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- - Vacuum sealers (http://goldismoney.info/forums/showthread.php?t=264281)

silverblood | 05-11-2008 03:50 PM
Vacuum sealers I'm in the market for a new vacuum sealer. I have a FoodSaver right now, but any quality brand is a consideration. My three year old Food Saver still works, but the newer models are said to draw better vacuum, and they have some other nice convenience features as well. I found an old thread on the subject, but nothing very recent so I thought I'd start a new one. From 2006: Looking For Good Vacuum Sealer These two FoodSaver vacuum sealers seem much improved over the old model that I have. They make wider seals, have built-in roll bag cutters, have more vacuum level settings, have a higher duty cycle, and have removable fluid trays. Perhaps they suck better too. FoodSaver� Advanced Design� V2860 Vacuum Sealer Kit FoodSaver� Vacuum Sealing System with Exclusive SmartSeal� Technology The V2860 (first one) doesn't have the automatic features of the V3840 (second one). It is more expensive than the V3840. Whether cost is an indication of quality in this case is not clear to me. The features seem quite similar. Does anyone have direct experience with either of these models? How about other consumer and commercial models? Anyone have any recommendations for other good units?

graspAU | 05-11-2008 07:15 PM
Re: Vacuum sealers The V3 ones are brand new! That one you linked to looks awesome. I bought a V2830 which is the sams club model, mush like the 2860 you linked to. I got it for about $125. I am very happy with it. http://www.samsclub.com/shopping/nav...Design+-+White

Avalon | 05-11-2008 08:01 PM
Re: Vacuum sealers I have this model.. http://www.jardenstore.com/product.a...id=4892&cid=79 Its got all the super features like variable speeds and separate canister feature. The reason I got this top of the line model is because the first foodsaver I bought broke after I used it twice. The Jarvis company realizes they make their money on the bags and sent me the expensive model as a replacement to keep me as a customer. Quite honestly although all those features are nice I was almost as happy with the black and Decker food saver I got at Big Lots for $30.00.

silverblood | 05-11-2008 10:42 PM
Re: Vacuum sealers Quote:
Originally Posted by Avalon (Post 1099213) I have this model.. http://www.jardenstore.com/product.a...id=4892&cid=79 Its got all the super features like variable speeds and separate canister feature. The reason I got this top of the line model is because the first foodsaver I bought broke after I used it twice. The Jarvis company realizes they make their money on the bags and sent me the expensive model as a replacement to keep me as a customer. Quite honestly although all those features are nice I was almost as happy with the black and Decker food saver I got at Big Lots for $30.00.
That does seem like a nice one, alright. Pricey, though. I wonder if it would be more durable than the other high-end models. I'd love to find some place where I could see them all in person and maybe take 'em for a test drive.

AMforPM | 05-12-2008 01:42 AM
Re: Vacuum sealers My foodsaver is really old... maybe 10 years? And it still pulls vacuum packages as hard as bricks. And not because I have not used it a lot. But one poster got a defective one new recently so I don't know what is best in current models.

Avalon | 05-12-2008 07:04 AM
Re: Vacuum sealers Quote:
Originally Posted by AMforPM (Post 1099507) My foodsaver is really old... maybe 10 years? And it still pulls vacuum packages as hard as bricks. And not because I have not used it a lot. But one poster got a defective one new recently so I don't know what is best in current models.
That was me who got the new one that was defective. I had ordered the much cheaper game sport machine. It was really a piece of junk... It broke on the second use. When I looked up reviews on the model I bought they were horrible. I should have done that before I ordered. I wasn't so upset that it broke because that happens. What upset me was the replacement time. By the time I returned the unit and the paper work was processed it took over a month, plus I had to pay return shipping or wait an additional two weeks for them to send me a label.. That would have made it near a two month replacement time.. That's why they sent me the nice model because of the inconvenience. I would highly suggest buying the one at Costco or Sams where you can return it to a store.. Also the model they have at those stores have decent reviews.. As I said in my earlier post I was quite happy with the 30 dollar black and Decker model I found at big lots. Big lots also had a food saver for 40 dollars. You might want to check out Big Lots first.

silverblood | 05-14-2008 12:39 AM
Re: Vacuum sealers How does the VS280 compare to the FoodSaver. This unit doesn't require special bags.

nub | 05-14-2008 01:32 AM
Re: Vacuum sealers I purchased the VS280 from sorbent along with a nice assortment of bags, it works very well, but I've never used any others so I can't make any comparisons.

