplifiers and high gain antennas. Then by placing a central routing node in the middle of town on top a tall building/tower or hill they can serve as a inexpensive high speed supplement/alternative to existing packet radio systems. <a href="allocations.html">Part 97 vs Part 15 &amp; Permissible Power Comparison</a> - and clarification<br> <a href="compare.html">Price comparison</a>- between a conventional packet setup and a Symphony setup<br> <a href="clarify.html">Misc. Part 97 clarifications</a>- pertaining to this application<br> True some urban areas may be very infested with Part 15 devices already. But you have 3 bands to choose from, and you shouldn't have many problems if you use FHSS, with one watt amplifiers before your antenna polarized the opposite of everyone else (typically horizontal). <b>My Experiences:</b> I have experimented with Proxim's Symphony 1.6 Mbps Frequency Hopping Spread Spectrum 2.4 GHz network card. It was only $130 and as a Part 15 device coupled with an old 24 dB MMDS 2.5 GHz partial screen parabolic antenna (previously used for receiving rural wireless cable) you could easily obtain ranges up to 6 miles line of sight. <a href="http://www.qsl.net/n9zia/wireless/">Low Cost Wireless Network How-To</a>- our abundance of documented, experiences, work and research (which includes homebrew bi-directional amplifier designs and path-loss calculators) <br> <b>Other Peoples Experiences:</b> During my Proxim Symphony experimentation I sought out reports from other hams who had attempted long distance communications paths: Symphony based links: <a href="reports.html#KE6WED">KE6WED</a>, <a href="reports.html#VE3JF">VE3JF</a>, <a href="reports.html#K5OKC">K5OKC</a>, and <a href="reports.html#4Z4ZQ">4Z4ZQ</a> <p> Other hams exploring and using this technology using different hardware: <a href="reports.html#KO6YQ">KO6YQ</a>, <a href="reports.html#N3WFI">N3WFI</a>, <a href="reports.html#KG6DFV">KG6DFV</a><br> </p></blockquote> <b>Re-classifying:</b> All commercially available wireless ethernet devices are suitable for Amateur use. However there are 3 things you may need to pay attention to when re-classifying. <ol> <li><em>You need to identify your station every 10 minutes by transmitting your callsign in ASCII or by some other method that is publicly documented.</em><br> I suggest having a script send out a ping every 10 minutes with your callsign embedded in it. <font size="-1"><a href="pingid.html">(more info) </a></font> </li><li><em>You will need to keep your operations within the 2400-2450 MHz amateur overlap if you plan to re-classify under Part 97.</em> (this is only an issue on the 2.4 GHz band with FHSS, all other bands have full overlap &amp; DSSS systems can be set by user for center freq below 2.45) Order your Symphony directly from Proxim and send a copy of your license and they will change your cards country code shifting operation below 2450. <font size="-1"> <a href="allocations.html">(more info)</a></font> </li><li><em>If you need to amplify your spread spectrum signal over 1 watt PEP you will need to incorporate automatic transmitter power control.</em> <br> You may need to buy a expensive commercial amplifier (such as Teletronics Bi-directional SmartAmp) to accomplish this. <font size="-1"><a href="pwr.html">(more info)</a></font> </li></ol> If your like me and are seeking a simple way to build a high speed, affordable, RF network, where you mimic the internet and have web, mail, and FTP services, streaming digital audio/video over IP, conferencing, and so on, I encourage you to look into this technology and use it. (This is now commonly referred to as the "<a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hinternet">Hinternet</a>." or High Speed Multimedia- HSMM)&nbsp; If you use this technology and would like to share your experiences, or if you have questions, you may <a href="contactme.html" style="text-decoration: none;"><font color="#000000">contact me</font></a> . Also feel free to link to this document and or reprint any portion of it. <a href="contactme.html" style="text-decoration: none;"><font color="#000000">Steve Lampereur, KB9MWR</font>
There is some more useful information here: http://www.arrl.org/tis/info/HTML/high-speed-digital/ And here: Quote:
[1] http://www.oreilly.com/catalog/wirelesscommnet/ [2] http://www.arrl.org/news/stories/2003/01/10/3/?nc=1 [3] http://nocat.net/ [4] http://freenetworks.org/ [5] http://seattlewireless.net/ [6] http://nycwireless.net [7] http://personaltelco.org/ [8] http://bawug.org/

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Zusn | 02-04-2009 02:38 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Lt Dan (Post 1548931) Update: I went yesterday to a Universal Radio store and let the sales guy talk me into a Yaesu VX-170. While it is very well built, not too tiny, easy to work with, I've yet to be able to pull in any stations in the ham 2M band, while just scanning the freqs inside my house. That is without an external antenna. I fear I will have to get in contact with one of the local guys to help me out a bit. I think from my location, I'm only in a kind of blind stop from the repeater towers. I know the radio will receive because I can dial in the weather station freqs and hear them fine. I did pick up a magnet antenna for my truck, so when I head in town I'll test it out in a mobile setting. I've also picked up people talking above the ham range, of course transmit is only for the ham freqs. The reason I let the guy talk me into a 2M and not a duel or tri-band was 2M seems to be the most active. Well maybe for where he lives! He could be right of course! I also bought a drop-in charger so it can be ready to go in a short time. May add a car charger and spare battery as well. OTT, I need to climb up on the roof and see if I can pull in the repeaters around that way. Then I'd at least know if it is worth putting an antenna up there or not. More incentive to get my General license, so I can extend my range. Can't wait until Dayton in May. I many have to look for a test location sooner. Already have the General Manual headed my way, so I can not only do the exams online but read the book. That combo worked out great for me for my tech license
2m only is good. I have an Icom T7H that is 2m and 70cm. I'm never on the 70cm band. Do you know if the repeaters near you are active? Tune to one and wait. It should transmit it's callsign every 10 minutes. Another thing to do is build your own antenna for it when at home. I just found the plans for a 2 meter antenna that I'm dying to build. Super cheap to make too. www.arrl.org/tis/info/pdf/9304054.pdf http://www.w7dk.org/RCT Technical fi...d Vert Ant.pdf <-- I plan on building this one first A good antenna should take care of any distance issues.

Lt Dan | 02-04-2009 03:50 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Pretty sure it is a distance issue. I went out to get the mail and turned it on while out. I've set the squelch at 5 as I was picking up a lot of static on it and couldn't make any of it out as being intelligent coms. Anyway, I did get something, (noise?), above that level breaking in once in a while. So, I contacted (email) one of the guys here about the issue and am awaiting a reply. Scanner freqs are coming in fine as those towers are usually higher and more powerful. A 5&1/2" rubber duck does not compare to the center loaded telescoping antenna I have on my scanner either. I just haven't had the time to take it on the road to test in various locations. (Just got it yesterday). It comes in fine for a weather band receiver though. LOL. Tomorrow I will be going to the VA which is in a far better location than where my home is, from the repeaters. I'm kind of in a blind spot I think from the ham club repeater. There is also going to be tech classes at the VA on Sat this week. I don't need to go as far as my tech license goes, but want to go and sit in just to find out whatever I can toward my general exam, some of it does carry over. The guy I emailed is also the same guy holding the tech classes.

Dave Thomas | 02-05-2009 10:35 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Lt Dan (Post 1549836) Pretty sure it is a distance issue. I went out to get the mail and turned it on while out.
Congrats on the ticket LT. You'll find that some repeaters will only answer you if you plug in the correct subaudible tone for that repeater. If you've got your handy dandy ARRL repeater directory next to you you'll see something like this next to the repeater entry OT 67.0. That means that the repeater wants to see an input audio tone at that frequency to open up. They will correlate with what tones your right can put out on page 23. I love that rig you've got. I was thinking about a VX-110 or 120 recently. But turn to page 23 of your manual. You'll see a page titled CTCSS operation. Now, some repeaters will only repeat for you if you transmit the same subaudible tone to them when you key the thing. This is so that the repeater won't retransmit any old carrier they sense on the input frequency. So if you are having trouble keying that repeater and they are close to you, I would check out google, pump in that frequency and your location and try and find out about that repeater. Once you know what kind of tone it wants, you can then transmit, and "Open" the repeater. Think of it like a key that you need to transmit, if you have the wrong key (subaudible tone) you won't open the repeater. Hence won't be able to hit it. If you find yourself being able to hear these repeaters all the time but unable to key them, I would find what tone they are using. In the ham world this is refered to "PL" as well. You will hear guys say, "Uhh the PL of the repeater is 114.8" What they are saying is that along with your transmission the repeater needs to hear a tone of 114.8hz to retransmit your signal. They call them subaudible, but when I was a kid, I could have sworn that I heard most of them above 150hz. Just another thing to look out for. Other than that, find a nice high spot where you live, and just start calling CQ on 146.52MHz. You'll never know who will pick up! BTW, I've had a FT-411E that I received as a christmas present back in 1992, it still works. The original battery was the only thing that needed replacment. Yaesu rocks. Congrats man!

Lt Dan | 02-06-2009 11:18 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Dave, Thanks for the info. I'll try that 146.520 freq and see what happens, I'm not really in that bad of a location for radio signals, kind of opened country, lots of farm crop land, I can see the high hills where the towers are. I do have the tone programed in and can hear people talk on occasion. I contacted the guy from the club about this and he explained it to me. I'm not a real talkative guy, more of a writer than a talker, but never the less I do plan on joining in to their net meetings and once I get to know the guys more I'm sure we'll find things to talk about. They just don't know me yet. Once I start helping out around the club house, it will be different. I jumped the big hurdle by getting my ticket, now it's on to the race. I set my home frequency up on the transmit input freq for the tower, set the tone and when I want to listen in all I have to do is hit the REV key on the key pad to switch to the tower output send freq. I heard 2-3 guys talking last night about the road into the tower/clubhouse, it's located on top of one of the highest hills around and so I didn't try to join in as warmer weather is coming and I don't like driving on icy roads, especially since it's a one lane dirt road, kind of steep in places. Seems the reason I don't hear much on the tower is not many people are using it at this time. I bought some stuff to try to build an antenna for 2M. Got the plan from one of the above posts. The one I liked called for 3/32" brass tubing. Not sure where to find that, but all the rest of the stuff I have or can get locally. I do have heavy copper wire and may try to substitute either that or some copper 1/8" pipe I have laying around. Buying stuff already made is okay, but trying to build it yourself is when the fun begins. One more thing, that Yaesu VX-170 is some well built rig, I picked it more for that reason than price or recommendation. I picked just the 2M band, because that is as good a place to start as any and I wanted to save my money for the big rig I really want later.

Lt Dan | 02-06-2009 04:25 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Hard copy of my license arrived in todays mail. Now to study for the general license exam.

mayhem | 02-06-2009 04:52 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Just want to say "Great thread guys". While I'm not gonna get involved, I eat up tech stuff like a sponge. You never know when ya might need it. That's it, carry on.

