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- - AR15 (carbine) purchase - not sure what to buy (http://goldismoney.info/forums/showthread.php?t=233011)

graspAU | 02-06-2008 09:51 AM
AR15 (carbine) purchase - not sure what to buy 4 Attachment(s) Any opinions? I was going to buy a bushmaster superlight, but the more research i do I am considering a Colt LE6920 or a Noveske N4 light carbine. In the comparison I am throwing price out of the equation with the major makers. Will do either 16" barrel or 14.5 with permanent flash suppressor. I saw the attached chart and it really got me concerned about buying the right brand. What do you think? Pictured below are colt, noveske, bushmaster.

EE_ | 02-06-2008 10:01 AM
Re: AR15 (carbine) purchase - not sure what to buy http://www.trackpads.com/factsheets/...8AP4-large.jpg http://www.dpmsinc.com/firearms/firearm.aspx?id=18

Tn...Andy | 02-06-2008 10:02 AM
Re: AR15 (carbine) purchase - not sure what to buy I think don't overthink.....get one.

gbgunner | 02-06-2008 10:04 AM
Re: AR15 (carbine) purchase - not sure what to buy If it were me I'd get a 20" barrel with a fixed carry handle and A2 sights. Then put an ACOG or or a good quality 3-9 X 40 on it. Bushmaster or Rock River will do. Just remember flip up sights have moving parts and can fail. Red Dot type sights need batteries or they are worthless. But hey if you want a 14.5 inch Noveske flat top then go for it.

gunner | 02-06-2008 10:05 AM
Re: AR15 (carbine) purchase - not sure what to buy Quote:
Originally Posted by EE_ (Post 955547) http://www.trackpads.com/factsheets/...8AP4-large.jpg
:applause_:applause_:applause_:applause_:applause_ :applause_ ...and of course Andy's advice is spot on !! Buy something soon with those ever-depreciating FRNs. Prez Hillary will cut off supply ASAP

EE_ | 02-06-2008 10:10 AM
Re: AR15 (carbine) purchase - not sure what to buy http://www.trijicon.com/user/parts/p...m?categoryID=3 http://www.midwayusa.com/eproductpag...180&t=11082005

mdpatriot | 02-06-2008 10:16 AM
Re: AR15 (carbine) purchase - not sure what to buy Just remember that a 14.5 inch barrel lowers your fps enough to lower your 55 grain fragmentation range from 200 yards to 150 yards...may seem alittle technical but is important. www.ammo-oracle.com for ballistics on the 5.56/223 Also a big rock river fan as they are usually cheaper than the others and colt does not support the private community as bushmaster and rockriver. but the main thing as stated above is to get one now...or more that one...or on and several stripped lowers for later use. mdp

graspAU | 02-06-2008 11:03 AM
Re: AR15 (carbine) purchase - not sure what to buy Thanks guys. I am already sitting on (that doesn't sound good) a Colt Sporter Competition hbar 20" (pre-brady ban). I want a carbine in the same caliber to go with it. Andy is right and I'm giving myself 1 week before I order, max. Probably my last rifle purchase for a long time. Those ACOGS look nice. After I learn to shoot it well with iron sights, will be looking at those options. I'm really outdated when it comes to optics.

Twisted Avatar | 02-06-2008 11:12 AM
Re: AR15 (carbine) purchase - not sure what to buy Quote:
Originally Posted by gunner (Post 955554) :applause_:applause_:applause_:applause_:applause_ :applause_ ...and of course Andy's advice is spot on !! Buy something soon with those ever-depreciating FRNs. Prez Hillary will cut off supply ASAP
dubble bump!!!.......... just get one as fast you can....... I am terribly worried about what the new prez is going to do with gun rights... ( I am chomping at the bit tryingto get my money situation squared away so I can prep in earnest) Bottom line: time is NOT on your side.... also gets TONS of high cap mags for common AR's ....that will be the first thing to go in the first 100 days in office of the new prez... Bank on it T