nub | 05-17-2008 03:20 AM
Re: Vacuum sealers As stated the VS280 works well BUT !!.....about half the time the vacuum bags loose the vacuum ,lentils ,rice,spaghetti and slit peas have all lost their vacuum. I have found a few holes , punctures from the dry items in the bags but the lentils and peas No Way and I've bagged them twice already. Anybody else ever have this problem? The bags are from sorbent.....any help/advise would be appreciated.

silverblood | 05-17-2008 01:10 PM
Re: Vacuum sealers What the specs on the bags? Are these clear poly bags or mylar? I just bought $700 worth of mylar bags in various sizes, dessicants, and oxygen absorbers from Sorbent. They are nice folks and take the time to answer email questions very well for you. I also bought a pallet (84) six gallon pails from US Plastics. Should help me put away plenty of food.

silverblood | 05-22-2008 12:00 AM
Re: Vacuum sealers Quote:
Originally Posted by TechGuy (Post 1107336) So much for pacing ourselves :) Good luck, you have ALOT of work ahead of you.
Thanks. I figured I would save on shipping in the long run by buying in bulk. All of my supplies from Sorbent arrived today. The buckets aren't here yet, but should be soon. I'll pull the trigger on a $3.7k bulk food order probably tomorrow, mostly various grains and beans, about 60% of what I figure I need to feel fairly well prepped, food-wise. Shipping is going to suck on that big order.

Darkside | 05-22-2008 08:56 AM
Re: Vacuum sealers do vacuum sealers work on mylar bags?

nub | 05-22-2008 09:21 AM
Re: Vacuum sealers Quote:
Originally Posted by Darkside (Post 1113964) do vacuum sealers work on mylar bags?
I don'tknow but I'm still having miserable results with the vacuum bags I ordered from Sorbent, I've resealed much of the food three times (in different bags of course) and I'm still loosing the vacuum , I even seal the end two and three times figuring 3 seal strips are better than one and they still loose vacuum....I'm using the heat timer set at 3-4 sec. I'm hoping some one sees this that can help, I'm getting tired of this crap.

SLV>GLD | 05-22-2008 09:33 AM
Re: Vacuum sealers It sounds like the bags are themselves the culprit and not the seal. The seal is probably fine; especially if you are tripling it. I'd say the gaseous exchange is taking place through the body of the bag itself. Exactly how quickly does it lose vacuum?

nub | 05-22-2008 09:57 AM
Re: Vacuum sealers Quote:
Originally Posted by SLV>GLD (Post 1114016) It sounds like the bags are themselves the culprit and not the seal. The seal is probably fine; especially if you are tripling it. I'd say the gaseous exchange is taking place through the body of the bag itself. Exactly how quickly does it lose vacuum?
Usually occurs over night or within a few days.....I'm using standard bags purchased from sorbent They also sold me a whole case of 02 absorbers without indicator pills....they're telling me this is standard unless asked for , yet when they sent me the wrong size by mistake they had them ?.....I've checked with other members here and they say there were indicator pills in their vacuum sealed bags of 02 absorbers.....I'm not a happy camper.

nub | 05-22-2008 09:59 AM
Re: Vacuum sealers Quote:
Originally Posted by SLV>GLD (Post 1114016) It sounds like the bags are themselves the culprit and not the seal. The seal is probably fine; especially if you are tripling it. I'd say the gaseous exchange is taking place through the body of the bag itself. Exactly how quickly does it lose vacuum?
That may be true but why does it only happen to some?

Darkside | 05-22-2008 10:12 AM
Re: Vacuum sealers Quote:
Originally Posted by nub (Post 1113993) I don'tknow but I'm still having miserable results with the vacuum bags I ordered from Sorbent, I've resealed much of the food three times (in different bags of course) and I'm still loosing the vacuum , I even seal the end two and three times figuring 3 seal strips are better than one and they still loose vacuum....I'm using the heat timer set at 3-4 sec. I'm hoping some one sees this that can help, I'm getting tired of this crap.
Here's what I would do. Try to fill up one of the bags with air- like a balloon if you could. It doesn't have to be taught but enough so there is a good size pocket of air inside. Then heat seal the bag as you would normally. Next, take your sealed bag of air and dunk it into a 5 gallon bucket filled with water or whatever you can fit it into where it will be completely submersed in water. Maybe even a flooded sink. While underwater, squeeze the bag and watch for air bubbles. Where the air bubbles come from is where the leak is.

SLV>GLD | 05-22-2008 10:32 AM
Re: Vacuum sealers you could also cover the sealed, inflated bag with soapy water. Any escaping air will produce bubbles at the site of the leak.