Dave Thomas | 02-09-2009 01:56 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Lt Dan, stick to the rubber duckie (antenna) for now. Don't worry about soldering together a big ol 2meter antenna just yet. The best impromptu antenna I have made to this date for two meters in a pinch uses a 35mm film can. I actually cut 1/4 wave lengths of copper and stuck them inside a 35mm film can. You take the first leg of the antenna and solder that to the center conductor. String that out, then wire radials to all the mounting posts of the SO-239. You can use ordianry copper wire. I think it's 19" for 2 meters. The radials are about 19" and a quarter. If you really get a hair for a homebrew 2meter antenna pm me and I'll give you enough resources to kill half a day. Yeah it's resonant, but at the time I was using a Johnson Viking marine crystal controlled rig. For now you want to hit the local repeaters. If you live out on big flat hills, you're best bet is trying to key up local repeaters in your vicinity. As you've found out now, whilst reading this, the rubber duckie sucks. Yeah I know, but still keep trying to hit those repeaters. You might hit one or two. Just try. Once you find out what kind of pattern you're rubber duckie has got, then branch out. I remember sitting at home trying to key up some of the local repeaters, sometimes I would hear the tail drop, sometimes I wouldn't. But there were those times where I knew it was my carrier, my transmission that was opening it up. Don't be shy, and at the same time just keep banging on that one you can't seem to hit. When the chatter dies down, when the folks die off. Key your rig, and see, just see if you can open it. Somewhere someone will come back, "Hey KB0XXX, I've got you here but you're not making it, try it again!" Thats the neat thing about what we do, we test the ends of communication, and now you can experimement with it too. They will hear you or they wont. It's what you put together that defines your station. But for now, keep trying to hit the repeaters, and call once in a while on 146.52. Once you've got a feel for 2meter FM, the next great expanse is HF. Oh man. That's cool! My next big step from here would be to get ahold of a 2 meter mag mount antenna, try that out on different surfaces, on your car, on an apartment railing, some sort of large metal plane, test the diffrences, you'll find it blows away the rubber duckie.

Lt Dan | 02-09-2009 08:22 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment The club I will be joining had a beginner class for tech license this Sat past. I went to it to meet and talk to the guys. One man showed up to take the class, the rest of us all had licenses. I took along my rig and manual. One of the guys programed in a couple of the local repeaters for me. He keyed up to see if I was hitting them and it did with the rubber duck. I've got a mag mount for 2M/440 out in my truck. I don't have it on because the door tears up the coax, but if I plan to use it in the truck I can stick it on real quick. What I may try today is getting a ladder out and putting it on the roof. If the cable is long enough. However, I have a plan for a ground plane antenna using a SO-239, a length of 3/4 plastic pipe, some copper wires and some coax to connect it to the rig. I checked my shop and located all the stuff I needed yesterday. That was enough work for one day. My SWR meter should tell me if I built it right. I plan to install at least a 2M/440 mobile in my truck eventually if I can find one at a hamfest reasonable enough. But, before I buy anymore, I'm trying to study for my General license. Would like a multi band for the house or shack, wherever I set up. I'm thinking house for the actual rig as dust and climate control are better handled in the house. The snow and ice are gone now and we are supposed to have warmer temps, so I'll be able to get out without having to worry over falling on the ice.

Lt Dan | 02-28-2009 01:10 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Bump... Took the exam for General today and got a 100% on it, surprised even me. This is an upgrade from Tech which I got the 2nd of this month. Now I'll have to find the money for a rig, maybe sell some gold..., NOT! Probably look for a multi-band HF next. 2 meter has been fun, but it's mostly a local thing, although I sometimes get people through the repeater fifty miles or more away, if they are not mobile.

CajunCoin | 02-28-2009 01:25 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Lt Dan (Post 1599488) Bump... Took the exam for General today and got a 100% on it, surprised even me. This is an upgrade from Tech which I got the 2nd of this month. Now I'll have to find the money for a rig, maybe sell some gold..., NOT! Probably look for a multi-band HF next. 2 meter has been fun, but it's mostly a local thing, although I sometimes get people through the repeater fifty miles or more away, if they are not mobile.
Congradualtions, now we must start up the GIM net on 20 mtrs, ready to assist. You are awesome. and Kiss the Granddaughter, proud pa-paw. 73 to you 88s to the little one.

Lt Dan | 02-28-2009 03:44 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment CajunCoin, Thanks. I had to check back to see when I first read this thread and it was Christmas day. Hard to believe I've already gotten my General ticket. At first I thought I might be getting my tech license by now. They let me try the Extra, but I didn't do very well on that, in fact I didn't even finish because there was so much talking going on with the ones who'd finished their tech exams and stood around getting pictures for the club and yakking with those who had came in just to watch. Well, it's back to the books now - well I'll give myself a couple days to let my brain settle down. 73's guys

Zusn | 02-28-2009 11:55 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Lt Dan (Post 1599700) CajunCoin, Thanks. I had to check back to see when I first read this thread and it was Christmas day. Hard to believe I've already gotten my General ticket. At first I thought I might be getting my tech license by now. They let me try the Extra, but I didn't do very well on that, in fact I didn't even finish because there was so much talking going on with the ones who'd finished their tech exams and stood around getting pictures for the club and yakking with those who had came in just to watch. Well, it's back to the books now - well I'll give myself a couple days to let my brain settle down. 73's guys
I want everyone on this board to know how impressed I am with you Lt. Dan. You went from asking questions about ham radio to getting your technician license and now your general. I don't think you mentioned it in this thread, but you also built your own 2 meter antenna which made your HT able to hit the local repeaters. All of this in 2 months time!! I wish there were more guys like you out there; willing to learn, listening to and acting upon good advice. All of the advice needed to get started in ham radio is in this thread. Myself, Lt Dan and others here are more than happy to help with any questions. CajunCoin, I like the idea of a 20m net. I'm taking my general next month. I don't know when I'll be getting a HF radio. I'm going to start with the PSK31 kit from small wonder labs.

Lt Dan | 03-13-2009 10:38 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment I hope no one thinks I'm beating a dead horse by keeping this thread alive, but I've just got to do it. So BUMP for the sake of life. The day before yesterday (Wed.), I got my hf rig and some other goodies. I bought a dipole antenna and sometime soon I'll get that up so I can dial in the world of ham radio. Working 2 meter is fun, local guys to chat with, new friends, things to learn. As of yet I've only got it on my 2m antenna and have been talking on it already, I gotta get that dipole up. OH!!! The same day I got the radio, I checked on the FCC website and my call had been upgraded to general, so I won't have to use the /ag after my call.

lessoil=+pm | 03-20-2009 08:44 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment well i made the plunge for me & a friend[& my family] & bought 2 older hf rigs. dan i considered the 2m w/ repeater possibilities but since i expect some very bad times in the next few yrs. i wanted capability to at least get info from around the world when the net is down or controlled, etc. & i was concerned 2m would be overloaded in seriously bad times. as well i would possibly need to transmit/communicate at that time. i'm not going the licensing route for now; gardening, looking for land-hopefully, working on relationships, etc. is taking priority. anyway i am looking for advice on setting up my antenna. i think i am going to use the long wire dipole for now[low cost & reception only].Seller printed a couple of very good articles, but i welcome advice & links. i can go in trees[50' high, & 50-70' away & some 150' away] for horizontal & if needed pipe up an unused chimney for vertical[how high is needed?]. i am very concerned about lightning; & guess i need a disconnect outside i can readily reach. i am a newbie to this arena, so i may be totally off on something; hence my request for advice/info/feedback. i have strung some electric fence wire 30' dipole head high & am getting quite a lot already, china, europe, australia this morning, +some ham operators around the country. Thanks.

Lt Dan | 03-21-2009 09:18 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment For listening only the dipole will be a great way to get on and you'll have the benefit of learning how hams talk when on the air. You don't have to get it up all that high either, since you won't be transmitting. On my short wave radio, I just ran some insulated 14 ga stranded wire from the side of my barn out to the top of a fence post and received just fine. It wasn't even a dipole, just a long wire. I have to say, it is not that difficult to get licensed. You don't even have to score high. One ham buddy just got his family involved. They took the tech test and all passed. His future DIL was among them and she passed by one question, skin of her teeth so to speak, but she is a legal ham now. They had of course been around ham some, but they studied for about three weeks in their spare time and passed. Once you get the tech license the general is not that much harder. Some of the tech stuff carries over to the general and some of all of it carries over into the extra class which I'm working on myself. The extra is a lot more involved and some won't try to go that far.

lessoil=+pm | 03-21-2009 11:00 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment dan i may study later for the first level; after planting & a complicated deal on land is either over or finalized. i think i can get up to speed for the 1st level as the electronics- i read about 1/2 of a quick study guide- i am familiar with from a long ago, but need to refresh.i guess the license limits are bands u can use for different licenses, correct? one hf i bought is an old heathkit- tubes & all refurbished 2 yrs. ago. i also got a kenwood 140; no computer chips so in a pinch it/they might be repaired w/o being sent off. i worked around some of the precomputerchip electronics during college & with help put a color/audio display together. i look forward to some of the tinkering & enjoy the wide world broadcast not dependent on the web. thanks re info on antenna. did u just ground the other side of the dipole?

Lt Dan | 03-21-2009 12:13 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment For SWLing no ground was needed, as I just connected the wire directly to the radio. With the rigs you have, I'm in envy of the Heathkit btw, connect the coax to the wire and ground the shield. Real cheap setup for listening. A dipole works differently. Grd the radio, connect the coax to the center of the wire and w/center wire to one side and shield to the other, uses 3 insulators to keep the whole thing working right. Here is a link to how to build. If you're real cheap you can fabricate your one insulators out of short pieces of plastic pumbing pipe of plastic conduit. Tie that up between two trees and run the center down a make shift pole to support it and run it in to the rig and you're good to go. How high you make it off the ground, I would say 8ft would be a good place to start and raise it up until you seem to get the best reception. As a suggestion, you can do the practice exams at www.qrz.com. Also, I suggest bookmarking this thread and really reading it start to finish. I bookmarked it in my favorites so I couldn't loose it in the pile of threads gone by.

lessoil=+pm | 03-21-2009 12:35 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment thanks dan. i won't let this thread get away! gotta scoot.

zoot | 03-21-2009 02:20 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Get the ham license, it is worth the effort to gain important operating techniques. Outlaw operators can accidently shut down important frequencies with spurious emissions by not knowing what they are doing. BTW, you don't need high powered equipment to talk long distances. I used to talk daily from the southern Bahamas to northern New Mexico on a 12v battery operated 5 watt rig into a hand made dipole antenna on my sailboat. If SHTF, long-distance voice or morse code communication will become VERY valuable.

skyvike | 05-04-2009 08:47 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Well, I'd like to thank all you guys for rekindling an interest I've had in amateur radio since I was a kid, when an older kid next door got an HW-16 kit for Christmas and hung a dipole between a couple of trees. Got distracted from it for about 25 years until I was delivering airplanes and needed a small HF rig I could bring along to talk to ATC going over the ocean. Well, of course I I didn't spend $15,000 on an aviation radio. I bought a used IC-706 and it worked fine. (Don't worry. I didn't transmit on any frequencies I wasn't supposed to and I do hold the "restricted" license to use the aviation frequencies). Anyway, I got the bug when I was overseas for a while in '97 and started studying at http://hamtestonline.com which was really cool. Anyway, I got distracted again but was thinking about knocking out the Tech and General when I'm home this summer and LT Dan has inspired me to do just that! I'll keep you posted on my progress. :-)

Golddust | 05-04-2009 08:51 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Glad to hear it.. Great hobby sure you will like it...

Lt Dan | 05-08-2009 07:23 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Glad to see others joining in... Zusn just in the last month upgraded his license to general... he got inspired because of this thread. I for one think that is great and I congratulate him for it. I would say, if a person has time enough to hang out here on GIM they have time enough to study and get their ticket as well. 73 to all Hams and anyone else who want to get theirs.

zyx5432 | 05-08-2009 08:50 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Between reading this thread and one at another board I frequent, it peaked my interest. I ordered the Tech study materials a little over a week ago, have gone through five of the seven chapters thus far and am already signed up to take the Tech exam next Tuesday. I feel pretty good about it. Then it'll be time to shop for my first rig...After which I'll study for the General.

