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Twisted Avatar | 02-25-2009 01:24 PM
A Know-Nothing Gun Buyer Illustrates a Fatally-Flawed Approach to Preparedness Well, well, well seems like the liberals want to be safe too.......I wonder why that is??.......you dont think they are (gasp!) losing faith in The Mother State now do you ??? A Know-Nothing Gun Buyer Illustrates a Fatally-Flawed Approach to Preparedness Introductory Note from JWR: The following was posted at the Mike's Madhouse forum, one of the Baen's Bar Forums. (This is the forum moderated by SurvivalBlog's Editor at Large, Michael Z. Williamson.) It illustrates how incredibly naive some newbie gun owners can be. It also underscores a couple of my oft-repeated mantras: Survival is not about gadgets. It is about skills. And, tools without training are almost useless. Owning a gun doesn't make someone a "shooter" any more than owning a surfboard makes someone a surfer. Reading this letter made me laugh hysterically, but it also made me sad to think that for each "rescued' newbie that is successfully mentored by a skilled shooter, there are probably one or two others that remain blissfully ignorant. Even worse, some of these latter-day gun owners might think that merely buying several thousand dollars worth of guns and paraphernalia has somehow made them "prepared." Here is the post: "This last week I had a conversation with a associate at work. First let me tell you about him, he's a little liberal and by that I am saying someone who is left of Obama. He starts up the conversation with "you know about guns right, could you teach me how to shoot my guns," at this point I am speechless, I mean this person is about the most liberal person I know. First I have to pick up my jaw and my hamster fell out of his wheel is laying on its back doing the kick'en chicken. Flabbergasted that I am I ask what type he owns and he tells me that they are "those M16 machine guns and a 45 cal automatic." Having known him for about six years and he is a friend (we agreed to not talk about politics and religion years ago) I asked, "What does your wife think about the guns?" He answered: "Oh she knows we bought two of each" (Jaw on floor, Hamster now in critical condition), you have to know his wife more to the left than him, and the last time she visited [my home] I had to swear that all the guns were locked up so the children were safe. The first thing I ask, do you have a gun safe, answer: "No and don't worry we haven't bought bullets yet." I tell him sure, I will walk through weapon safety and will teach him to shoot. By the way where did you buy the weapons? His answer: The local local "sporting warehouse" . I told him to bring the weapons Friday and I will go over range and weapon safety, and we'll go to the range on Saturday (today). On Friday afternoon he brings the weapons and accessories over. Now I won't say the salesman saw them coming but, he sold him: two Pelican rifle cases with locks,two Blackhawk drag bags, two Pelican pistol cases. The "M16 machine guns" turned out to be a pair of S&W M&P PSX [semi-auto only M4 clone rifles] each with a Trijicon ACOG and with a green laser and forward pistol grip with flashlight and with bipod and only one magazine [for each emphasis Mike's] about the only missing accessory is the latt� maker (a whole 'nother story) Now I have seen decked out M4s before but this was ridiculous. With all [items] mounted weight about 15 lbs unloaded. The .45 turned out to be a Kimber SIS with 2 magazines and a shoulder holster and a belt holster with a gun belt, magazine holder. Now he isn't hurting for money but this is taking him to the cleaners. So first thing I start taking off cr*p, laser goes, pistol grip with flashlight goes, I start to take off the Trijicon but did you know that the M&P does not come with iron sights? I had to ask [facetiously] why they didn't get a laser for the Kimber. His answer "It's on order." :4_1_72::4_1_72: Next, I put all the excess stuff in the handy Pelican box and walk through weapon safety. If you notice there were no eye or ear protection, cleaning kits [included] with all this gear [that he was sold]. First thing, I show them how to disassemble and clean the M4 and Kimber. I decided that we would start with the pistol and that I would bring a 22 for them to start with. The range went well we started with the targets at 5m then to 7m, 10m and so forth.it went flawlessly. No great groups but at least they were hitting the targets. We shot about 500 rounds of . 22 and ended with 200 rounds of .45. They had fun and [I helped to create] another [enthusiastic] gun owner. I got them to start using a my favorite gun shop for their future purchases. (She liked my SIG P226 and wants one now). We stopped at the warehouse [store] and returned some of the excess equipment, about $1,500 worth. I told them to practice the basics, and then if they wanted to they could get other accessories. I will be taking them to a different range tomorrow for the M4. Wish me luck. Now, if I could only revive my hamster!" http://www.survivalblog.com/