Twisted Avatar | 02-06-2008 11:21 AM
Re: AR15 (carbine) purchase - not sure what to buy Quote:
Originally Posted by scottp999 (Post 955652) Glad to see everyone thinking alike. Yesterday the UPS man brought 1000 rounds of 5.56 in battle packs, and the nice mail lady brought 22 - 30 round mags. Next gun show here is in 2 months. Can't wait that long.
Great going!!!........ I will rememeber you when I need to buy incase times get hard!!:s9: It really just is rather spooky.....everybody on this board KNOWS what is going to happen .......like a train wreck in slow motion. Then you go outside and walk among the sheep and you just look at them and wonder......what are they going to do when the shocktroops showup to heard them to the neareast FEMA camp?? spooky times ahead for sure T

gunner | 02-06-2008 11:30 AM
Re: AR15 (carbine) purchase - not sure what to buy Quote:
Originally Posted by Twisted Avatar (Post 955649) dubble bump!!!.......... just get one as fast you can....... I am terribly worried about what the new prez is going to do with gun rights... ( I am chomping at the bit tryingto get my money situation squared away so I can prep in earnest) Bottom line: time is NOT on your side.... also gets TONS of high cap mags for common AR's ....that will be the first thing to go in the first 100 days in office of the new prez... Bank on it T
:D:D Just to add to that - I remember paying $30+ for each Colt Ar-15 mag back when the Assault Weapon Ban was in place. When I see the prices of milspec mags for $9.95, it pisses me off (that I didn't buy silver instead) but it should be seen as a gift to those that have yet to prepare !!

Twisted Avatar | 02-06-2008 11:37 AM
Re: AR15 (carbine) purchase - not sure what to buy Quote:
Originally Posted by gunner (Post 955663) :D:D Just to add to that - I remember paying $30+ for each Colt Ar-15 mag back when the Assault Weapon Ban was in place. When I see the prices of milspec mags for $9.95, it pisses me off (that I didn't buy silver instead) but it should be seen as a gift to those that have yet to prepare !!
In all seriousness I tell people if you do nothing else..... buy common round 9mm ammo buy the boatload and silver rounds and with 5 years you will probally be a fricken millionare in REAL MONEY....... you know things are getting bad when I AM CAN MAKE SENSE OF WHATS HAPPENING.:s9: T

<SLV> | 02-06-2008 11:46 AM
Re: AR15 (carbine) purchase - not sure what to buy Robinson XCR -- an improved AR: http://www.robarm.com/ http://www.robarm.com/prodimages/5.56_L_FH_RS_LG.gif

gunner | 02-06-2008 11:53 AM
Re: AR15 (carbine) purchase - not sure what to buy Quote:
Originally Posted by Twisted Avatar (Post 955669) In all seriousness I tell people if you do nothing else..... buy common round 9mm ammo buy the boatload and silver rounds and with 5 years you will probally be a fricken millionare in REAL MONEY....... you know things are getting bad when I AM CAN MAKE SENSE OF WHATS HAPPENING.:s9: T
I know that feeling :haha::haha:

gunner | 02-06-2008 11:56 AM
Re: AR15 (carbine) purchase - not sure what to buy Quote:
Originally Posted by <SLV> (Post 955679) Robinson XCR -- an improved AR: http://www.robarm.com/ http://www.robarm.com/prodimages/5.56_L_FH_RS_LG.gif
I'm not sure what the deal is with Robinson - didn't they go out of business. i agree, they make an excellent gun but I thought that replacement parts might be an issue so I stayed away.