Lt Dan | 05-08-2009 09:00 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by zyx5432 (Post 1713835) Between reading this thread and one at another board I frequent, it peaked my interest. I ordered the Tech study materials a little over a week ago, have gone through five of the seven chapters thus far and am already signed up to take the Tech exam next Tuesday. I feel pretty good about it. Then it'll be time to shop for my first rig...After which I'll study for the General.
xyz!, Good deal and welcome. If you've not done it yet, check out www.qrz.com and take the practice tests. There are other sites that also allow you to take practice exams. I like qrz best myself. Good luck with your test.

Twisted Avatar | 05-08-2009 11:00 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment All the best on the exam!!! T

Zusn | 05-08-2009 12:08 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Lt Dan (Post 1713783) Glad to see others joining in... Zusn just in the last month upgraded his license to general... he got inspired because of this thread. I for one think that is great and I congratulate him for it. I would say, if a person has time enough to hang out here on GIM they have time enough to study and get their ticket as well. 73 to all Hams and anyone else who want to get theirs.
Thanks for the congrats Lt. Dan! It was awesome finally upgrading (after almost 8 years of being a tech) Watching Lt. Dan go from no license to knocking out exam after exam in a short period of time gave me the drive to upgrade. I like to build stuff and I ended up making a few antennas (links earlier in this thread) and I have a few radio kits on order. With the advent of SDR, amateur radio should be very exciting to people who enjoy radio and computers. Check out these kits. More to come I'm sure http://www.genesisradio.com.au/G40/ http://www.softrockradio.org http://www.smallwonderlabs.com zyx5432 and skyvike, enjoy studying and good luck on the exams. Find a local club and start attending their meetings. You will find the ham community to be a friendly and helpful bunch. www.qrz.com is a great resource, but nothing beats meeting the people in your area and putting a face to the callsign. They also enjoy helping each other build and set up anything radio related. Let us know how you both do! -Z

JohnPA | 05-08-2009 10:51 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Congrats to all of you!! I just stumbled across this thread and felt like I found another home. Back in 98 I went from nothing to Extra in 10 months. Because I'm living in a rental home now, I'm off the air except for 2m activity. I'm a CW fan and member of FISTS. The ham community is diverse and very helpful. May you all enjoy your new hobby and skills. JPA

Dave Thomas | 05-09-2009 03:30 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnPA (Post 1714983) I'm off the air except for 2m activity. I'm a CW fan and member of FISTS. The ham community is diverse and very helpful. May you all enjoy your new hobby and skills. JPA
You might know Bill then, he used to frequent 15meters looking for newly minted novices back in the day. His call was KN2X, he always went slow, and always had time for a new guy. Old Navy man, taught me the code. Probably invented FISTS. That and Taroh Yagi. Anyone and I mean ANYONE who got on 15 meter CW knew Taroh. JH1WIX used to always stalk 15 meters too. Looking for that scared teenager! Heh!

lessoil=+pm | 05-09-2009 07:07 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment btw being a tinkerer, & believing we'll be in a mell of a hess eventually re communication here are 2 books i ordered; Voice of the Crystal! Instruments of Amplification http://www.lindsaybks.com/prod/sub/radio.html they especially compliment the older heathkit i bought

Unclad Lad | 05-09-2009 04:33 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Six months this thread was open, and 4 hours ago lessoil posts the same link I was going to! :thumb.aspx: This thread opened with the idea of going without a Ham license to stay below the radar, to avoid confiscation by the authorities. Several people mentioned the perils of unlicensed broadcast. What nobody mentioned is that in times of emergency, Hams aren't below the radar, they ARE the radar! Hams are almost considered to be pre-first responders, as it is almost always reported by radio. Hams have emergency preparation days and drills. Put another way, Hams are like a communications militia, responding in times of crisis with the equipment they have. A government would have to be suicidal to start seizing radios and/or operators, because their own communications would become suspect or garbled; lots of hams are more than hobbyists; they have jobs as dispatchers or have joined the military as radio operators... The other thing about getting a license is that it plunges you into ARRL, which has enough information for several lifetimes. You could learn a lot of it on your own, but testing it would be difficult. The most interesting information (to me) is on how to build your own equipment from surplus and throwaways. There are incredible stories of Hams during the Great Depression who built rigs for less than the equivalent of what is now $25. A trip to the landfill would cost you less.

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lessoil=+pm | 05-09-2009 09:38 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment sorry unclad lad! good minds/links must... don't really know if this is the best place to post this but since i think this thread is excellent i hope it offends none to put this here. from; http://www.survivalblog.com/ Snippets From the SurvivalBlog Archives: Communications and Monitoring Advice "Plunging into the world of two-way radio communications and monitoring can seem daunting for newbie preppers. It is a technical field that has more than its share of jargon and acronyms. I suggest that you team up with someone that is a licensed amateur �ham� operator, and have them walk you through the basics of the frequency bands, radio wave propagation, the various equipment, and the legalities. Yes, there are plenty of legalities. Stay legal! A ham who mentors new hams is called an �Elmer�. You can find an Elmer through your local ham radio cub. They are almost always very willing to help, and quite generous with their time. The radio band designations can be confusing to folks who are newcomers to the short wave listening and amateur radio worlds. One major source of confusion for newbies is hearing hams mentioning things like ��on the 40 meter band, or �I was talking on 2 meters.� So here is a link for a useful band allocation chart from the ARRL that will put the band designations in an easy to grasp graphic format. Getting Started I highly recommend that all SurvivalBlog readers at the very minimum buy themselves a short wave radio and a multi-band police scanner, and become familiar with their use. In a "When The Schumer Hits The Fan" (WTSHTF) situation, hard wire telephone, cellular phone, AM and FM commercial radio, the Internet, and television may be essentially unavailable. Read: Off the air. Most radio and TV stations only have enough fuel to run their backup generators for few days. Ditto for the telephone company Central Offices (COs.) After that, there will be an acute information vacuum. You may find yourself listening to overseas short wave broadcasters for your daily news, and to your police scanner for updates on the local situation--to keep track of the whereabouts of looter gangs. Be sure to buy a CB radio and few walkie talkies so that you can coordinate security with your neighbors. (The CB, FRS, and MURS bands do not require any license in the U.S.) My favorite band for walkie-talkies is the Multi Use Radio Service (MURS) band, since most MURS radios can be programmed to operate in the 2 Meter band, and because they have much better range than FRS radios. But like FRS, they are unregulated in most private use. (No license required!) It is also important to note that the CB channels, FRS channels, and 2 Meter band frequencies will likely be very crowded WTSHTF, particularly in the suburbs, but the less well-known and less populated MURS frequencies will probably be largely available at any given time. Once you've mastered short-range communications and public service band monitoring, the next step is to join your local Amateur Radio Relay League (ARRL) affiliate club and study to get your amateur license. Someday you may be very glad that you did! General Advice on Disaster Communications and Monitoring Your first receiver should probably be a compact portable general coverage AM/FM/Weather Band/CB/Shortwave receiver. There are several brands on the market, most notably Grundig, Sangean, and Sony. I consider the Sony ICF-SW-7600GR receiver among the most durable portable general coverage receivers for the money. It is about the size of a paperback book. I've had one (actually mine is an earlier "pre-G suffix" model) since 1992 and even with very regular use it still works great. In my experience, the secrets to making them last are to buy a couple of spare hand-reel antennas (the most fragile part), show care in putting stress on the headphone jack and power cable connections, and to always carry the radio and accessories in a sturdy well-padded case. (Preferably a waterproof case. I found that a small Pelican brand case with "pluck and chuck" gray foam inserts proved ideal for my needs.) One low cost alternative to buying Pelican cases is to cut closed-cell foam inserts to fit inside a .30 caliber or .50 caliber United States Government Issue (USGI) ammo can. SurvivalBlog reader MurrDoc calls GI ammo cans "The poor man's Pelican Case." These steel cans are very sturdy, inexpensive (under $10 each, at gun shows), and they also provide limited protection from nuclear EMP effects. (They would make near-perfect Faraday cages if you removed the rubber gasket and replaced it with Electromagnetic Interference (EMI) gasket wire mesh, but then of course the can would no longer be waterproof. Sorry, There Ain't No Such Thing as a Free Lunch.) Your first transceivers should probably be a pair of MURS walkie-talkies, such as those sold by MURS Radios.(One of our loyal advertisers.) Next on your list should be a SSB-capable CB radio, such as the time-proven Cobra 148 GTL (BTW, this model is also readily adaptable for "freeband" frequency range modification.) Then, before moving on to sophisticated ham gear, your next purchase should probably be a pair of military surplus field telephones, for coordinating retreat security. Welcome to the world of communications and monitoring. I hope that you find the dozens of articles on these subjects in the SurvivalBlog Archives useful." i am interested in the advice re MURS, & walkie talkies. & how can a no. of households communicate in say a 1/2 mile radius[maybe less/more- if only 200yrds. would phones be best?] rugged terrain link up communications wise. a friend is researching this arena & i believe he said there is some new handhelds in the cordless phone bands that might be the most useful. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/33_centimeters i have seen baby monitors type sets used for some closeby limited communicating, but only where electricity is readily available. thanks.

Iptuous | 05-09-2009 11:31 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment OK..... i'm in. i'm going to learn the ropes and go for my license. I went to the qrz site, and took the sample test cold. i got 80% just on common sense guessing and already knowing EE (they were pretty basic ohm's law type questions...) I still have a lot to learn, though. I guess i'll go down to Fry's tomorrow and pick up a HAM book. I've been suprised to see that it doesn't apparently take a bucket of cash to just get started, and that's good, since i don't have one... The only dumb question i have that hasn't been addressed in the cursory overview that i've given the topic so far is this: When i think of HAM, i think of the guy in the neighborhood with the Xtra Bigass Antenna in his backyard (which i doubt my meddling HOA would even let me put up...). But i see that there are VHF/UHF handheld sets with just the stubby rubber ones, so obviously there is a broad range of options/abilities. I guess i'm asking if you have to have the giant tower in your backyard to do the HF stuff, or has antenna design improved enough that they are more discreet? Or are those just for the reeeeally crazy HAM stuff like bouncing off meteors and things? I assume your physical surroundings has a decent amount to do with it too?

