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Midnight_Rider | 11-05-2009 10:00 AM
If you could do it over again.... If you could do it over again.... With 27 acres and a 16 acre spot cleared right in the middle that you can't see from the road, how would you provision it? Mostly interested in power, water, house with basement/saferoom, security, etc. Power and community water is available, but seeking other alternatives. So if you have bought a particular solar panel grid and wish you would have went with something else, or you have a water storage system, but you would like to make it bigger and better, how would you do it? I realize this could be an endless subject, but if you have had any "wish I woulda done that moments," I would love to hear them. Thanks ahead!

Professur | 11-05-2009 10:04 AM
Re: If you could do it over again.... My principal focus would be towards non-electric solar uses.

Canadian-guerilla | 11-05-2009 10:26 AM
Re: If you could do it over again.... Quote:
Power and community water is available, but seeking other alternatives
i wouldn't be so much worried about the power going off but i would definately look into an alternate source of water whether it be rainwater or a well on your property http://www.riversides.org/rainguide/...=50&subpage=97 http://www.rainwaterconnection.com/r...g/how_much.htm http://www.rain-barrel.net/rainwater-storage.html

Golddust | 11-05-2009 10:48 AM
Re: If you could do it over again.... No mater what you do in time as you use your land and the systems that you put on it you will see how things come together. Most of us will learn by mistakes made or perhaps seeing that there is a way to make things easer or more efficient. Making your place totally self efficient in times of trouble is sure the way to go. Solar-powered utilities +water heating + house heat Water retention - putting a tank or so on your land (ponds) Rainwater catchment , treatment and storage. You are right the list is endless but small changes and upgrades over time. It will truly never end but in the end you wont have to rely on public utilities if need be.. IMHO

jogslvr | 11-05-2009 10:51 AM
Re: If you could do it over again.... It is perhaps nice to have a high spot in the middle of your land, although a camouflaged bunker might be better. Camouflaging a living quarters bunker can be quite difficult. You considerations are security, shelter, water, food, human waste disposal, clean air at livable temperature and humidity, communication, energy source. The ideal bunker would most likely be underground with a water well inside the bunker. Sanitary waste would not be a problem, nor would food storage. However, in order to obtain sufficient clean air ventilation, one would need multiple air shafts which would need to be filtered, secured, and camouflaged as much a possible. Camouflaging your heat exhaust signature would be very difficult and next to impossible given today's sensor technology. Defending your cave would be another great challenge. No matter how many guns and how much ammo you have stashed, it would be no match for military trained gangs with modern detection technology and far superior weaponry. No doubt, these types of sophisticated bunkers exist for the super wealthy and/or so-called politically connected but not on the ordinary persons pocketbook. If it comes to the ultimate showdown (anarchy), most of us will elect to go out in a blaze of glory taking as many pirates with us as we are capable and prepared. This was a good questioned which I've thought about for years and I'm a retired Architect. I'd love to here other opinions and ideas on the subject.

Midnight_Rider | 11-05-2009 12:09 PM
Re: If you could do it over again.... Quote:
Originally Posted by jogslvr (Post 2009163) The ideal bunker would most likely be underground with a water well inside the bunker. Sanitary waste would not be a problem, nor would food storage. However, in order to obtain sufficient clean air ventilation, one would need multiple air shafts which would need to be filtered, secured, and camouflaged as much a possible. Camouflaging your heat exhaust signature would be very difficult and next to impossible given today's sensor technology. Defending your cave would be another great challenge. No matter how many guns and how much ammo you have stashed, it would be no match for military trained gangs with modern detection technology and far superior weaponry. No doubt, these types of sophisticated bunkers exist for the super wealthy and/or so-called politically connected but not on the ordinary persons pocketbook. If it comes to the ultimate showdown (anarchy), most of us will elect to go out in a blaze of glory taking as many pirates with us as we are capable and prepared. This was a good questioned which I've thought about for years and I'm a retired Architect. I'd love to here other opinions and ideas on the subject.
Super-wealthy I am not, but resourceful I at least think I am. I plan on doing 99% of any construction on the place. I've half-way had in mind a modest house over the top of an more extravagant basement. Living in the deep south all my life, I have not been exposed to much basement construction, so this is new to me. Thing is, I've not solicited much local advise, because 1) no one around here knows much about basements either, and 2) I don't want anyone to know about it. Ventilation and water intrusion are my biggest concerns. I am getting man lined up now to come put down a water well but, I am trying to incorporate ways of additional water storage, so that if I had to run the pump on solar, I would have a reserve of water and not be so taxing on the batteries.

jogslvr | 11-05-2009 12:39 PM
Re: If you could do it over again.... Ventilation shafts are as easy as running underground PVC pipe or small culverts. I would have at least one small culvert as an escape passage. Basement construction is no big mystery but waterproofing is paramount. Basement walls can be concrete/ steel reinforced cement masonry units or solid concrete walls. The waterproofing of choice is a natural mineral called "Sodium Bentonite" ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bentonite ) available in sheets like gypsum board, and in biodegradable sausage tubes to use at the juncture joints where walls meet footings. common sense dictates best location/ not good idea to try to build basement in swamp. If water table is high enough, a simple shallow well with hand pump located inside the bunker would be best. Self-sufficiency and SHTF anarchy survival are two different things. The first is very doable. And one other important note; It is next to impossible to build such things in total secrecy.