<SLV> | 02-06-2008 11:59 AM
Re: AR15 (carbine) purchase - not sure what to buy Quote:
Originally Posted by gunner (Post 955695) I'm not sure what the deal is with Robinson - didn't they go out of business. i agree, they make an excellent gun but I thought that replacement parts might be an issue so I stayed away.
Interesting... I hadn't heard that, but there is a note on their main page which says that they will not be (were not) at SHOT.

gruven | 02-06-2008 12:34 PM
Re: AR15 (carbine) purchase - not sure what to buy Quote:
Originally Posted by gunner (Post 955695) I'm not sure what the deal is with Robinson - didn't they go out of business. i agree, they make an excellent gun but I thought that replacement parts might be an issue so I stayed away.
Magpul Masada, too: http://goldismoney.info/forums/showthread.php?t=230675

eat_beef | 02-06-2008 01:29 PM
Re: AR15 (carbine) purchase - not sure what to buy A 5.56 doesn't fit my tactics, and I don't particularly trust the AR platform, but if I were buying an AR, I'd buy the cheapest USED gun I could find. It's not at all hard to pick them up for 600frns. You can always upgrade if need be for reliability. I've been boycotting Colt for years, due to their elitist LEO/Gov only stance. :rant:

graspAU | 02-06-2008 03:35 PM
Re: AR15 (carbine) purchase - not sure what to buy 1 Attachment(s) I think I'm going with this one. In stock, can ship the same day. I hear ya eat_beef on the colt thing. Going to the gun shop in about an hour. 14.5" Cold Hammer Forged Barrel, 1 in 7" twist, 5.56mm --Made of Mil Spec M249 Machine Gun barrel steel, with heavy M249 Chrome Lining, (appx. 2 times as thick as an M4 or M16) --Extended Feed Ramps --Mil Spec Phosphate finish --Same weight as M4 barrel, 1 lb, 9 oz, but improved contour for maximum rigidity, no M203 notch --MP HP tested with certification --Carbine length gas system --Flash suppressor available permanently installed for non-NFA use (standard option), or removable on SBR and select fire models (call in all NFA weapon orders). --Shot peened and MP tested bolt --Properly staked carrier key --Auto carrier --Mil-Spec receiver extension, staked --H Buffer --Vltor Carbine buttstock --Tango Down pistol grip --One 30 rd mag included Low-Profile Configuration (pictured) --Flat-top upper receiver --10" free floated handguard w/ 1913 rails --Low-profile gas block pinned to barrel --Flip-up front and rear sights --6 lbs 12 oz

Twisted Avatar | 02-06-2008 03:42 PM
Re: AR15 (carbine) purchase - not sure what to buy Looks great!!.... how much is that beast gonna run you ??? T

Twisted Avatar | 02-06-2008 03:44 PM
Re: AR15 (carbine) purchase - not sure what to buy One more question: is there a mag with a higher capcity than 30 rounds for AR's if so are there any special restrictions about it?? I dont know much of anything about AR's so im quite curious T

graspAU | 02-06-2008 03:52 PM
Re: AR15 (carbine) purchase - not sure what to buy 1 Attachment(s) Don't want to mention price..haha. People would say I'm crazy, but if I'm going to have the thing for 25 years +, might as well get what I want. I spent $73 for printer ink today, that's crazy! There are 40 round mags out their. I don't use them. I have seen the 100 round drums work flawlessly before. They are made by betac. Picture and video link of someone going through 300 rounds. 300 round dump: YouTube - Noveske Rifleworks - N4 10.5&quot; CQB, 300 rd dump
YouTube - Noveske Rifleworks - N4 10.5&quot; CQB, 300 rd dump

eat_beef | 02-06-2008 04:02 PM
Re: AR15 (carbine) purchase - not sure what to buy Is that a Noveske? Looks sexy! I'm just too cheap to buy one of the high enders, for that kinda money I prefer something that starts with 'M' and ends with '14'. :wink: Did you get a 14.5 or a 16"? I don't see the point to a 14.5 with a perm. FH, you give something up but don't gain anything in return. Next you need to take it to an Appleseed shoot, and learn the basics!:bear_w00t:

Prometheus | 02-06-2008 04:05 PM
Re: AR15 (carbine) purchase - not sure what to buy We have 3 Bushmasters in the house, all of them are flawless. With the exception of my first bushmaster liking to rip the back off teh cases of the nasty wolf steel cased ammo, they've never had an issue with anythign else. My 'oldest' bushmaster I've had since 2000. It's got about 3,000 rounds thru it (800 of which is wolf) and only had the two ripped cases off the wolf. I only buy bushmaster AR's. The crome lined barrels are just another + for them in my book.