Golddust | 05-10-2009 12:23 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Iptuous (Post 1716148) OK..... i'm in. i'm going to learn the ropes and go for my license. I went to the qrz site, and took the sample test cold. i got 80% just on common sense guessing and already knowing EE (they were pretty basic ohm's law type questions...) I still have a lot to learn, though. I guess i'll go down to Fry's tomorrow and pick up a HAM book. I've been suprised to see that it doesn't apparently take a bucket of cash to just get started, and that's good, since i don't have one... The only dumb question i have that hasn't been addressed in the cursory overview that i've given the topic so far is this: When i think of HAM, i think of the guy in the neighborhood with the Xtra Bigass Antenna in his backyard (which i doubt my meddling HOA would even let me put up...). But i see that there are VHF/UHF handheld sets with just the stubby rubber ones, so obviously there is a broad range of options/abilities. I guess i'm asking if you have to have the giant tower in your backyard to do the HF stuff, or has antenna design improved enough that they are more discreet? Or are those just for the reeeeally crazy HAM stuff like bouncing off meteors and things? I assume your physical surroundings has a decent amount to do with it too?
To get on HF there are more ways to make a hf antenna that works that can be seen or not seen, stealth ways.. Antennas that do not look like an antenna, you can get down right sneaky about it..Know and have known a bunch of hams that have to do it that way to get on the air , to beat HOS. Also think the higher the frequency the less antenna you will need... You need to fly a flag? Vertical antenna that you fly a flag from..antenna flagpole that looks like a flagpole Do you have a attic?small dipoles and loops Do you have trees in you yard? end fire ,loops, dipoles. Very fine wire cannot be seen and can work , I can go on and on about this,,Its fun.. Just think stealth..Alot of hams are doing it right now.. One of my favorit is a full wave loop into a antenna tuner Have a 75 meter full wave loop that i swear by 12 gage wire can load it full legal power and with the tuner can work all the other bands, 160 also if I short the outer conductor with the inner, hi rf in the shack and super narrow band width but it works. and from the street you cannot see it..! Rolling your own antennas is is fun.. and almost anything goes ..think loading up your rain gutters. and the list goes on and on...:biggrin: --... ...-- ... -.-

Lt Dan | 05-11-2009 11:08 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Iptuous (Post 1716148) OK..... i'm in............. I guess i'm asking if you have to have the giant tower in your backyard to do the HF stuff, or has antenna design improved enough that they are more discreet? Or are those just for the reeeeally crazy HAM stuff like bouncing off meteors and things? I assume your physical surroundings has a decent amount to do with it too?
Congratulations on deciding to take the plunge. Being totally new to ham, I'm just getting into the antenna thing. My first radio had the rubber duck that came with it. I was soon aware that I had to do something else to better reach the repeaters in my area, so I built a ground plain antenna using an SO239 and some brazing rod. That antenna has now been retired for a jpole I built out of copper pipe. I like the jpole better as it gives me better reception. But for the fact, I am now using a Yaesu FT-897D in the place of the HT. To get on the HF bands I put up a short dipole, made from some stranded copper wire, three insolaters, ladder wire, a 4:1 balum, some rope and i-hooks, couple of posts as I had no trees to tie off to, and a short peice of coax to connect to the rig. I'm sure you could get a buddipole that you could set in the yard with no attechments to anything and take it down when you're not on the air. There are other options for portable antennas as well. On a different note; a local ham with only a tech ticket has 99 countries to his credit on just what bands he is allowed to work I'm sure if he tried, he could get his general, but he does not lack in his ability to communcate with just that. He is highly respected by all the local hams for what he has achieved. Kind of an old guy in his 70's or 80's, I'm not sure, but the tech license is all he needs for what he does.

Iptuous | 05-11-2009 11:18 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment thanks. i got on the pirate bay and downloaded 'Ham Radio for Dummies' and some antenna book that i haven't opened yet. I also got the wife's encouragement, which is valuable. now i just have to get my dad on the bandwagon, since his land is where i would bug out to if there was ever a zombie infestation... As far as the antenna, i am on a hill that has the highest elevation in the metroplex area, so that's good, i guess. there's also a collection of giant commercial antenna towers near to where i live. i wonder if they have repeaters on them? I'm guessing they might.... I'm hoping to go to this months meeting at the closest HAM club (like 5 minutes from my house).... fun, fun, fun!

Zusn | 05-11-2009 01:24 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Iptuous (Post 1717696) thanks. i got on the pirate bay and downloaded 'Ham Radio for Dummies' and some antenna book that i haven't opened yet. I also got the wife's encouragement, which is valuable. now i just have to get my dad on the bandwagon, since his land is where i would bug out to if there was ever a zombie infestation... As far as the antenna, i am on a hill that has the highest elevation in the metroplex area, so that's good, i guess. there's also a collection of giant commercial antenna towers near to where i live. i wonder if they have repeaters on them? I'm guessing they might.... I'm hoping to go to this months meeting at the closest HAM club (like 5 minutes from my house).... fun, fun, fun!
Yes, most likely there are repeaters set up on or near those commercial towers. Go to the local club meeting, you will have any and every question answered for you. Find out when the next test date is so you have a goal to work towards. Learn everything you can about antennas. A good antenna is way better to have than a good radio. Building your own antenna is also very rewarding. Good luck with your new adventure.

Twisted Avatar | 05-11-2009 01:31 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Zusn (Post 1717881) Yes, most likely there are repeaters set up on or near those commercial towers. Go to the local club meeting, you will have any and every question answered for you. Find out when the next test date is so you have a goal to work towards. Learn everything you can about antennas. A good antenna is way better to have than a good radio. Building your own antenna is also very rewarding. Good luck with your new adventure.
Wow I never knew that but the more I think about it ......that makes perfect sense.. Good share :ok:

Dave | 05-12-2009 09:39 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment I am planning on taking a look in to this as well... Fortunately for me, I have access to a 450' Tower to mount an antenna in Florida. My business has a Datacenter on the 29' floor of this building so I will have readily available bandwidth which I could potentially deploy over packet radio. If there are any HAMs local to the Northeast Florida area I will let you know when I do this. My question to those who are experienced in packet radio is how long of a reach and how much throughput could I realistically get with a modest investment in equipment on a 450' elevation? Remember, Florida doesn't have much terrain. Dave

Golddust | 05-12-2009 10:31 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave (Post 1719158) I am planning on taking a look in to this as well... Fortunately for me, I have access to a 450' Tower to mount an antenna in Florida. My business has a Datacenter on the 29' floor of this building so I will have readily available bandwidth which I could potentially deploy over packet radio. If there are any HAMs local to the Northeast Florida area I will let you know when I do this. My question to those who are experienced in packet radio is how long of a reach and how much throughput could I realistically get with a modest investment in equipment on a 450' elevation? Remember, Florida doesn't have much terrain. Dave
Hi VHF and UHF you need to think line of sight Most of the time, farther when band conditions open up. I have used water towers and buildings as reflectors to pick up signals that are not in the line of sight for my radio. Have to use a directional antenna to do it, and the more gain the antenna has the better. But line of sight is a good rule of thumb. Packet speed depends on the band plan, for the band you are using. The higher the frequency the more band width you have to work with. Throughput depends of the signal quality at the receiver end and as you know, and the speed you are using. The ranges will be better than what this link will give but it is a good start. VHF/UHF Line of Sight Calculator Hope this helps.

Zusn | 05-12-2009 07:53 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave (Post 1719158) I am planning on taking a look in to this as well... Fortunately for me, I have access to a 450' Tower to mount an antenna in Florida. My business has a Datacenter on the 29' floor of this building so I will have readily available bandwidth which I could potentially deploy over packet radio. If there are any HAMs local to the Northeast Florida area I will let you know when I do this. My question to those who are experienced in packet radio is how long of a reach and how much throughput could I realistically get with a modest investment in equipment on a 450' elevation? Remember, Florida doesn't have much terrain. Dave
450' tower would be awesome to have!! On 70cm, you can run as fast as 56k. On 2m, 19.6k. Theoretically I guess one could go faster, but then you'd be exceeding the bandwidth limitations for that particular band. If high speed is real important, then consider using the GHz frequencies. 1.2 (I think) and 10GHz is relatively common. At 450' high, distance shouldn't be too much of a factor!

zyx5432 | 05-13-2009 09:46 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Update - took my Tech license exam last night and scored 100%. Now I'll have to wait a week or so for my call sign. Going to start studying for the General next. Ordered a Yaesu VX-6R HT and a Yaesu FT-8800R for the truck. I'll do the home gear after I pass the General so I can get into more bands...

Twisted Avatar | 05-13-2009 09:57 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment 1 Attachment(s) Quote:
Originally Posted by zyx5432 (Post 1720780) Update - took my Tech license exam last night and scored 100%. Now I'll have to wait a week or so for my call sign. Going to start studying for the General next.
...................

Iptuous | 05-13-2009 10:30 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by zyx5432 (Post 1720780) Update - took my Tech license exam last night and scored 100%. Now I'll have to wait a week or so for my call sign. Going to start studying for the General next. Ordered a Yaesu VX-6R HT and a Yaesu FT-8800R for the truck. I'll do the home gear after I pass the General so I can get into more bands...
zyx, what were your selection criteria for the handheld? i'm sure i'll get more insight when i go to the HAM club meeting this next week, but i'm curious to know how you arrived at that choice...

Zusn | 05-13-2009 11:56 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by zyx5432 (Post 1720780) Update - took my Tech license exam last night and scored 100%. Now I'll have to wait a week or so for my call sign. Going to start studying for the General next. Ordered a Yaesu VX-6R HT and a Yaesu FT-8800R for the truck. I'll do the home gear after I pass the General so I can get into more bands...
Awesome job!!! Enjoy the amateur community

Lt Dan | 05-13-2009 12:21 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by zyx5432 (Post 1720780) Update - took my Tech license exam last night and scored 100%. Now I'll have to wait a week or so for my call sign. Going to start studying for the General next. Ordered a Yaesu VX-6R HT and a Yaesu FT-8800R for the truck. I'll do the home gear after I pass the General so I can get into more bands...
Great job, Congratulations, you beat my score on the tech, I missed one and went back in the same month and got my general, aced it. I was going to keep on studying for the extra and still plan to, but probably not until in the winter. Too much going on now with outdoor work, also I've been getting my station up. I mostly keep my rig tuned to a local repeater, listening in and talking to local hams. I have been tuning in late at night to the hf bands. Good choices for radios. I bought the Yaesu VX-170 HT and a Yaesu FT-897D for a base. I still need to get a good mobile for travel.

JohnPA | 05-13-2009 12:47 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment As for mobile FM comms: I've used the same Kenwood dual-banders in 2 of my vehicles for over 10 years now. Not a single problem encountered. JPA

zyx5432 | 05-13-2009 01:57 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment I chose the VX-6R really based on some recommendations from others (on another site I frequent). Nothing but good reviews. While there are other radios that may have more bands, the 2m/70cm bands plus battery life and customer service of Yaesu ranked it above many others. We'll see how she works!

lessoil=+pm | 05-13-2009 02:05 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment congrats zyx5432!

Golddust | 05-13-2009 08:22 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by zyx5432 (Post 1721094) I chose the VX-6R really based on some recommendations from others (on another site I frequent). Nothing but good reviews. While there are other radios that may have more bands, the 2m/70cm bands plus battery life and customer service of Yaesu ranked it above many others. We'll see how she works!
Have a VX-7R and think it is the best ht. I have had ever. Yaesu makes some good radios.. Get the download cable, there is software on the net that you can program it with.. look for VX-7 Commander. It is a good program.. Better than the programmer that comes with the cable.

Iptuous | 05-13-2009 09:22 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment I have read conflicting advice on the web about getting a first radio. some sites said that your first should be a HT (and any good ham will tell you the same), and some sites said that your first should be a base rig (and any good ham will tell you the same). what are you guys opinions, and why? -note: budget is and issue with me, since i currently have the boss' support in this matter, but if i blow $1500 right off the bat, that may change....

Lt Dan | 05-13-2009 11:51 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment The VX-7R would be a very good first radio. 2 meter is where it's at for local hams in my area, thus the VX-170 was all I needed to get me started. With that and some accessories, I got by for a while and more or less learned some of the common usuage things I needed to take it beyond. Even on my base rig, I listen in on 2 meter the most. Of corse, sooner or later you'll want to DX, even if it is only a couple states over, then way beyond. One thing for sure, the XYL will like the fact you are spending time around the shack - kind of she knows where you are. So far mine has not resisted me with my efforts or what I've spent, in fact she has encouraged me. It has so far been easier on my budget than some of the other hobbies I've been involved in. To protect your budget, buy the HT first, learn what works, what other hams are using and take it from there. That's my opinion but I'm just speaking from my own limited experience.

