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Tn...Andy | 04-05-2007 08:52 PM
New apple orchard Buddy of mine had some time this past week to bring his trackhoe up, so we've cleared about an acre of hill side directly behind my sawmill area...eventually I plan it to be a small apple orchard. Got about 5,000 bdft of logs off of it, this pile plus another around the hill....mostly poplar with some red and white oak.....and a nice start on next winter's firewood. http://www.digistash.com/data/026a39...1_p117219.jpeg http://www.digistash.com/data/026a39...1_p117218.jpeg http://www.digistash.com/data/026a39...1_p117217.jpeg

REV127 | 04-05-2007 08:57 PM
Re: New apple orchard I've heard conflicting advice on apples. Do you know if it's true or not that they need a cold winter to fruit? I'd like to have an apple tree but I've been told they won't fruit down here.

Tn...Andy | 04-05-2007 09:12 PM
Re: New apple orchard Rev....they need a certain number of hours of cold to set fruit, but there are a few varieties that require very little cold for the South.....but I don't know what they are right off hand. Gonna be COLD here tonight and tommorrow for this time of year.....calling for a low of 19 with snow.

Curtman | 04-05-2007 09:15 PM
Re: New apple orchard Great idea. You will want to take a soil sample to your county extension office and ask them what they can tell you about it. They will tell you what you want to add to make it apple happy. You will want to go with the dwarf trees, high yields and less ladder work. You have a great plan. O hope you plan to keep it organic. Good luck. :coolbeer:

NOOB | 04-05-2007 09:20 PM
Re: New apple orchard I just planted some berries at my tn hideout. I scoped out a few locations for fruit trees also. I was talking to a nursery guy and he said fruit trees will take better in fall than spring, so I am waiting till the end of the year for those. If you get some Andy, tell us how they do. NOOB

Tn...Andy | 04-05-2007 09:21 PM
Re: New apple orchard Nope....going full size trees with this one. I've tried the dwarf and semi dwarf......deer and bear break them down too badly......plus I seem to loose them to collar rot at the graft point. I had 40 trees I set in another area when we first moved here and gradually lost every one of them....took the last one out this past year.....plus it was a bad location, frost settled badly in that area, and now that I've lived here a few years, and observed where the frost collects and doesn't, this hillside is much better location.....the cold air rolls on down the holler....and this hill faces southeast and gets the morning sun as soon as it clears the mountain ridge across the valley.

Tn...Andy | 04-05-2007 09:26 PM
Re: New apple orchard Quote:
Originally Posted by NOOB (Post 563346) I just planted some berries at my tn hideout. I scoped out a few locations for fruit trees also. I was talking to a nursery guy and he said fruit trees will take better in fall than spring, so I am waiting till the end of the year for those. If you get some Andy, tell us how they do. NOOB
One thing I've learned....the old saying "dig a 10 dollar hole for a 5 dollar tree" is quite true. I'll use a backhoe to dig the holes about 8'x8'x 6' deep....then throw the dirt right back in the hole, and plant the tree in the loose dirt. I did that in another location where I'd planned to put a septic tank, then hit rock about 6' in the ground, and couldn't put it there....but I did plant an apple tree there.....it grew like a WEED !.......after 3 years, it was several times the size of some others I planted the same time in a 'normal' hole. They like loose dirt !

Krugerrand | 04-05-2007 10:30 PM
Re: New apple orchard Looks like you've got a great piece of land there, Andy. :bear_thumb: Beats the hell out of living in a suburban neighborhood.:puke:

pinnacle | 04-05-2007 10:31 PM
Re: New apple orchard Tn_Andy: If you were doing alot of trees and did not want to dig a large hole for each one...what do you think of plowing the entire area first...then running a disc over it. This may be a bad idea...what do you think?

Curtman | 04-05-2007 11:09 PM
Re: New apple orchard Should work out great.

Unclad Lad | 04-06-2007 12:24 AM
Re: New apple orchard Quote:
Rev....they need a certain number of hours of cold to set fruit, but there are a few varieties that require very little cold for the South.....but I don't know what they are right off hand.
Popular California apples include Pink Lady, Fuji, and some Granny Smiths. But there is NOTHING that beats a Michigan Imperial Winesap gathered after a good frost. Man, I miss 'em.

electric-amish | 04-06-2007 12:28 AM
Re: New apple orchard Thats some good straight timber you have cut. What would a pile of logs like that get at a mill? 10 degrees with snow! Yeow are you at a high eleveation or is it abnormal. Good job you've done not tearing up the place when cutting and clearing. E-A