graspAU | 02-06-2008 04:13 PM
Re: AR15 (carbine) purchase - not sure what to buy I'm definitley not knocking any manufacturer, but I will say I like the idea of supporting (even if I pay more) a small (veteran owned) business that makes a quality product. I liked eat_beef's comment on Colt. I would want their 6920 but it come s with a stupid stamp on it that says military and police use only. Kind of yanks my chain that now days they don't want civilians to have their guns, when the guns features are perfectly legal for civilians to own.

wallew | 02-06-2008 06:12 PM
Re: AR15 (carbine) purchase - not sure what to buy http://www.hkpro.com/hk416.htm IF price is NO OBJECT, which you hinted at, H&K FINALLY FIXED the M4...

graspAU | 02-06-2008 07:27 PM
Re: AR15 (carbine) purchase - not sure what to buy Very nice on the HK. I wish there were more details on that page to maybe compare it's features to the chart above and to visually show the gas system differences. I already paid for my new Noveske N4 Light Carbine - Low Profile. Hopefully it will ship out tomorrow.

wallew | 02-06-2008 09:45 PM
Re: AR15 (carbine) purchase - not sure what to buy YouTube - HK 416
YouTube - HK 416
AND 'the bald guy from Weaponology'... YouTube - || Heckler &amp; Koch - HK416 ||
YouTube - || Heckler &amp; Koch - HK416 ||

graspAU | 02-06-2008 10:22 PM
Re: AR15 (carbine) purchase - not sure what to buy Wow - HK second owner uppers only for $3,400-$5,000 each. What's the whole weapon cost?? "I have 2 HK416 upper kits for sale these have never been fired but ar pre woned one is a 10in upper and the other is a 14.5in upper Included is one mag a manual and buffer and spring. 5000.00 OBO EACH plus shipping" from: http://m4carbine.net/showthread.php?...ighlight=hk416 http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/Vie...?Item=91274570 I see discussions at the end of last year still talking about if HK would sell to civilians or not. Any verdict?

shades2 | 02-07-2008 04:33 AM
Re: AR15 (carbine) purchase - not sure what to buy Quote:
Originally Posted by scottp999 (Post 956576) Wow - HK second owner uppers only for $3,400-$5,000 each. What's the whole weapon cost?? "I have 2 HK416 upper kits for sale these have never been fired but ar pre woned one is a 10in upper and the other is a 14.5in upper Included is one mag a manual and buffer and spring. 5000.00 OBO EACH plus shipping" from: http://m4carbine.net/showthread.php?...ighlight=hk416 http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/Vie...?Item=91274570 I see discussions at the end of last year still talking about if HK would sell to civilians or not. Any verdict?
If there is a semi auto version of the H&K gun you want I don't see why not, as long as it doesn't meet the nebulous assault rifle definition. H&K do sell stuff for the right price, and that price is considerable. Might have to take the forward handgrip off, lower capacity mags, etc. to make it compliant, but it's not that different from any AR out there. If it's full auto only and they don't do a semi auto version I guess you're SOL.

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- - AR15 (carbine) purchase - not sure what to buy (http://goldismoney.info/forums/showthread.php?t=233011)

jrog100 | 02-07-2008 08:51 AM
Re: AR15 (carbine) purchase - not sure what to buy Quote:
Originally Posted by Twisted Avatar (Post 955649) dubble bump!!!.......... just get one as fast you can....... I am terribly worried about what the new prez is going to do with gun rights... ( I am chomping at the bit tryingto get my money situation squared away so I can prep in earnest) Bottom line: time is NOT on your side.... also gets TONS of high cap mags for common AR's ....that will be the first thing to go in the first 100 days in office of the new prez... Bank on it T
Don't worry too much about rushing, you have at least until January of next year.

eat_beef | 02-07-2008 09:20 AM
Re: AR15 (carbine) purchase - not sure what to buy Quote:
Originally Posted by jrog100 (Post 957046) Don't worry too much about rushing, you have at least until January of next year.
Wrong, wrong, wrong. Once Joe 6 Pack sees the fix is in on Queen Hitlery, the unwashed hoardes will start buying, and prices will skyrocket. Have your buying done by the end of the summer.