Iptuous | 05-16-2009 10:13 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment well, ill be going for my tech ticket on tuesday! then i have to blow some FRNs on a HT....

Iptuous | 05-19-2009 09:57 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Took my tech class test, and passed with one miss. (i was kinda annoyed that they don't let you see what question you missed) so now there's a HamCom coming up soon that all the manufacturers come and show off their goods, and distributors that hawk them..... See you on the air!

Zusn | 05-20-2009 04:32 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Iptuous (Post 1729632) Took my tech class test, and passed with one miss. (i was kinda annoyed that they don't let you see what question you missed) so now there's a HamCom coming up soon that all the manufacturers come and show off their goods, and distributors that hawk them..... See you on the air!
Awesome job! Welcome to the club. Enjoy the airwaves.

Lt Dan | 05-20-2009 06:16 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Iptuous (Post 1729632) Took my tech class test, and passed with one miss. (i was kinda annoyed that they don't let you see what question you missed) so now there's a HamCom coming up soon that all the manufacturers come and show off their goods, and distributors that hawk them..... See you on the air!
Great job!!! I missed one on my tech exam too and I think it depends on who gives the exam as to rather they will show you which ones you miss. When i took my general they even let me watch them grade it while at the tech License (different location) they didn't nor did they show me which one I missed. Has anyone been keeping track of how many of us have gotten our license and or upgraded since this thread was started?

striped_bear | 05-21-2009 06:35 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment I just want to say thanks for this great thread. I have been interested in radio since I was a kid. I used to stay up late at night and scan through the AM band on my little stereo to see what kinds of strange stations I could pick up (that was the first time I ever happened across Coast to Coast AM :biggrin:, coming in from the US somewhere). My grandfather has a shortwave radio and whenever I am visiting I'll turn it on late at night and go through the frequencies one by one looking for stuff. Usually I just find strange sounds, but it has always fascinated me. Never found anything really interesting, though when I was younger my friend set up a short wave with a decent antenna and we used to listen to truckers on their CB radios. I've been considering getting more into radio and eventually getting my ham license and some proper gear. This thread seals it! My study of radio has been set in motion at last. I've decided to start by learning about electricity as I'm currently designing a house and want to understand it. I think what I'll do first is get a decent shortwave radio and learn some antenna theory so I can make a wire antenna and start listening. I'm excited to actually learn what the different bands are used for and to actually start finding some interesting stuff to listen to. If anyone could provide suggestions on what type of short wave radio would be best to look into for listening I would really appreciate it. I'm going to go do some research on my own of course but thought I'd ask here, as I'm a complete newb. Thanks all, sb PS congrats Lt Dan on getting your license!

lessoil=+pm | 05-21-2009 10:39 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment i figure u know this but be sure to get a radio with an external antenna input jack. i don't know much otherwise to recommend but think playing around with antennas will suit u'r purposes; & i got one i'd have to go inside to do this.

teacher | 05-25-2009 06:38 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment I'm just getting back from a trip to Dayton, Ohio, and the annual Hamvention. This event has been ongoing since the early 60's and sponsored by a local club, along with the ARRL. There must have been a thousand booths set up in the arena and several thousand outside for the flea market. Based on the ticket numbers I saw there were more than 20,000 people attending. I met a 160-meter group from Colorado at the hotel and made a bunch of new friends. Meanwhile, I'm making plans now to attend next year as a forum speaker regarding Tesla Coils. 73s

DMac00 | 05-27-2009 01:00 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment DHS emergency radio frequencies PDF WARNING http://turnerradionetwork.com/DHS-Ra...tions-Info.pdf

Glass | 05-27-2009 07:39 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment congrats to everyone who has scored their license. I've had mine for a year. I like the Yaesu radios, lots of features in some interestingly different platforms. Dual banders, tri banders and quads. Their handhelds are very nice. 2m is the same here in Oz. Lots of repeaters on this band so you can get away with 5w handheld quite easily. I have a 2m and a 70cm handheld. The 70cm band is a bit quiet and I really picked it up because I thought I might be able to open it up to UHF CB frequencies but it's beyond my abilities atm. I have 5 UHF cb radios, 2 amateur bands and 2 27mhz radios..... a couple of ones I grew up with. Still buying more and also building a few antennas which is a bit of fun.

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zyx5432 | 06-09-2009 09:13 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by zyx5432 (Post 1720780) Update - took my Tech license exam last night and scored 100%. Now I'll have to wait a week or so for my call sign. Going to start studying for the General next. Ordered a Yaesu VX-6R HT and a Yaesu FT-8800R for the truck. I'll do the home gear after I pass the General so I can get into more bands...
ok, so last month I studied for an took the Tech exam. I just finished studying and passing the General exam tonight (after cramming the study materials in a week - last three chapters on a flight home today). Next month - world domination! Oh wait, someone else is already working on that...

Iptuous | 06-09-2009 09:20 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment congrats! . .

Twisted Avatar | 06-10-2009 07:14 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment 1 Attachment(s) Quote:
Originally Posted by zyx5432 (Post 1762168) ok, so last month I studied for an took the Tech exam. I just finished studying and passing the General exam tonight (after cramming the study materials in a week - last three chapters on a flight home today). Next month - world domination! Oh wait, someone else is already working on that...
Yep........ the Mice Got ya beat.:biggrin::biggrin::biggrin: Congrats!!!

teacher | 06-10-2009 09:45 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by zyx5432 (Post 1762168) I just finished studying and passing the General exam tonight
Well done!

Lt Dan | 06-13-2009 06:53 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Good job and congratulations, zyx5432. :36_1_32v: I have not been checking the forum for a few days, but have been doing some radio listening and talking. I'm sure you will actually become a new person once you get into ham. I know I did. To bad we couldn't set up a GIM net meet for all Hams to discuss the price of au/ag or anything else. I'm afraid my antenna and output power are not up to working dx (yet). Working on it.

Awoke | 06-22-2009 08:58 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Bump for excellent content.