Darkside | 05-22-2008 10:41 AM
Re: Vacuum sealers Quote:
Originally Posted by SLV>GLD (Post 1114096) you could also cover the sealed, inflated bag with soapy water. Any escaping air will produce bubbles at the site of the leak.
Yeah I do that with my car tires when I suspect a leak since they're a bit too big and difficult to dunk under water! Good suggestion The leaking air escaping produces bubbles through the soapy film covering the surface

mightyspuds | 05-22-2008 02:30 PM
Re: Vacuum sealers Yes,you can vacuum seal the mylar but you need to create an airway path with the mesh material from a regular vacuum bag,like this. [quote author=mightyspuds board=thepictorialcookbook thread=1693 post=12945 time=1204055184]So to experiment further I got my old roll I bought at the store that plain didnt work. I sealed the edges into a bag and took the mesh from a pint bag of the new stuff. Cut a tag about 1 inch by 2 inch and inserted into bag at the nozzle site. Bag sealed up! See the mesh on the side... http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d1...o/spuds/p4.jpg And a close up of mesh in the right corner. Plus I will be able to reuse this mesh,so I can use up this crummy roll of very thin plastic. http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d1...o/spuds/p3.jpg [/quote] Here is the whole thread if you are interested,its 2 pages but you will get the jest of the mesh business... http://eastcherokee.proboards58.com/...ay&thread=1693

RealityCheck | 05-22-2008 03:06 PM
Re: Vacuum sealers So basically the vaccuum sealers that "dont need special bags", need special bags. Interesting. :D

judoka | 05-22-2008 10:26 PM
Re: Vacuum sealers [QUOTE=silverblood;1113699]Thanks. I figured I would save on shipping in the long run by buying in bulk. [end quote] ++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ I started my long term preps and bulk buying with the intention of using 5g pails and mylar bags. Then I read the Mason Jar thread here and started with them. I'm using 1/2gallon and quart wide-mouth glass canning jars and a Sears Kenmore vacuum sealer [$130.] with a jar sealer accessory. It pulls a hard seal on the jar. I also put a O2 absorber in the jar to deal with the residual oxy after the seal. The cost of glass and plastic/mylar is about the same, but I feel much better about the glass for 5 to 10 year storage. I'm putting up a lot of grain and sprouting seeds and beans. Plus, the quart/half g. size is much handier for family use/sharing [charity] than the 5g. pail. Don

mightyspuds | 05-22-2008 10:27 PM
Re: Vacuum sealers IF the sealer is like a tilia (I think) or foodsaver you need a bag with air channels embossed or a mesh to allow air to get from the suction port past the sealing edge that gets mashed down when you close the lid and into the bag below the compressed edge. Here are some meds I vacuum sealed with a foodsaver,no 02 absorber used,just the mesh trick and a mylar bag.FWIW the big bag is double bag sealed (smaller sealed bags in a bigger sealed bag) and with a foodsaver I pressed the 'seal' button 4 times to get it hot enough to seal,then I made a second seal next to the first.They seem to have sealed well. http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d1.../spuds/fs1.jpg

mightyspuds | 05-23-2008 05:48 PM
Re: Vacuum sealers Quote:
Originally Posted by nub (Post 1107015) As stated the VS280 works well BUT !!.....about half the time the vacuum bags loose the vacuum ,lentils ,rice,spaghetti and slit peas have all lost their vacuum. I have found a few holes , punctures from the dry items in the bags but the lentils and peas No Way and I've bagged them twice already. Anybody else ever have this problem? The bags are from sorbent.....any help/advise would be appreciated.
Nub,maybe your seals arent melting enough.I would try a longer seal time,thats my best guess.Also make darn sure there arent any crinkles in the seal that can create micro air channels with the mylar.Thats supposed to be death on mylar.Im thinking maybe when you retract your nozzle that area isnt completely flat.If all else fails you could try ironing them shut after you are done with the machine seals. I'll bet a dollar to a doughnut the problem lies in the seals and not the bags,but I have read of bad bags before.It probably takes me 90 seconds to make a seal on 4.3 ml mylar but my heater bar doesnt get very hot. Shoot,are you even using mylar?Tell us more about your bags,maybe a link? Im also happy with just my basic machine too,its the seal a meal brand and sure isnt fancy at all,but it does work. How does that retractable nozzle machine work with mylar?