Twisted Avatar | 02-07-2008 09:24 AM
Re: AR15 (carbine) purchase - not sure what to buy Quote:
Originally Posted by eat_beef (Post 957092) Wrong, wrong, wrong. Once Joe 6 Pack sees the fix is in on Queen Hitlery, the unwashed hoardes will start buying, and prices will skyrocket. Have your buying done by the end of the summer.
Speed is of the essence.........I must agree 100000000% Better safe than sorry T

EE_ | 02-07-2008 09:30 AM
Re: AR15 (carbine) purchase - not sure what to buy The Phoenix show is a good one! Those in Cali can buy ammo in Ontario at this weekend's flea market and gun related show. http://www.crossroadsgunshows.com/gunsched.htm

graspAU | 02-07-2008 09:56 AM
Re: AR15 (carbine) purchase - not sure what to buy Quote:
Originally Posted by eat_beef (Post 957092) Wrong, wrong, wrong. Once Joe 6 Pack sees the fix is in on Queen Hitlery, the unwashed hoardes will start buying, and prices will skyrocket. Have your buying done by the end of the summer.
+1 - I was glad I bought a colt AR15 in 1992 prior to the Brady Ban. It got real interesting late in the game when that thing was going to be signed. I ordered the carbine yesterday, so I'm pretty much set. I am sure I will order a few accessories. Look for the next weapons ban to have no expiration date. Look for imported ammo to be banned (that's gonna hurt). I'm still hoping Hillary or Obama do not make it to the white house, but nice to be prepared in advance.

wallew | 02-07-2008 11:54 AM
Re: AR15 (carbine) purchase - not sure what to buy It matters not who wins. They all have the same agenda. If you are going to do this, do it sooner, rather than later. And STOCK UP ON AMMO. If you think prices are high NOW, wait one year. THIS will seem like the 'good old days'. Who ever gets the nod to be our next 'fearless leader' will be doing away with the second amendment, either legally or through executive orders/presidential directives. So, buy early, buy often. And remember. ONCE THE SHEEP 'GET IT', IT'S TOO LATE.

money matters | 02-07-2008 01:36 PM
Re: AR15 (carbine) purchase - not sure what to buy For the money you'd spend on Noveske you could buy two Rock River NM Service Rifles, and they would be more accurate, more powerful and more versatile. An A2 will have superbly accurate iron sights, the A4 has detachable handle and built-in scope rail. A4 makes the most sense if you will use a scope. Both have an free float tube under the handguard and a match trigger. A high-master Distinguished shooter I met competes with a non-modified RRA piece. No Krieger barrel, maybe a pinned rear sight, but I don't think so. They are finely made rifles, and will shoot accurately to 600+ yds if you know how to judge the wind and conditions. You can buy a LMT (Lewis Machine Tool) 14.5 upper complete for $700 and swap out your uppers to meet your perceived needs. But a 20" barrel is really more desirable for ballistic performance. Unless you are doing home entry or security patrols, a 14.5" barrel is not an advantage. If you need one rifle, buy it and spend what you would've spent w/Noveske on a Dillon 550b, a couple thousand mil-spec brass and 75gr hornady bthp match bullets. Graf has unfired Lake City brass. Go with 77gr Sierra matchkings if you want "the best". 5lbs of RL15 powder and 1000 primers will cost about $110. You can load about 1400rds from 5lbs of RL15. Cost you about $1000 for the gear and components. Or pay $25/20 for match ammo ready to go, but not necessarily "better" than you make yourself. After you own your Dillon prices come way down. Takes about an hour to do 2-300 handloads on the Dillon once all is prepared to load. Want to save even more money? Use once-fired brass and buy a $100 dillon tool to swage out the military primer crimp. Can still get military .223 brass 1x for $70/1000 WCC or LC is all super stuff. Can use Varget and get 8lbs for $140, gets you 3200 loads. Not rocket science, unless you want to make it such. Takes some time, unless you have $4000 to blow on ammo, $600 in components, another $800 for tools you reuse or sell, looks pretty good. Or buy a used Service Rifle and put a new $200 White Oak barrel on it and then save enough $$ to buy a Nightforce 2.5-10 or Leupold MR/T scope on your rig in a LaRue mount. The Millett DMS 1-4x is a very nice, inexpensive scope to consider. A Leupold VX-II 1-4x is very nice in a carry handle mount. Options. They all begin with having ammunition and the ability to resupply. Pretty easy to store primers and gunpowder, bullets & cases. Even better to store them in assembled form and on strippers.