Twisted Avatar | 06-22-2009 10:25 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Follow up to OP Going the Extra Mile in Amateur Communications, by Extraman I really enjoyed reading the great novel "Patriots". In reading it, I picked up lots of good tips along the way. But I felt it really had very little contemporary information about communications, other than the chapter "Radio Ranch" which finally touched on an individual with a serious interest in radio communications. The use of Single Sideband (SSB), Citizens Band (CB) 27 Mhz radios, along with slightly modified "old" style low cost hand held "cheapo" radios really leaves a lot to be desired regarding how it could be done, on a fairly low budget. It is my sincere belief that anyone even remotely interested in being prepared for what may come should obtain a Federal Communications Commission (FCC) Amateur, or "ham" radio license. While years ago, It was difficult to learn Morse code and pass the written exam for such a license, the code requirement has now been totally eliminated from all classes of amateur radio licenses. These days, several companies sell printed books that contain the entire question pool (along with the answers) that will be on the written exams. Simply "highlighting" the correct answer to each question only, And then reading the question along with the highlighted Correct answer (only) After a few short weeks of about 10 minutes per day of such reading will easily allow most anyone to pass the written exam. Sample test runs are available online, free of charge. The "Technician" class test is very easy to pass, which allows unrestricted operations on VHF and UHF). But I suggest spending the extra effort to get the "General" class license which also permits HF (High Frequency) world-wide communications. For general background on licensing see this site, and this one. The main "bands", or [ranges of] frequencies that can be used by a ham operator range all the way from 160 meters (1.8 MHz) Up through 1.2 GHz and above. For more information about ham radio operation, A simple Google search will bring lots of results and information about this neat hobby, That could very well turn out to be a life saver in times of disaster. (In fact, Amateur radio does provide the main links in and out of disaster areas when normal modes like cell phones fail. This is proven time and time again. Most every large hurricane in the U.S. finds ham operators being the only means of communications in and out of the hard hit areas until normal services are restored.) Once a person has talked halfway around the world with nothing but a radio, A piece of wire strung in the trees for an antenna, and a 12 volt car battery, with no infrastructure. (Like the commercial cellular or land line phone, Internet, etc systems that WILL fail at the worst possible time.) They will be "hooked" on the newfound ability to communicate without any outside help whatsoever (The commercial cellular and land line telephone systems fail during times of disaster as much because of simple "overload" (everyone trying to call someone at the same time) as the do because of infrastructure failure. Many modern-day amateur radios are now designed to receive not only the "ham" band frequencies, But a wide range of other frequencies. So a VHF/UHF mobile type radio is also capable of receiving the AM aircraft band, FM Police, Fire, Ambulance, Business bands, Marine band, Including the NOAA "Weather" channels, etc etc. (But they may not decode some "big city" police trunked, and or encrypted communications) The lower frequency ham grade radios (HF) will also receive most everything from the AM broadcast band right up through VHF low band radio. This includes the international short wave broadcast stations like BBC (British Broadcasting Corp.), etc. What many do not know is that with the simple "snip" of a diode or resistor inside these radios, They can be made to also transmit over that very wide frequency range! (This is the so-called MARS Military Affiliate Radio System (MARS) or Civil Air Patrol (CAP) modifications, and is public knowledge all over the Internet. It is not illegal to thus modify these radios. It is illegal to use them to transmit outside of the ham bands unless you hold a valid MARS license, and then only on authorized frequencies for that use. (I have used old dental "pick" type tools to do this modification. (BTW, when you go to a dentist, ask for old used dental tools, Usually they are happy to give them to you.) to remove the [transmission mode blocking] resistor or diode mentioned. (The online sites will provide nice photos, I suggest a very bright light and a big magnifying lens. However, in a life-threatening emergency, FCC rules provide that pretty much "anything" goes........ So even though your radio that can now also operate on the 27Mhz CB band, it would not be legal to use it for that under normal circumstances, unless a genuine emergency exists. There are a few radios that I have owned and experimented with and can confirm such operations. One of the very best mobile radios available is a Yaesu FT 8800 "dual band" VHF/UHF. This radio, After the simple snip of the diode can transmit all over the VHF and UHF band. This includes the business band portion (Which also includes such services as MURS (Multi Use Radio System), a license-free system on VHF FM, the General Mobile Radio Service (GMRS),and Family Radio Service (FRS). It is really neat to have but one radio that can do all these things, Even though you cannot legally transmit on those other frequencies under normal circumstances. The Yaesu FT 8800 radio will also "Cross Band" repeat, Right out of the box with no modifications. This means a person can set up two channels and talk through the radio from a small low power hand held radio, At the full power of the mobile radio. (Cross band repeat means to talk to the radio on one band, VHF for example, and the radio will automatically retransmit your signal on another band, For instance UHF, and vice-versa) Speaking of hand held radios, My current favorite is the little micro size Yaesu VX 3. A tiny radio that can receive a very wide range of services, including commercial AM and FM broadcast. The simple snip of one little diode allows it to transmit on the GMRS band, Marine band, etc. A major advantage to the little micro size VX 3 is that it uses very common digital camera batteries that are available everywhere for a very low cost. (less than 5 bucks each for a nice Lithium ion battery including shipping!) For a few dollars more, The Yaesu FT 60 has the full 5 watt power of larger hand held radios, Along with the full touch tone pad, (But is slightly harder to "snip" that diode..... The radio needs to be taken apart to get at it....) Other good hand held radios include the Yaesu VX 7, VX 8, And the Icom T 90. These are all proven workhorse radios that will do the job. For a base station type HF radio, The very best "Do it All" radio is the Kenwood TS 2000. The TS 2000 covers 160 meters through 440Mhz UHF, And even goes up to 1.2Ghz with an optional module. The same simple modification will allow the TS 2000 to operate all over, and the TS 2000 can "Cross Band Repeat" from not only VHF to UHF, But from HF to UHF! This means a person can monitor (And or also talk back) on HF through the TS 2000 from out in the field with the small hand held radio! Really neat to not being "stuck" indoors in front of the radio. You can be out in the garden monitoring your HF (or VHF) frequencies from the tall base station antennas, With nothing but the little shirt pocket size hand held radio! The TS 2000 is selling brand new right now for under $1,500.00 if you shop around. (Yes, Such radios after the aforementioned snip of the diode ARE capable of talking on 27Mhz CB etc in the event of a true disaster) If a "better" quality HF radio is desired, Check out the Icom 756PRO series (PRO II, PRO III) The original PRO sells good used for $900 and up. These are high quality radios with a wide range "spectrum scope" that shows other signals on the band. But the Icom 756PRO series is HF only, no VHF/UHF, and it cannot crossband repeat. There are lots of other radios that can operate on a wide range of frequencies, And have certain advantages (Along with disadvantages) For example, the Icom 706 series will do HF through UHF, And is a small light radio very capable of mobile operation. (The Icom 706 series is also a proven good radio). However, such radios cannot dual receive like the TS 2000 (Ability to monitor two frequencies at the same time, or cross band repeat) There are many others, such as the Yaesu FT 857, et cetera.. They all mostly operate from "menu" driven operation. (Not nearly as easy to operate for old timers like myself as a radio with more "knobs and buttons" Maybe younger computer types would enjoy them more.) It is possible to operate on both the ham bands and your business band with one radio and not violate the law on a daily basis, but t needs to be done the "other way around" . You could take a commercial radio certified for the business band in question and simply program in the ham frequencies you want. This is 100% legal to do and operate on a daily basis. The drawbacks are that commercial radios are single band only. So if you wanted to have one on the two meter ham band and your VHF business band, And you also wanted to operate on UHF, then would need to have a second radio. (All of these base or mobile radios operate from 12 volts DC (or 13.6 VDC) So will work fine from your solar panel battery bank) Speaking of which, I have been running all of my radios for many years now on just a single 12 volt "Marine" Deep Cycle type battery, Kept on a fully automatic 10 amp charger connected to commercial power--- In the event of a widespread and long term "power grid failure" that same battery can be kept charged with a solar panel. (I have several panels and have experimented with them, They do work well, But I have not resolved the overcharge regulation problem yet. (I have not yet spent the money for a commercial grade voltage regulator ["charge controller"] that will work with solar panels. Quality ones are expensive. Of course wind generators and other means of producing 12 volt power will work as well. I suggest LED (Light Emitting Diodes) If electric light is desired, for their very low current consumption, to save precious battery power. All radios need an antenna to be effective. All that is really needed to operate on the HF bands is some wire and some simple plans to cut dipole antennas. Stock up on electric fence wire and insulators from your local farm supply store for cheap antennas for the low HF bands! Although copper wire will work better than galvanized steel or aluminum fence wire, it costs lots more. And the cheap stuff will do the job. For VHF and UHF radio operations, It is also possible to build your own antenna from scratch, But in most cases it is lots easier to just buy a decent VHF/UHF dual band antenna along with some good quality coax feed line cable. (For VHF/UHF, Keep the coax length as short as possible. TIMES LMR 400 is the coax of choice by the professionals for shorter runs of less than 70 or so feet) For those on a real budget, It is possible to ask for "spool ends" of cable television "drop wire" from your local friendly cable TV guy. (Offer him a bag of donuts.). Even though that coax is 75 ohm and not the 50 ohm suggested for ham use, In most all cases it will work just fine, especially when you consider the very low cost! (On the lower HF frequencies, Coax cable "loss" is not really a [significant] factor or problem. Most any skinny cheap coax should work just fine. But as you move higher in frequency, coax feed line loss becomes critical- Use only short lengths of the very best at VHF and UHF.) All antennas should be installed as high as possible. Which of course kind of makes them a lightning target. There is an article in the May 2009 issue of Popular Communications magazine on how to protect from lightning on a low budget. You may have read or heard about the threat of EMP (Electromagnetic Pulse) from a nuclear event. This is a real threat. However, not nearly as much of a threat to most of us that many would have you believe. If your radio station is well protected from lightning, and you are more than a few hundred miles away from the nuclear event, unless that is a special high intensity EMP device then you should have no problems. (EMP acts like lightning, with a faster rise time). I plan to address EMP and lightning more fully in a future article. Like owning a firearm and lots of other things, It is not enough to just buy the above mentioned radios and equipment and leave them in a box. It is important to use them on a day to day basis to really learn how they operate, And all that they are capable of. Amateur radio is a fun hobby, and it provides you with some real communications when the other services fail. Get yourself a license and enjoy it today! Besides the advantages of being able to talk with friends, neighbors, your [preparedness] "group" if you have one, And other "ham" operators, Just think of the ability to also be able to talk to others on the marine band, Business bands, GMRS, etc with the same radio if TSHTF! In addition to ham radio, I suggest getting a number of GMRS small hand held radios (UHF FM) for all unlicensed family members and friends and neighbors. I got a number of "store return" Motorola 9500 series GMRS hand held radios on Ebay for just over $20 per pair, complete with drop-in chargers! Do monitor the channels in your neighborhood and choose a channel with little activity, And then also change the "privacy code" (Which is actually a subaudible tone) to something other than what they came programmed for to further make your system a little more private. While I would never consider any of the GMRS frequencies of much value for "tactical" use, These little radios do work very well, And can provide good communications and teach youngsters (And oldsters alike) the ins and outs of radio communications on a very low budget.

Twisted Avatar | 06-22-2009 10:27 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Letter Re: Cuban Spy Ring Arrests Raises Concern of Ham Radio Restrictions Jim: This article concerns me: Cuban spies' shortwave radios go undetected: Low-tech transmissions no big deal for U.S. intelligence. The journalist mentions: "The International Amateur Radio Union said there are more than 700,000 amateur radio operators in the United States." I hope the governmental paranoia does not try to constrain the best method of rural emergency communications. - KAF JWR Replies: Without mentioning anything classified, I can safely say that they are describing clandestine operatives in in the US. receiving the old-fashioned HF "Numbers" broadcasts from Cuba. These are typically code groups of five numbers, read aloud by a woman, in a monotone, such as : "Ocho, Cinco, Cinco, Uno, Nueve..." These codes are very hard to break without a huge sample for brute force computer cryptanalysis. This modus operandi has been used for 40+ years, and is well-known to both amateur operators and the signals intelligence (SIGINT) community. To the best of my knowledge, receivers are a non-issue vis-a-vis regulating amateur radio equipment. But clandestine transmitters may be another matter. Given our fluid borders and the ubiquitous "diplomatic pouch" it is absurd to think that regulation on the possession of HF radio transmitters would have any meaningful at stopping clandestine traffic. Licensed radio amateurs are largely self-policing. They fairly quickly identify and locate unlicensed broadcasts in their their vicinity. The Cuban DGI is an odd anachronism. While most intelligence agencies have leapfrogged their communications to exotic methods such as steganography to imbed messages in in photos sent as .gifs via the Internet and using low-power spread spectrum transmissions, the DGI's modus operandi is at least 30 years out of date. It is somewhat analogous to Cubans still driving around cars that were manufactured in the 1950s. The last I heard, the DGI still had offices that primarily used typewriters made in the former Yugoslavia. Picturing that, you can practically smell the Cuban tobacco smoke.

Unclad Lad | 06-24-2009 12:50 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment There are many things I worry about. Cuban spies is not one of them.

Iptuous | 06-27-2009 11:13 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Got my VX-7R in today! WOOT! have to fully charge battery before i get to play with it.... BOOOO.... fun tomorrow though...

Golddust | 06-27-2009 11:49 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Iptuous (Post 1790023) Got my VX-7R in today! WOOT! have to fully charge battery before i get to play with it.... BOOOO.... fun tomorrow though...
Look into a spare battery and the quick charger.. You will not regret it... Also a adapter bnc to sma so you can run other kinds of antennas..

Iptuous | 06-28-2009 12:42 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment ayeah..... didn't take as long as i was expecting to charge the batteries.... playing now.... antennae come shortly. have access to milspec wire at my work, so i should be able to get a spool end of decent length of good teflon coated stuff....

Awoke | 06-29-2009 10:39 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment How is it working out, Iptuous???

Awoke | 06-29-2009 12:29 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Pretty cool. I'm at work and taking a lunch break, and casually talking with some of the guys. A few of them are conspiracy researchers. Anyways, I mention that I'm interested in getting into HAM radio and low-and-behold, my co-worker is licenced! Not only that, but he has a lot of experience and gear. He has an advance licence which allows him to build radios. We're hopefully going to get together and I will try to learn from a pro!

Iptuous | 06-29-2009 12:36 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment sweet... i know there's at least one guy at my work that is a ham, cause he's got the callsign plates. i looked it up, and i don't know him, though. it'd be nice to have an elmer that you see every day... I'm having fun with mine, but i don't have a good antenna yet.... gotta get a mag mount for the car, and rig up something for the house....

Awoke | 06-29-2009 01:02 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment You have a specific website that you would recommend for Antennas? (Beside the obvious Google search)

Zusn | 06-30-2009 03:04 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Awoke (Post 1792178) You have a specific website that you would recommend for Antennas? (Beside the obvious Google search)
http://www.eham.net/forums/TowerTalk http://forums.qrz.com/forumdisplay.php?f=33

Rockbrother | 07-10-2009 04:18 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Very good thread, Here are the two websites that I like to go to http://www.globaltuners.com/ http://www.3819khz.net/listen.htm congrats to all of you who have passed the tests Peace :15_1_70v:

Twisted Avatar | 12-03-2009 11:36 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Worth a revist ........ T

IGrok | 12-03-2009 01:28 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment CQ CQ CQ CQ Twisted, over

Golddust | 12-03-2009 01:47 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Twisted Avatar (Post 2057534) Worth a revist ........ T
-.-. .- -. -.-- --- ..- .... . .- .-. -- . -. --- .-- ..--.. :biggrin: -.. . -.- . ..... -. -- .-.-. :yes:

FunnyMoney | 12-04-2009 01:25 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Uhm, ok. So, what's the GIM strategy again? :fan:

Twisted Avatar | 12-04-2009 09:42 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Golddust (Post 2057725) -.-. .- -. -.-- --- ..- .... . .- .-. -- . -. --- .-- ..--.. :biggrin: -.. . -.- . ..... -. -- .-.-. :yes:
I have no idea Just a simple laddie :bull-smile:

Golddust | 12-04-2009 09:53 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment :biggrin: Quote:
Originally Posted by Twisted Avatar (Post 2059300) I have no idea Just a simple laddie :bull-smile:
Morse code.. ( . = dit ) (- = dash) :coolbeer: Edit: Those that know it, can leave short messages in plain sight , not even using a radio and 99.9999999% of people will not have a clue what they are seeing if they look at it. (bet a bunch on this thread fit):biggrin:

Iptuous | 12-04-2009 10:16 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Golddust (Post 2057725) -.-. .- -. -.-- --- ..- .... . .- .-. -- . -. --- .-- ..--.. :biggrin: -.. . -.- . ..... -. -- .-.-. :yes:
..- / .-. / .- .-.. -- --- ... - / .- -. / --- -.- .. . :moon:

CajunCoin | 12-04-2009 10:21 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment ..-. -.. --- -- --..-- ..- .-. ..... ----. .. -. .-.. --- ..- ... .. .- -. .- --..-- --... ...--- .. . -. ..... .--. --.. .--- .-.-.