Professur | 02-25-2009 02:05 PM
Re: A Know-Nothing Gun Buyer Illustrates a Fatally-Flawed Approach to Preparedness I'm a computer tech. Have been for years. And to this day, my biggest dread is the person who bought a computer at the big box store, had them install it, had them try to fix it, had the neighbour's kid try to fix it ... and only then comes to me .... because they didn't want to bother me. Sure, I'll spend 8 hours trying to get this POS into some useful configuration instead of the 20 minutes it would have taken to help you get what you really should have bought in the first place. AARRGGHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!!

Twisted Avatar | 02-25-2009 02:07 PM
Re: A Know-Nothing Gun Buyer Illustrates a Fatally-Flawed Approach to Preparedness The uneducated and any type of essential hardware DONT MIXX. T

leadfoot | 02-25-2009 02:52 PM
Re: A Know-Nothing Gun Buyer Illustrates a Fatally-Flawed Approach to Preparedness This guy did the right thing. He got good stuff (although he went overboard) while it was still available. And then he went out and is getting training - a personal instructor no less. Isn't that what you guys/gals are always recommending?

Twisted Avatar | 02-25-2009 03:17 PM
Re: A Know-Nothing Gun Buyer Illustrates a Fatally-Flawed Approach to Preparedness Quote:
Originally Posted by leadfoot (Post 1593362) This guy did the right thing. He got good stuff (although he went overboard) while it was still available. And then he went out and is getting training - a personal instructor no less. Isn't that what you guys/gals are always recommending?
He should have got the education FIRST. THEN he should have bought his firearms. He was absolutey reckless and that type of behavior is two strokes away from a fatal mistake cause I will lay good money if the clerk pushed him to buy bullets he would have done that too. Bottom line: LADY LUCK SMILED ON HIM..... SHE MIGHT NOT DO IT A SECOND TIME. T

Professur | 02-25-2009 03:20 PM
Re: A Know-Nothing Gun Buyer Illustrates a Fatally-Flawed Approach to Preparedness Actually, the clerk was probably laughing his ass off at this jerk (who was probably talking prepared this and prepared that) walking out with all this and not a bullet to be found.

Unclad Lad | 03-01-2009 02:52 AM
Re: A Know-Nothing Gun Buyer Illustrates a Fatally-Flawed Approach to Preparedness Quote:
Quote: Originally Posted by leadfoot This guy did the right thing. He got good stuff (although he went overboard) while it was still available. And then he went out and is getting training - a personal instructor no less. Isn't that what you guys/gals are always recommending? He should have got the education FIRST. THEN he should have bought his firearms.
Wouldn't have, couldn't have, happened that way. These are uber-libs, and they already thought they knew everything there was to know, because they probably have the full Brady library. The guy and his wife made a gut decision and bought it before all their erroneous knee-jerk indoctrination could kick in. In a case such as this, not buying ammo was a godsend. As haphazard as this was, this was how it had to be. I give them 6 months before they join the NRA. :ok:

Twisted Avatar | 03-01-2009 08:25 AM
Re: A Know-Nothing Gun Buyer Illustrates a Fatally-Flawed Approach to Preparedness Quote:
Originally Posted by Unclad Lad (Post 1600633) Wouldn't have, couldn't have, happened that way. These are uber-libs, and they already thought they knew everything there was to know, because they probably have the full Brady library. The guy and his wife made a gut decision and bought it before all their erroneous knee-jerk indoctrination could kick in. In a case such as this, not buying ammo was a godsend. As haphazard as this was, this was how it had to be. I give them 6 months before they join the NRA. :ok:
Like that is going to do something..... Before this is over the NRA will be shown for the cop out, shakedown , appeasement hacks they are. They are good for nothing but speeches and begging for money. T

Publico, Pro Se | 03-01-2009 09:44 AM
Re: A Know-Nothing Gun Buyer Illustrates a Fatally-Flawed Approach to Preparedness Quote:
Originally Posted by Twisted Avatar (Post 1600746) Like that is going to do something..... Before this is over the NRA will be shown for the cop out, shakedown , appeasement hacks they are. They are good for nothing but speeches and begging for money. T
+1 Haven't heard a good thing about them yet. (We're talking about the National Recovery Administration, right?)