graspAU | 02-07-2008 02:46 PM
Re: AR15 (carbine) purchase - not sure what to buy Thank mm. I have a 20" now, wanted a light carbine in the same caliber. I sure realize the price difference, but I don't think I will be disappointed in the quality. +1 on ammo. I'm not up on reloading, but I am putting away some good amounts. I can see an import ban on ammo (if the dems win) and with the lake city plant pretty much going only to military and leo prices will look good today if that happens. I'm going to end up having 1 shotgun, 2 rifles, and 2 pistols. That's enough for me. Gotta draw the line somewhere and get back on track with other goals.

Highbanker | 02-07-2008 09:55 PM
Re: AR15 (carbine) purchase - not sure what to buy ...just get a G-3.......nuff said

LibertyAZ | 02-07-2008 10:52 PM
Re: AR15 (carbine) purchase - not sure what to buy Looks like a nice carbine. I went with a 16" mid-length Rock River myself. I like the theoretical better reliability of the mid-length gas system. Best prices on good quality AR mags is usually over at 44mag.com Better stock up now

seektruth | 02-08-2008 12:12 PM
Re: AR15 (carbine) purchase - not sure what to buy If you're buying a complete rifle get Colt, LMT, or Noveske. Everything else is a compromise, and if you're thinking you might one day depend on it, you won't be sorry you spent the money. There are a lot of people that claim DPMS, Bushmaster, etc are the equals for much less money...but that is not the case. The cheap stuff might be ok for a range toy, but they are proven to fail when pushed. If you need to save a little more FRN's to get the good stuff, do it. It's worth the wait.

TechGuy | 02-08-2008 06:02 PM
Re: AR15 (carbine) purchase - not sure what to buy Quote:
Originally Posted by seektruth (Post 959169) If you're buying a complete rifle get Colt, LMT, or Noveske. Everything else is a compromise, and if you're thinking you might one day depend on it, you won't be sorry you spent the money. There are a lot of people that claim DPMS, Bushmaster, etc are the equals for much less money...but that is not the case. The cheap stuff might be ok for a range toy, but they are proven to fail when pushed. If you need to save a little more FRN's to get the good stuff, do it. It's worth the wait.
Not sure I agree with you there.... http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=12&t=318113 It looks to me that the key is good components, not the brand stamped on the receiver.

Prometheus | 02-09-2008 12:40 AM
Re: AR15 (carbine) purchase - not sure what to buy Quote:
Originally Posted by seektruth (Post 959169) If you're buying a complete rifle get Colt, LMT, or Noveske. Everything else is a compromise, and if you're thinking you might one day depend on it, you won't be sorry you spent the money. There are a lot of people that claim DPMS, Bushmaster, etc are the equals for much less money...but that is not the case.
I don't know who sold you that line of hog wash, but I'd demand a refund. I can afford to own any brand of AR's I want. I choose bushmaster because it is superior to most others (please note most). I wouldn't own a colt. I'd sooner buy the DPMS you seem to dislike. colts on par with oly arms and rock river IMO. There are some junk brands out there, but bushmaster certainly isn't one of them.

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