AceNZ | 05-23-2008 07:57 PM
Re: Vacuum sealers Quote:
Originally Posted by nub (Post 1113993) I don'tknow but I'm still having miserable results with the vacuum bags I ordered from Sorbent, I've resealed much of the food three times (in different bags of course) and I'm still loosing the vacuum , I even seal the end two and three times figuring 3 seal strips are better than one and they still loose vacuum....I'm using the heat timer set at 3-4 sec. I'm hoping some one sees this that can help, I'm getting tired of this crap.
Are you sure the bags you ordered from Sorbent are suitable for vacuum sealing? Not all of them are. For extra-thick material (like the PAKDRY1500), the VS280 probably isn't good enough. I was told by Sorbent that while it would work on a heat setting of 8 or 9, it wasn't recommended. If your problem is food poking holes in the bags, then your bags aren't made of a thick enough material. Thinner materials are also generally poor oxygen barriers. You generally want at least 4 or 5 mils, including a metal / foil barrier (food storage bags should never be clear).

Darkside | 07-08-2008 07:54 PM
Re: Vacuum sealers I am now in the market for a vacuum sealer. I want something REALLY good. $1200 budget Am considering some of the internal models (the ones that have a chamber you place the food and bag into - not the ones where they create a vacuum through a bag externally) Or please explain why it would be a waste of money to go for such a model like the $150-$300 ones.

perl | 07-08-2008 08:51 PM
Re: Vacuum sealers Take a look at this one. I have been eyeballin it http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/te...aler&noImage=0

Darkside | 07-08-2008 09:36 PM
Re: Vacuum sealers The types I had in mind are like this one: http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/te...0047166516681a A major advantage of these types is with wet items or items which can squeeze out liquids and with the external sealer types the liquids bleed out and prevent the bag from sealing effectively

Darkside | 07-09-2008 10:50 AM
Re: Vacuum sealers Quote:
Originally Posted by silverblood (Post 1107307) What the specs on the bags? Are these clear poly bags or mylar? I just bought $700 worth of mylar bags in various sizes, dessicants, and oxygen absorbers from Sorbent. They are nice folks and take the time to answer email questions very well for you. I also bought a pallet (84) six gallon pails from US Plastics. Should help me put away plenty of food.
Hey, how's it going with your preps- you get all 84 of those pails filled and sealed yet? :) I figure you would be ordering your food from a bulk wholesaler like this one: http://www.alibaba.com/product-tp/10...oft_Wheat.html Quote:
Minimum Order Quantity: 25000 Metric Ton

Darkside | 07-09-2008 10:57 AM
Re: Vacuum sealers What do you guys think about using vacuum sealer bags like these http://www.uline.com/Browse_Listing_5563.asp with any ordinary vacuum sealer? The vacuum sealer they sell at uline is very expensive... no idea why. it's an external sealer.

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mtnman | 07-09-2008 10:58 AM
Re: Vacuum sealers Quote:
Originally Posted by Avalon (Post 1099213) Quite honestly although all those features are nice I was almost as happy with the black and Decker food saver I got at Big Lots for $30.00.
Same here, Rival Seal a Meal, bought it a Big Lots for $29.99. I've been using it now for about 4 years and never any trouble. It came with an attachment for jars and a container for marinating. I�ve probably spent 5x that on more bags! I�ve never owned an expensive one so I can�t compare but this one sucks the air out and seals the bag, what more is there?

Darkside | 07-17-2008 09:11 PM
Re: Vacuum sealers I did a session tonight sealing some grain in mylar bags and it was a disaster I used the trick described here where you place a strip of regular vacuum sealer bag inside and it worked - it created a vacuum in the bag and I was so happy. I left the bags out for an hour found one that lost it's vacuum so I redid it and waited longer. After I was satisfied I tried stuffing some of the bags in buckets and that's when all hell broke loose. Moving the bags around broke most of their seals. I guess it's really hard for anything to seal the bag when it's the 7 mil mylar + the strip of regular vacuum seal bag inside. That was the problem. It was not sealing that part correctly. If I raised the heat it would just burn through the mylar. Maybe it's because the strip of regular vacuum bag I slipped inside is 2-sided? Maybe all I need is just one strip? I'll try that when I regather the will to redo these bags Note, I was using a FoodSaver GameSaver Turbo. It seemed like a really good machine but I'm not all too happy with it. Sometimes I have to apply weight to the lid so it can properly create a vacuum. For the mylar bags I had to do them all in the machine's manual mode (using pulse button) because it would mistakenly think it's done when its not and try sealing it. What a pain.