Twisted Avatar | 03-01-2009 09:50 AM
Re: A Know-Nothing Gun Buyer Illustrates a Fatally-Flawed Approach to Preparedness Quote:
Originally Posted by Prosepublico (Post 1600806) +1 Haven't heard a good thing about them yet.
Watch them roll over like beached whales on this Microstamping legisaltion. Stop Giving them Money!!! Use it to buy Ammo!!! You will get a better return on it!! T

Ag_man | 03-01-2009 09:53 AM
Re: A Know-Nothing Gun Buyer Illustrates a Fatally-Flawed Approach to Preparedness The only reason that I am an NRA member, is because some of the gun clubs/ranges in my area require NRA membership. It is stupid, I know! I didn't give them my phone number when I joined this time. The last time I joined the NRA 198?-1992, I got phone calls every week, begging for FRNs, for a variety of reasons. They are a bunch of bootlicking tools of TPTB.

Twisted Avatar | 03-01-2009 10:02 AM
Re: A Know-Nothing Gun Buyer Illustrates a Fatally-Flawed Approach to Preparedness Quote:
Originally Posted by Ag_man (Post 1600814) The only reason that I am an NRA member, is because some of the gun clubs/ranges in my area require NRA membership. It is stupid, I know! I didn't give them my phone number when I joined this time. The last time I joined the NRA 198?-1992, I got phone calls every week, begging for FRNs, for a variety of reasons. They are a bunch of bootlicking tools of TPTB.
See what I mean??? Alot of Gun stores hammer lock you like that.......I know the majority of them really believe that The NRA are good people. But all one has to do to find out which way the wind is blowing is quite simple: 1) Look at the issuses. 2) Look at what they said. 3) Look at the actions they recommended. 4) Look at what the aftermath was. They will say that getting a 3 day waiting period is better than a 7 day and will push that shyt in your face and claim it as a "victory" My Momma didnt raise a jack@$$........... THE LOST AND THEY LOSE EVERY SINGLE TIME PERIOD END OF STORY .......SO WHY SHOULD GIVE MY HARD EARNED MONEY TO A FRICKEN LOSER???. Ammo is a MUCH better investment. T

mayhem | 03-01-2009 10:16 AM
Re: A Know-Nothing Gun Buyer Illustrates a Fatally-Flawed Approach to Preparedness Back on topic....I know someone who has more firepower than I dream of and all the bells and whistles to boot. Not one of his rifles is sighted in. He has a Rem 700 .308 with Gen 2 NV and I asked him if he sighted in the NV? His reply was no, cause he didn't know how to do it. He also has 2 - .50's that are not sighted, AR's without iron sights, AK's that won't hit the backstop at 100 yrds, thousands of $$ in weapons that are at this point worthless if TSHTF tomorrow. I wonder how many like him are out there? All money, no brains.

Twisted Avatar | 03-01-2009 10:36 AM
Re: A Know-Nothing Gun Buyer Illustrates a Fatally-Flawed Approach to Preparedness Quote:
Originally Posted by mayhem (Post 1600834) Back on topic....I know someone who has more firepower than I dream of and all the bells and whistles to boot. Not one of his rifles is sighted in. He has a Rem 700 .308 with Gen 2 NV and I asked him if he sighted in the NV? His reply was no, cause he didn't know how to do it. He also has 2 - .50's that are not sighted, AR's without iron sights, AK's that won't hit the backstop at 100 yrds, thousands of $$ in weapons that are at this point worthless if TSHTF tomorrow. I wonder how many like him are out there? All money, no brains.
????????????????????

Unclad Lad | 03-01-2009 12:07 PM
Re: A Know-Nothing Gun Buyer Illustrates a Fatally-Flawed Approach to Preparedness Whatever you think about the NRA, my point was, the act of purchasing guns and shooting them has a profound effect on one's views. The fact that they even bought the equipment shows that they are having doubts about the politics they've espoused for so long. Maybe they'll join JPFO instead. :grin:

RoadKing | 03-01-2009 01:20 PM
Re: A Know-Nothing Gun Buyer Illustrates a Fatally-Flawed Approach to Preparedness Twisted, Man, sounds like a good convert. I would suspect that with all the guns sales and new folks such as your aquaintences, there will be more 'accidental' shootings. This, in my opinion, will just lead the wacko's to yell louder about bans. Shame, RK

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