Golddust | 12-04-2009 10:30 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Iptuous (Post 2059369) ..- / .-. / .- .-.. -- --- ... - / .- -. / --- -.- .. . :moon:
.... .- -.--/ .. / .- .-.. -- --- ... - / .-. . ... . -- -. .-.. . / - .... .- - / .-. . -- .- .-. -.- :tongue_ma::tongue_ma:

Golddust | 12-04-2009 11:06 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by CajunCoin (Post 2059380) ..-. -.. --- -- --..-- ..- .-. ..... ----. .. -. .-.. --- ..- ... .. .- -. .- --..-- --... ...--- .. . -. ..... .--. --.. .--- .-.-.
-. .. -.-. . - --- -- . .- - -.-- --- ..- -- .- .-. - . -. - .... .. -. -.- .-- . .- .-. . -.. .- . .. ...- . .. -. --. - .... . -- -. ..- - ... -.-- . - ..--..

wallew | 12-06-2009 05:20 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment I can't believe I missed this thread. I seem to have paralleled Iptous. Got my Tech back in May/June. My first (currently only) radio is a new VX/7R that I purchased new from the local Ham Radio Outlet. I did that in case I had any problems. I'm glad I did, because after almost two weeks, I couldn't get anything. I dropped by and THEY messed with it for almost thirty minutes and then both guys declared it was DOA and asked which color I wanted. I HAD a black cased one. So I thought I would try switching colors and change my luck. Plus one of the guys there programmed in the closest (busy) repeater for me as well. I've used the radio as comm for the Veterans Day parade that our club participates in every year. My Elmer ran the front of the convoy while I ran tail end charlie on the convoy of about 15 trucks. We are still working out which freq we are going to use. Love the radio. Still working on figuring it all out and listening to a couple of the local repeaters. I WILL eventually go for the General license next year. But for now, I'm trying to decide on the next couple of radios. I'll probably buy a second VX/7R as a spare. Also considering the FX8800. We'll see. Oh. I also swapped out the rubber ducky antenna for a black colored Diamond antenna made for the VX/7R and it made a HUGE difference in reception. That, along with a speaker microphone (MH-57A4B by Vertex Standard) and an antenna with a magnetic base (C*MET antenna M-24 SMA) also made for the VX/7R have made this radio come alive. Iptous, did you get a spare battery pack? I bought one and I'll be using the LiIon AA batteries (185000 listed earlier in this thread). It is made by Yaesu, PN is FBA-23 and holds two AA batteries. I also have the cigarette lighter power adapter as well, though I haven't used EITHER of these two power connections yet. Again, time and money. I concur that bad times are coming. Having ANY comm is better than having NO comm. I've got a couple of old Cobra SSB CB radios as well. If you have a group, pick your freqs carefully. Having secondary/tiertiary choices is a great idea. Set up some kind of 'on any given day between the hours of noon and one PM we WILL be monitoring 146.146' or some other such idea. DO that kind of set up IN advance. time is short. hopefully so is your list of things left to do. I still can't believe I missed this thread the first time. :cooler:

Unclad Lad | 12-06-2009 05:42 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Just make sure none of you repeat any code. I'd hate for any of you to be remorseful.

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Determined2Au | 12-06-2009 06:24 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Unclad Lad (Post 2062850) Just make sure none of you repeat any code. I'd hate for any of you to be remorseful.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cwoq8q8rFoA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cwoq8q8rFoA

Awoke | 12-06-2009 08:13 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment I picked up a Kenwood R-600 for 75 dollars, and it is in pristine condition. Ebay usually has them for up to 3 or 4 hundred dollars! It was a good score, but I haven't used it yet due to a lack of antenna and a lack of time. It's a receiver only, for listening, not transmitting.

Golddust | 12-06-2009 11:19 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by Unclad Lad (Post 2062850) Just make sure none of you repeat any code. I'd hate for any of you to be remorseful.
On this thread ???? :111: Na,,, Never happen....:cry1:

Unclad Lad | 12-20-2009 04:56 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Has anyone used the new eXRS? Link http://www.trisquare.us/index.html

steyr_m | 12-20-2009 06:03 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Have been a Ham operator since 2000. Have been in and out of it depending on how much is going on in my life. I think I will be more into it when SHTF soon.

democopy | 12-21-2009 10:51 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Yaesu, Kenwood or Icom?

Dave Thomas | 12-22-2009 11:40 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment I think Yaesu has got some of the most innovative products as of late. Icom seems to be fixated on their D-Star proprietary voice technology, and Kenwood, well is just Kenwood. They are not bad radios, just nothing to write home about. It really depends on what you're looking for. Just like anything else in the world.

teacher | 12-22-2009 11:49 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by democopy (Post 2087312) Yaesu, Kenwood or Icom?
I've been using a Kenwood HT (TH-F6A), an Icom in the truck (ICOM 706 Mark II G) and an older Yaseu FT-1000 base station.

Zusn | 12-22-2009 12:48 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by democopy (Post 2087312) Yaesu, Kenwood or Icom?
Careful, that question is like saying, FAL, AR-15 or AK-47? Endless debate. Basically, they all make good radios and bad radios. Go to www.eham.com and check out the Reviews section. If you see a radio for sale, check out the reviews and see if it's worth buying or not. A lot of ham guys are hardcore about their radios, so you will know what each and every issue is with a particular make/model.

Lt Dan | 12-27-2009 07:34 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment I vote Yaesu. But, only because I have never used anything else. Been thinking about getting an Icom for the van.

teacher | 12-27-2009 08:42 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment 1 Attachment(s) Quote:
Originally Posted by Lt Dan (Post 2095640) I vote Yaesu. But, only because I have never used anything else. Been thinking about getting an Icom for the van.
My first radio was a Yaesu HT, the FT-530. It was my friend's radio and I sort of "borrowed" it from him after I got my license. He missed it so we went to a Ham Radio swap meet and I bought my own Yaesu, the FT-530. I still have it, and it still works, though I've added to the setup, with the external mic, additional battery packs, etc. I have it sitting right next to my Kenwood TH-F6 as I write this. The Yaesu radio was designed in the early 1990's. The Kenwood came out just a few years ago. Some great features of the newer Kenwood: 2-meter and 70-centimeter You can monitor both bands at the same time The display shows both bands at the same time Digital readout Guess what, my old Yaesu does all that stuff too. If you attend a swap meet, or even better, the annual Ham Radio Convention in Dayton, Ohio, you'll see people walking around with every HT ever made. It's an amazing site (or is it sight). You could simply stop the first ten people walking by and ask them to show you their HT and you'd see ten different HTs. Swap meets, before eBay, were the place to buy used gear, from other licensed Hams. Never once did I get stiffed. I bought, and still have, over a dozen radios, HTs and mobile rigs, Kenwood, and Yaesu for sure, but also Standard, Alinco, and others. The Dayton HamVention features a swap meet outside with literally thousands of vendors, lots of used gear. I use an Icom in the truck, but I've got an older Yaesu mobile rig that I use in the shack for packet. Why limit yourself to only one HT? Mostly, I use the FT-530 as my T-Hunt transmitter. I've got a backup HT if needed. What it could really come down to is is which HT feels good in your hand! OR What it could really come down to is which HT also lets you work 6-meters. OR What it could really come down to is which HT is smallest. OR What it could really come down to is which HT has the easiest display to read. 73s ...

osoab | 01-08-2010 08:03 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Just wanted to say thanks for all the posts in this thread. This is what has helped push me to get a rig set up. I will be heading to the local ham meeting next week. I've been doing a decent amount of research for operating a radio. I believe that joining a club would be great help. There is a decent amount of tech help I think I may need from someone else. So, if I was to go ahead and get a handheld before I pass my tech test what would be a good option in the $250 range? Or would I need to go a little higher in price range? Not to talk, more of to already have and to fiddle with before hand. Thanks Lt. Dan. Reading your posts, pushed me to get off my derriere. O

teacher | 01-08-2010 09:11 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by osoab (Post 2116225) So, if I was to go ahead and get a handheld before I pass my tech test what would be a good option in the $250 range?
I had an HT and monitored local QSOs while I was preparing for my first license. Since you are joining a club maybe you could hold off on a purchase and see if the club has gear they check out or loan to members. Members might be willing to loan you one of their own. A field trip to a local Ham store might be fun too, depending on where you live. HRO, or Ham Radio Outlet has stores in several states. http://www.hamradio.com/ Another, AES, is in more than one state too. Good luck, and 73s.

osoab | 01-08-2010 09:25 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by teacher (Post 2116370) I had an HT and monitored local QSOs while I was preparing for my first license. Since you are joining a club maybe you could hold off on a purchase and see if the club has gear they check out or loan to members. Members might be willing to loan you one of their own. A field trip to a local Ham store might be fun too, depending on where you live. HRO, or Ham Radio Outlet has stores in several states. http://www.hamradio.com/ Another, AES, is in more than one state too. Good luck, and 73s.
Thanks Teacher. I was going to talk to the guys at the club first. Looking for distributers of the main three, I will have a little drive to get to one. No problem with that. What kind of antenna would you recommend for a home base. I have been looking at specs to build my own. I can get copper, Al, etc at cost from work. The designs seem all over the place, though. I am guessing something that picks up 6m and 2m band. Please correct me if I am wrong. I will probably need to read back through the thread, but what would a decent home set up be. Rig, antenna, etc. O

teacher | 01-09-2010 02:20 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by osoab (Post 2116389) What kind of antenna would you recommend for a home base. ... what would a decent home set up be. Rig, antenna, etc.
Regarding antennas, the short answer is, it depends! HF, VHF, UHF, vertical or horizontal? How much room do you have, CC&R issues? Spouse issues? Six meters is a lot of fun, but so is 10-meters. On the other hand, 2-meter SSB is fun too. You might want a vertical for VHF and UHF repeater and simplex work; you might want a 2-meter horizontal beam for SSB, etc. Are you preparing for the technician license or the general class license? You might look through some antenna catalogs: http://www.cushcraftamateur.com/index.php

Dave Thomas | 01-24-2010 02:31 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Yeah, I think the feature bloat syndrome is hitting a lot of the manufacturers right now. That being said, I think Yaesu seems to be hitting the strides as it were in terms of adopting this new technology. I mean look at the VX-8 for instance. This radio is the size of a credit card, and covers four bands. Has the capability of bluetooth, GPS, all that stuff. Yaesu also seems to have gotten the memo on ruggedness as well. Most of their new HT's are IPX7 certified what have you. It's great for business, Hams get tired of their old boring rigs, they want new stuff. They aren't catering really to the service community. I'd like to have a Motorola saber actually, but I don't want to deal with programming it and jacking with all it's foibles getting it onto amateur bands. Now that's all great stuff, but if you have trouble using it, or operating it easily, all those bells and whistles go out the window real quick. Foremost in my mind is battery capacity. Yes they've switched mostly to Lithium-Ion, but I don't know how well that's going to hold up in the long run. I leave my laptop in the truck for long amounts of time, it seems that if that lithium ion battery isn't pampered, it loses capacity. Even NiMH gives me the willies. I still have NiCD packs that still hold charges that are several years old. And yes, they aren't 1100mAh packs anymore, they are more like 700mAh packs now, but they still take charges and work. Bottom line, pick a radio that does one thing pretty good. Case in point, the FT-411. I love that FT-530 Teacher, only problem was, I didn't have one, so if it's anything like the 411, it's good as gold. OK, I've blathered on enough, but the last point I want to get across is that I have got good vibes about the FT-270R right now, it looks like the grandson of the FT411 that won't die when you drop it. I just wish they had a NiCD battery for the damn thing. When I pick one up, I'll let you all know if it's the "second coming" or not. It's hard to beat the 411 series.