Avalon | 07-17-2008 10:45 PM
Re: Vacuum sealers Quote:
Originally Posted by Dark side (Post 1197924) I did a session tonight sealing some grain in Mylar bags and it was a disaster I used the trick described here where you place a strip of regular vacuum sealer bag inside and it worked - it created a vacuum in the bag and I was so happy. I left the bags out for an hour found one that lost it's vacuum so I redid it and waited longer. After I was satisfied I tried stuffing some of the bags in buckets and that's when all hell broke loose. Moving the bags around broke most of their seals. I guess it's really hard for anything to seal the bag when it's the 7 mil Mylar + the strip of regular vacuum seal bag inside. That was the problem. It was not sealing that part correctly. If I raised the heat it would just burn through the Mylar. Maybe it's because the strip of regular vacuum bag I slipped inside is 2-sided? Maybe all I need is just one strip? I'll try that when I regather the will to redo these bags Note, I was using a FoodSaver GameSaver Turbo. It seemed like a really good machine but I'm not all too happy with it. Sometimes I have to apply weight to the lid so it can properly create a vacuum. For the Mylar bags I had to do them all in the machine's manual mode (using pulse button) because it would mistakenly think it's done when its not and try sealing it. What a pain.
Darkside, Im not sure I quite understand the process you are using.. I have found the heat on the foodsaver not hot enough to seal Mylar bags.. I do mine this way. I seal the filled mylar bag with an iron and leave a small hole only big enough for the canister hose. I use the hose to suck the air out and the hold the seal with my fingers as I pull the hose out and finish sealing with the iron. For long term storage I throw an oxy absorber in there..

Darkside | 07-18-2008 12:02 AM
Re: Vacuum sealers Quote:
Originally Posted by Avalon (Post 1198058) Darkside, Im not sure I quite understand the process you are using.. I have found the heat on the foodsaver not hot enough to seal Mylar bags.. I do mine this way. I seal the filled mylar bag with an iron and leave a small hole only big enough for the canister hose. I use the hose to suck the air out and the hold the seal with my fingers as I pull the hose out and finish sealing with the iron. For long term storage I throw an oxy absorber in there..
Interesting idea by using the hose like that. I will try that. What I have done is what was suggested earlier in this thread with mylar bags - take a strip of regular food saver bag and insert it into the mylar bag so it just barely sticks out. This strip is basically your hose, but it stays inside and gets sealed together with the mylar. The problem is this creates a weak spot because the mylar does not fuse well with the food saver bag strip. I actually also have a stand alone sealer unit which is really good. But it won't do a good seal either because if I turn it to higher heat which is enough to seal through the mylar + food saver inserted strip then it melts the mylar too much leaving openings.

Avalon | 07-18-2008 08:03 AM
Re: Vacuum sealers Dark side, I have had great results with the board and the iron on Mylar.. The little canister hose method has worked well for me.. Let me know if you try it..

<SLV> | 07-18-2008 11:27 AM
Re: Vacuum sealers I picked up a Black & Decker on clearance at Wallyworld for $30. I've gone through about 200 feet of material without a problem. It isn't the fastest machine, but it has performed just fine.

SLV>GLD | 07-18-2008 11:51 AM
Re: Vacuum sealers Glass has downsides such as fragility, transparency and weight. It has upsides such as availability, price, divisibility and ease of use. Considering that I have over 200 quart jars with bands and lids already in my possession I see no reason to go through the trouble and expense of gearing up for mylar and buckets. I am largely interested in which sealers have the jar attachment and are not so picky about the bags used.

Darkside | 07-18-2008 10:45 PM
Re: Vacuum sealers OK I refined my technique tonight and got much better results! I was originally using both sides of a regular vacuum sealer bag to slip into my mylar bags to allow it to suck the air out and the second side was too much for the sealer to handle. So I just slipped in a strip of the mesh-like side and what I think made it bulletproof is I made an initial seal about 3" down form the opening of the bag then I carefully spread the top part of the bag open to expose the mesh strip sticking out and I cut it as close to the seal as possible, then I made two additional seals above where I cut the mesh so it made a complete seal across the bag without anything in between. Did about 14 bags like this and they are all solid. Very happy with the results.

AceNZ | 07-19-2008 08:56 PM
Re: Vacuum sealers I agree that the vacuum sealers don't have enough heat to correctly seal 7 mil mylar. The manufacturer of the bags says the same thing too. What I do is set the sealer on its highest setting, then apply the vacuum and hold the sealing bar down for maybe 10 seconds, which is enough for a temporary seal. Then I immediately use a Hot Jaw to apply wider, overlapping seals at higher heat. Works great.

Dude | 07-19-2008 09:14 PM
Re: Vacuum sealers Just finished up a 3 hour session chopping off the heads of 40 lbs. of fresh-frozen (ok, oxymoron) shrimp from the gulf and sealing with the Foodsaver Pro. You have to wrap the shrimp in 3 (2 won't do it) plastic grocery bags otherwise the frozen shrimp perforate the vac bag. They are ready for the flight up to MN next week - my contribution of vittles for vacation week. My cooler comes home with smoked sausage, walleye, sunnies, and crappie.

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