TonyG | 04-06-2007 01:39 AM
Re: New apple orchard Your right about the Imperial Winesap. When they are left to fully ripen on the tree, they are some of the best pie apples around. Hold their firmness. A good mixture of Winesap and Romes can keep pace with golden delicious/macintosh anyday. On your new orchard, keep in mind that if you had any Black Walnut trees on the property, the remaining roots will kill orchard trees. Even the ones on the perimeter. About as far as the roots grow out, you'll kill your apple trees. TG

TheSimpleton | 04-06-2007 08:48 AM
Re: New apple orchard Good idea for full-sized. Watch for varieties that have better growth habits. That's common for the older varieties, which is often all you can get for full-sized anyway. Good call for air-drainage, apples are suceptable to it. Also wet feet, but they like stones I understand. I have rolled them in 6' sheep fence before for protection. Because they loop is too small to get inside of, it's safe. Deer aren't AS attracted to adult trees, so when they outgrow the cage, you may be able to take it off and use the shotgun method of protection instead. :) Rev-- I know parties here will boycott them on general principles, but there are Israeli apples that need the least cold days. I don't know where to get the dormant-day charts per variety, but some of the extensive apple catalogs have them. If they grow in the desert, it seems likely. However, I think you need at least a week of basically freezing temps, which is hit and miss in N. Fl. They may claim Israeli apples would be bitter and wormy, but I recall the old saying, "Ye shall know them by their fruits". See what the dormant dates are and give it a try. TS

Tn...Andy | 04-06-2007 09:10 AM
Re: New apple orchard Quote:
Originally Posted by pinnacle (Post 563473) Tn_Andy: If you were doing alot of trees and did not want to dig a large hole for each one...what do you think of plowing the entire area first...then running a disc over it. This may be a bad idea...what do you think?
The ground is pretty much "plowed" now.....but digging a DEEP hole like that is the key I think...plowing only gets maybe a foot at best.....and it will be in grass by the time I plant the trees, so I wouldn't want to re-disturb the soil on that hill once I get a stand of grass.

Tn...Andy | 04-06-2007 09:14 AM
Re: New apple orchard Quote:
Originally Posted by electric-amish (Post 563548) Thats some good straight timber you have cut. What would a pile of logs like that get at a mill? 10 degrees with snow! Yeow are you at a high eleveation or is it abnormal. Good job you've done not tearing up the place when cutting and clearing. E-A
Poplar is bringing 30-35 cents/ft here.....the oaks, maybe twice that.....that pile would bring something in the 2,000FRN neighborhood delivered at a local mill.....assuming I had some way to get it there, which I don't. I'll just saw it into lumber and use it on various projects......you can't be too rich, too good looking, or have too much lumber around......one out of 3 ain't bad.....ahahahaaaaaaa The cold here this time of year is unusual......elevation is only about 2200'.

Tn...Andy | 04-06-2007 09:16 AM
Re: New apple orchard Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyG (Post 563572) Your right about the Imperial Winesap. When they are left to fully ripen on the tree, they are some of the best pie apples around. Hold their firmness. A good mixture of Winesap and Romes can keep pace with golden delicious/macintosh anyday. On your new orchard, keep in mind that if you had any Black Walnut trees on the property, the remaining roots will kill orchard trees. Even the ones on the perimeter. About as far as the roots grow out, you'll kill your apple trees. TG
No black walnuts in that area...have a few other places. I understand oak root rot, from the oak roots left in the ground, is also an apple tree killer.....some type of fungus gets in the soil. Hoping that won't be too big a problem since most of the trees were poplar.

Tn...Andy | 04-06-2007 09:22 AM
Re: New apple orchard Quote:
Originally Posted by TheSimpleton (Post 563685) Good idea for full-sized. Watch for varieties that have better growth habits. That's common for the older varieties, which is often all you can get for full-sized anyway. Good call for air-drainage, apples are suceptable to it. Also wet feet, but they like stones I understand. I have rolled them in 6' sheep fence before for protection. Because they loop is too small to get inside of, it's safe. Deer aren't AS attracted to adult trees, so when they outgrow the cage, you may be able to take it off and use the shotgun method of protection instead. :) TS
Yeah.....I'd planned to use the fence/cage deal too for a couple years to give them a head start. Most of my problems with deer are due to small or young trees.