Midnight_Rider | 11-05-2009 12:49 PM
Re: If you could do it over again.... Good news is about two feet down is good/dry red clay on a south facing sloping hill. You are right about total secrecy, but I want to limit the amount of eyes on it as possible. Self-suffieciency is the priority, surviving from the local zombies is a close second.

hoarder | 11-05-2009 01:19 PM
Re: If you could do it over again.... I would assess which adjacent tracts might be developed at a later date and choose the most private homesite possible even if it entails expenses like excavation or creek crossing. If you live in the "Heart of Dixie" you might want to get on the grid so you can have air conditioning, which is difficult to do with solar. Go with propane water heater and stove and wood heat. I would drill a well and stay off city water.

<SLV> | 11-05-2009 02:04 PM
Re: If you could do it over again.... I am doing it right now. Except I have a 2 acre clearing on a 5 acre parcel. The one thing to keep in mind is that the parcel itself will dictate its use. There is no such thing as a perfect parcel - you will have to overcome drawbacks, and in some cases you will be limited by codes regarding the situation of your residence. It can be real frustrating. I have had many people say, "Why don't you build here/there?" Their suggestions are usually romantic or aesthetic in nature, but there are so many more practical/legal considerations before one can get romantic about it. What about the transit of the sun? In your climate could there be weather generated obstacles/dangers? HYDROLOGY - how does water originate and disipate on the parcel? Where is soil suitable for building AND septic? When everything comes together there will be one prevailing site and construction style, but even that won't be perfect.

Midnight_Rider | 11-05-2009 02:23 PM
Re: If you could do it over again.... You are right Hoarder, it get's a lil steamy in the summer in these parts and the wife isn't going without air conditioning if she doesn't --- wait, who am I kidding, niether of us will go without air conditioning if we don't have to. The ultimate (romantic/aesthetic) homesite on this peice is also closest to the property line, so you are also right SLV, no piece is perfect. We'll be moving the homesite closer to the center of the property. Another reason I'm considering a basement is that we are prone to Hurricanes. Even 30 miles inland from the gulf, Katrina left significant damage and most people in the county without power for weeks, some almost a month. The site that I'm looking at is high and dry, and there is a old creek branch along the edge of the property (that has since dried up since loggers screwed up the spring head a couple miles up stream about 10 years ago.) that I could dam up for a nice size pond. But as far as solar for instance, is there a manufacturer that you would steer away from that you have had personel experience, or is there a brand of insulation, technique, or new product that you wouldn't go without? Those types of things are my concerns now. I am looking for as many "options" to possibly go with before I start anything.

Jimfrancisco | 11-05-2009 07:12 PM
Re: If you could do it over again.... My BO place is a 100 acre island (well, 98), on a 400sq mile lake covered in islands. Visible from the air, yes. From the mainland, no. And you would have to take a 50 mile passage with a chart to find it from scratch, if you even knew where it was. Well armed (legally), and plenty of arable land. Generators, an artesian well, large amounts of fuel stored. Minimal food, plenty to pick or shoot. No address, no mains water, no mains anything. That's where I would start - buy an uninhabitable island, and make it habitable.

gasilat | 11-05-2009 11:00 PM
Re: If you could do it over again.... 1 Attachment(s) Plant fast growing trees in the open area to close yourself in further... Build multiple smaller detached buildings rather than one large house...in case of fire in the middle of a crisis you would have another building to move into...smaller buildings are easier to heat with fuel gathered by sweat equity...multiple smaller buildings would allow you to spread your supply cache into split locations in case of fire in one building so you don't lose everything in one catastrophe... to be truly self sufficient you will need fuel on the property and that is where your trees could supply firewood for cooking and heating...you must have an independent source of water that always available that can be drawn upon nearby...a creek, a pond, a river...etc...that requires nothing more than a water jug to haul it in... complexity and size is the enemy as things break and need constant maintenance for which parts may not be readily available...electricity is not required for self sufficiency... if you can cut firewood and haul water and have a food storage and a small cabin to heat you are independent.... now, if you have the above you're in pretty good shape...then adding unnecessary conveniences like solar panels etc. adds to quality of life but not required...

<SLV> | 11-06-2009 06:54 AM
Re: If you could do it over again.... I've read some GIMers who say you should avoid Xantrex equipment (Outback is an excellent alternative). It has to do with the fact that they outsourced to China and now customer service stinks. I have been most impressed by the knowledge and customer service of Backwoods Solar. I'm inclined to do business with them when I get to that point.

EE_ | 11-06-2009 08:26 AM
Re: If you could do it over again.... I'd start with this and add a small home http://www.mwbsc.biz/html/p7ssm_img_...1)_16x8_fs.jpg

Ash_Williams | 11-06-2009 09:46 AM
Re: If you could do it over again.... I'd have a freshwater moat, deep enough that it doesn't freeze to the bottom in the winter.

Midnight_Rider | 11-06-2009 09:58 AM
Re: If you could do it over again.... Quote:
Originally Posted by Ash_Williams (Post 2011018) I'd have a freshwater moat, deep enough that it doesn't freeze to the bottom in the winter.
I can count on one hand where I've seen ice make it past lunch in south MS and I am thankful for it! :)

Brio | 11-07-2009 06:24 AM
Re: If you could do it over again.... I would like a root cellar.

Tn...Andy | 11-07-2009 08:45 AM
Re: If you could do it over again.... Quote:
Originally Posted by <SLV> (Post 2010748) I've read some GIMers who say you should avoid Xantrex equipment (Outback is an excellent alternative). It has to do with the fact that they outsourced to China and now customer service stinks. I have been most impressed by the knowledge and customer service of Backwoods Solar. I'm inclined to do business with them when I get to that point.
I'll second Outback for service. Had what I'm SURE was a lightning hit on one of my inverters and they covered it anyway with free replacement parts ( and they are easy to install....virtually plug and play )...all it cost me was about 16 bucks to ship back the old boards......and the couple times I've called about technical issues, they walked me right thru solutions on the phone.....Outback is just plain top notch in my book.

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