teacher | 01-24-2010 07:20 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment 2 Attachment(s) Quote:
Originally Posted by Dave Thomas (Post 2143439) Bottom line, pick a radio that does one thing pretty good. Case in point, the FT-411. I love that FT-530 Teacher, only problem was, I didn't have one, so if it's anything like the 411, it's good as gold. It's hard to beat the 411 series.
Two thumbs up, Dave Thomas. And yes, a series it was. I still have the FT-811, which is the 70-cm hand held. Just like the FT-530, you could use a seperate battery pack and fill it up with throw-away batteries, which helps make these radios great for your emergency packs!

osoab | 02-01-2010 07:32 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Figured I'd give an update. Got my tech license on the 24th, missed 2 questions. Didn't even come close on the General. I'll take it around April 24th. I did pick up a HT before I got my license. I went with a cadillac, the Icom ic-92ad. http://www.icomamerica.com/images/Pr...92AD_front.jpg I had looked at this before going to the meeting, and after looking at the D-Star working, I said why not. I think this model for a HT will get let me do a lot for a long time. No, I have not picked up the GPS unit for it. 2 batteries, program and cables for now. Anyway one of the guys from the club set me up with his files for the 92ad and for the digital scanner I picked up. I went and had lunch with some of the guys on Saturday and got a chance to see where their repeaters are located. They were adjusting the Echolink connection. I am just amazed that an entire aspect of electronics disappeared for almost everyone. That's the way I see it anyhow. So now, I'm looking for a home base station. At least a 100 watts. Want to get 6m, 10m-160m, and possibly 2m on the same rig. D-Star is not necessary. Any suggestions? New or used. I'm looking at the following new. IC-7200 http://www.universal-radio.com/catalog/hamhf/0026.html FT-450AT http://www.universal-radio.com/catalog/hamhf/0450.html I have yet to talk to any of the guys at the club about what kind of used stuff they have. Quite a few were ready to get rid of old HT's. Teacher, thanks for the antenna link. O

Twisted Avatar | 02-01-2010 07:44 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Congrats O!!!! T

Glass | 02-01-2010 08:45 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by osoab (Post 2157802) So now, I'm looking for a home base station. At least a 100 watts. Want to get 6m, 10m-160m, and possibly 2m on the same rig. D-Star is not necessary. Any suggestions? New or used. I'm looking at the following new. IC-7200 http://www.universal-radio.com/catalog/hamhf/0026.html FT-450AT http://www.universal-radio.com/catalog/hamhf/0450.html I have yet to talk to any of the guys at the club about what kind of used stuff they have. Quite a few were ready to get rid of old HT's. Teacher, thanks for the antenna link. O
Take a look at www.eham.net. There is a review section there and you should find lots of reviews on the radios you are looking at. I hear the FT-450 is a good feature for $$ kind of radio. It is on my list for a base radio. ICOM make an excellent radio. You will pay a bit more for it than yaesu but I think you get a bit more solid reliable radio. Having said that I just purchased a Yaesu ft-857d. Its an all bander mobile radio. It is pretty interesting as a radio. The display is pretty small though, actually very small. That means lots of menus. The structure of the menus is interesting from a techy view point but for someone who is after comms more than a tech hobby it might frustrate. I'm not saying it's got anything wrong with it. I just think it's a of radio for particular type of person. I bought a cat cable with mine and plugged in to a PC I can use Ham Radio Deluxe and actually run the radio from the software, change frequencies and just about every other function. Quite weird to see the radio display changing as I use the software. For HT's I purchased a chinese job. A Wouxun KG-UVD1P Dual Bander. It's open to 480mhz and does noth VHF and UHF. So it covers 70cm, 2m, UHF CB (477mhz) PMR 466Mhz and everything in between. I can hear ambulance and transit cops as well. 4W/5W power. Plugged in to an aerial on my car it can get out to most repeaters around here. The furtherest is nearly 20 miles but up nice and high. Its a cheap radio. The case is pretty tough plastic. The radios is well made and easy to use. Also does FM radio and even has a small led flashlight. For the price they make for a pretty good unit. Buy a USB cable and use the free software to program it with channels and scan banks. Very easy.

osoab | 02-01-2010 09:07 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Glass;2157909
Quote:
Take a look at www.eham.net
This is were i took most of my practice tests. I've looked around quite a bit. I haven't registered yet. I just got my call sign on Friday. Quote:
Having said that I just purchased a Yaesu ft-857d.
I was looking at this model too. I think I will try to find a used mobile. But this guy does have everthing. What antenna are you going to use with it? This is something I still have to research. Quote:
I bought a cat cable with mine and plugged in to a PC I can use Ham Radio Deluxe and actually run the radio from the software, change frequencies and just about every other function. Quite weird to see the radio display changing as I use the software.
I was doing this with the scanner software. That is pretty cool. I like turning the light on and off. I need to have a separate scanner. Everything here is on a digital trunking system. I have everything I could need and more. Court system, power, railroad. Quote:
For HT's I purchased a chinese job. A Wouxun KG-UVD1P Dual Bander.
Where did you find the chinese guy at? I hadn't stumbled across those. Quote:
Plugged in to an aerial on my car it can get out to most repeaters around here. The furtherest is nearly 20 miles but up nice and high.
Very nice. What antenna are you using?

Glass | 02-01-2010 10:33 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by osoab (Post 2157946) This is were i took most of my practice tests. I've looked around quite a bit. I haven't registered yet. I just got my call sign on Friday.
Nice one congrats. I am starting my standard course next week - 2nd level. Quote:
I was looking at this model too. I think I will try to find a used mobile. But this guy does have everthing. What antenna are you going to use with it? This is something I still have to research.
Well at the moment I am a bit torn on what to do. I have a 2m/70cm dualbander plugged in. I've been thinking of getting either a 10m only whip for the car or a screwdriver type for all the bands. Price difference is about $550.00. Quote:
I was doing this with the scanner software. That is pretty cool. I like turning the light on and off. I need to have a separate scanner. Everything here is on a digital trunking system. I have everything I could need and more. Court system, power, railroad.
Excellent. I didn't go back very far in this thread before posting. I hope I am not making you repeat yourself. Quote:
Where did you find the chinese guy at? I hadn't stumbled across those.
I actually picked mine up a the annual ham fest. No one seems to care about type approved etc. Still downunder hams are pretty feral on pirates so people don't get away with much misbehviour. I have also purchased radios from Asia Radio Sales dot com. Not this radio but a pair of puxing 888's with scamblers. Service was good. Stock levels vary day to day but they will tell you if they are out of stock rather than take your money and make you wait. Quote:
Very nice. What antenna are you using?
[/quote] It's called a Mobile 1 ham-ateur ?? something like that. Dual bander whip 900mm/3'. I think the screw base is pretty basic and I am not sure about it's long term durability. I beefed it up with a kind of bolt over boot lip mount. It works ok upto 100kms/hr. Above that it gets a bit washy. I was helping out a friend by taking of their hands for a few $$. I think there is much better out there.

Lt Dan | 02-02-2010 09:54 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Osoab, Welcome to the club. I have a FT-897D Yaesu rig I bought about a year ago, not quite a year because I've only been licensed since last Feb myself. I like the radio a lot. I use a j-pole for 2m - 440 and a dipole for the hf bands. I really need to make some improvements to my antennas, just haven't gotten around to do it. I used QRZ online testing to get ready for my exams. I passed (missed one question) my tech the first part of Feb and went back the end of the month and got my General (aced it). I was going to study and take my extra but have not yet gotten around to do that. You can do a lot with just the tech ticket, but I would urge you to at least get you General, as it opens up a whole lot more frequencies to you.

branshew | 02-02-2010 09:41 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Since we're on this topic here, I'll post a somewhat related question: I have an older TV antenna on my roof - the old school kind with the fins. Would this be good for use when SHTF for anything communications related (HAM Radio)??? I have cable TV, but kept it up as a backup. Now that analog signals are phased out I was thinking about taking it down. I'll leave it up if it is good for anything. Has a nice long coax cable running up to it.

teacher | 02-02-2010 09:54 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment 1 Attachment(s) Quote:
Originally Posted by osoab (Post 2157802) Got my tech license on the 24th So now, I'm looking for a home base station.
Congrats on the new license! I moved from Los Angeles to northern Kentucky back in June of 2009. The first thing I did was set up my Kenwood TS-570 and a G5RV jr strung between two trees. I worked southern California on both 10- and 20-meter, and had lots of fun until a tree limb fell and snaped the wire antenna at the insulator.

Glass | 02-02-2010 10:45 PM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by branshew (Post 2159578) Since we're on this topic here, I'll post a somewhat related question: I have an older TV antenna on my roof - the old school kind with the fins. Would this be good for use when SHTF for anything communications related (HAM Radio)??? I have cable TV, but kept it up as a backup. Now that analog signals are phased out I was thinking about taking it down. I'll leave it up if it is good for anything. Has a nice long coax cable running up to it.
Generally not. You may get some receivable signals in the UHF band but probably not transmit. Most TV antennas are actually 2 antennas but the way they are assembled makes them look like a single antenna. You could use the metal in a TV antenna to construct something more suitable for transmitting but again it would probably be useful on the top end of 400Mhz. 430Mhz - 480Mhz maybe. Thats 70cms into the PMR/UHF CB. I can't recall what they call it in the US. Family something or other .... for license free walkie talkies? There are yagi caculator web sites to help you work out measurements. There are also many other types of antenna you can make/buy for SHTF. Long wires that are exactly that. Just a coil of wire with a feeder point. String it up a tree or over a roof. You can make 2m antennas from a bit of coax and some of that 2 wire TV antenna feed. The flat stuff. Rolls up into a small size and can be hung from just about anything, curtain rails, balconies, trees etc. I mentioned before I have a pogo stick. This is basically about 1.2m of PVC with a coax based antenna up the middle and some run as a coil on the outside about 3/4 the way down. Does 70cm/2m/UHFCB. Works real good. Could be used portable, taped/clamped to a pole or something. Perhaps a pool cleaner telescoping pole. I am getting another one for bug out/camping. I can't seem to find a design for it atm.

Lt Dan | 02-03-2010 08:58 AM
Re: Long Haul Voice and Data Communications in a Post-Collapse Environment Quote:
Originally Posted by branshew (Post 2159578) I have an older TV antenna on my roof - the old school kind with the fins. Would this be good for use when SHTF for anything communications related (HAM Radio)??? I have cable TV, but kept it up as a backup. Now that analog signals are phased out I was thinking about taking it down. I'll leave it up if it is good for anything. Has a nice long coax cable running up to it.
I do not have cable, but I do have a flat screen tv that receives hdtv signals with out a separate converter box. When the networks switched to digital all I did was re-scan for signals and got even more channels than I had before the switch using the same antenna I have had for years. If your cable goes out, you should be able to pick up some local channels with your old antenna. All the same, it will also pick up FM radio signals from further away. The tower would be great to mount ham antennas on too. Or you could use the old antenna to build yagi antennas, as Glass has suggested. I am still able to pick up a couple stations that never switched from analog with mine.

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