RiverRat | 04-06-2007 11:26 AM
Re: New apple orchard :D I hope your friend didn't let you play on his nice excavator.... If he did you are ruined for life...might as well shoot you and get it over with... I put my wife on my little 4 ton Kubota excavator to dig a big pit for some stumps I was clearing with a Cat 931B Track loader...big mistake. Now she wants to use it to plant rose bushes with....thinks it's as much fun to play with as a new puppy. Came home one morning and she was excavating a nice big hole in the front yard for her new flowerbed. She's talking about digging a new swimming pool,just so she won't forget how to operate it.... Maybe I'll let her get started and convince her we need a nice Komatsu PC-120 for digging the 20 foot deep end... :D :D :D :D BTW: I planted some Red Delicious dwarfs up at the home place in Boone a few years back...my deer keep a daily watch on the apple crop...they will destroy the trees every fall...you know what I mean. Planting some BIG apple trees this spring...something they can't wreck trying to get the apples off. I'm a little higher than you...elevation 3,200 ft. Look at this...wind gusts 41 mph and 17 degrees...no snow,thank goodness. Boone,NC Forecast ... A chilly Easter for sure... Saturday Apr, 7 <SELECT class=textsmall style="MARGIN-LEFT: 150px" onchange="MM_jumpMenu('parent',this,0);" name=day> <OPTION class=textsmall value=http://wwwa.accuweather.com/forecast-details.asp?partner=accuweather&traveler=1&zipChg= 1&fday=&zipcode=28607&metric=0 selected>Select a Different Day</OPTION> <OPTION class=textsmall value=http://wwwa.accuweather.com/forecast-details.asp?partner=accuweather&traveler=1&zipChg= 1&fday=1&zipcode=28607&metric=0>Friday 4/6</OPTION> <OPTION class=textsmall value=http://wwwa.accuweather.com/forecast-details.asp?partner=accuweather&traveler=1&zipChg= 1&fday=2&zipcode=28607&metric=0>Saturday 4/7</OPTION> <OPTION class=textsmall value=http://wwwa.accuweather.com/forecast-details.asp?partner=accuweather&traveler=1&zipChg= 1&fday=3&zipcode=28607&metric=0>Sunday 4/8</OPTION> <OPTION class=textsmall value=http://wwwa.accuweather.com/forecast-details.asp?partner=accuweather&traveler=1&zipChg= 1&fday=4&zipcode=28607&metric=0>Monday 4/9</OPTION> <OPTION class=textsmall value=http://wwwa.accuweather.com/forecast-details.asp?partner=accuweather&traveler=1&zipChg= 1&fday=5&zipcode=28607&metric=0>Tuesday 4/10</OPTION> <OPTION class=textsmall value=http://wwwa.accuweather.com/forecast-details.asp?partner=accuweather&traveler=1&zipChg= 1&fday=6&zipcode=28607&metric=0>Wednesday 4/11</OPTION> <OPTION class=textsmall value=http://wwwa.accuweather.com/forecast-details.asp?partner=accuweather&traveler=1&zipChg= 1&fday=7&zipcode=28607&metric=0>Thursday 4/12</OPTION> <OPTION class=textsmall value=http://wwwa.accuweather.com/premium-details.asp?partner=accuweather&traveler=1&zipChg= 1&fday=8&zipcode=28607&metric=0>Friday 4/13 on premium</OPTION> <OPTION class=textsmall value=http://wwwa.accuweather.com/premium-details.asp?partner=accuweather&traveler=1&zipChg= 1&fday=9&zipcode=28607&metric=0>Saturday 4/14 on premium</OPTION> <OPTION class=textsmall value=http://wwwa.accuweather.com/premium-details.asp?partner=accuweather&traveler=1&zipChg= 1&fday=10&zipcode=28607&metric=0>Sunday 4/15 on premium</OPTION> <OPTION class=textsmall value=http://wwwa.accuweather.com/premium-details.asp?partner=accuweather&traveler=1&zipChg= 1&fday=11&zipcode=28607&metric=0>Monday 4/16 on premium</OPTION> <OPTION class=textsmall value=http://wwwa.accuweather.com/premium-details.asp?partner=accuweather&traveler=1&zipChg= 1&fday=12&zipcode=28607&metric=0>Tuesday 4/17 on premium</OPTION> <OPTION class=textsmall value=http://wwwa.accuweather.com/premium-details.asp?partner=accuweather&traveler=1&zipChg= 1&fday=13&zipcode=28607&metric=0>Wednesday 4/18 on premium</OPTION> <OPTION class=textsmall value=http://wwwa.accuweather.com/premium-details.asp?partner=accuweather&traveler=1&zipChg= 1&fday=14&zipcode=28607&metric=0>Thursday 4/19 on premium</OPTION> <OPTION class=textsmall value=http://wwwa.accuweather.com/premium-details.asp?partner=accuweather&traveler=1&zipChg= 1&fday=15&zipcode=28607&metric=0>Friday 4/20 on premium</OPTION></SELECT> Day http://vortex.accuweather.com/adc200...rcst_bg/03.gif High: 38�F RealFeel�: 25�F Windy and cold with some sun View the Hour-by-Hour Forecast <TABLE id=Table1 style="WIDTH: 95%"><TBODY><TR><TD style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 11px; WIDTH: 150px">Winds:</TD><TD class=detailRight>WNW at 22mph</TD></TR><TR><TD style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 11px; WIDTH: 150px">Wind Gusts:</TD><TD class=detailRight>41 mph</TD></TR><TR><TD style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 11px; WIDTH: 150px">Max UV Index:</TD><TD class=detailRight>High (7)</TD></TR><TR><TD style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 11px; WIDTH: 150px">Thunderstorm Probability:</TD><TD class=detailRight>1%</TD></TR><TR><TD style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 11px; WIDTH: 150px">Amount of Precipitation:</TD><TD class=detailRight>0.00in</TD></TR><TR><TD style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 11px; WIDTH: 150px">Amount of Rain:</TD><TD class=detailRight>0.00in</TD></TR><TR><TD style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 11px; WIDTH: 150px">Amount of Snow:</TD><TD class=detailRight>0.0in</TD></TR><TR><TD style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 11px; WIDTH: 150px">Hours of Precipitation:</TD><TD class=detailRight>0 Hrs</TD></TR><TR><TD style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 11px; WIDTH: 150px">Hours of Rain:</TD><TD class=detailRight>0 Hrs</TD></TR><TR><TD style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 11px; WIDTH: 150px">Hours of Daylight:</TD><TD class=detailRight>12.0 Hrs</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE> Night http://vortex.accuweather.com/adc200...ight_bg/31.gif Low: 17�F RealFeel�: 7�F Partly cloudy and unseasonably cold View the Hour-by-Hour Forecast <TABLE id=Table2 style="WIDTH: 95%"><TBODY><TR><TD style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 11px; WIDTH: 150px">Winds:</TD><TD class=detailRight>WNW at 9mph</TD></TR><TR><TD style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 11px; WIDTH: 150px">Wind Gusts:</TD><TD class=detailRight>28 mph</TD></TR><TR><TD style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 11px; WIDTH: 150px">Min UV Index:</TD><TD class=detailRight>N/A</TD></TR><TR><TD style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 11px; WIDTH: 150px">Thunderstorm Probability:</TD><TD class=detailRight>1%</TD></TR><TR><TD style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 11px; WIDTH: 150px">Amount of Precipitation:</TD><TD class=detailRight>0.00in</TD></TR><TR><TD style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 11px; WIDTH: 150px">Amount of Rain:</TD><TD class=detailRight>0.00in</TD></TR><TR><TD style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 11px; WIDTH: 150px">Amount Snow:</TD><TD class=detailRight>0.0in</TD></TR><TR><TD style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 11px; WIDTH: 150px">Hours of Precipitation:</TD><TD class=detailRight>0 Hrs</TD></TR><TR><TD style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 11px; WIDTH: 150px">Hours of Rain:</TD><TD class=detailRight>0 Hrs</TD></TR><TR><TD style="FONT-WEIGHT: bold; FONT-SIZE: 11px; WIDTH: 150px">Hours of Dark</TD><TD class=detailRight>12 Hrs</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE> Happy Easter Andy...:beer:

blueice | 04-06-2007 02:49 PM
Re: New apple orchard Master Andy, will GIM members be able to buy your product at wholesale. ??

AMforPM | 04-06-2007 03:24 PM
Re: New apple orchard Rev, Andy is correct about chill hours. I do not know if even the low chill strains developed in Israel would fruit in Florida but that class of information is pretty easy to get. Here the local agricultural agents have booklets and I'm sure it is on the net somewhere too. 100 miles from us apples can fruit, but not here. Insufficient chill hours. Though I did not try the low chill types. But we sure can grow peaches! Apricots want a bit more chill and not even all plums get enough chill hours here. It is something to be very picky about before buying and planting. Those zone charts are not good enough to tell you what will make a nice tree that never bears. We planted 2 kind of silly trees, a pluot and aprium, that were claimed to be ok 1 zone warmer than here and we have gotten nice trees and 1 fruit in 7 years. Not enough chill hours. Great orchard idea, Andy. Another thing as you select varieties is 'good keepers' that will stay good for fresh eating in a cellar longest for some of the trees.

blueice | 04-06-2007 04:15 PM
Re: New apple orchard Does anyone know how much yield a nature tree gives and how long it produces. :bull-emoticon: Master Andy, are you going to call this patch of trees, Cider House Rules ?

Large Sarge | 04-06-2007 08:02 PM
Re: New apple orchard congratulations on your new orchard, very nice homestead you have there....

Hivemindgammahydra7 | 04-10-2007 04:03 PM
Re: New apple orchard I always enjoy your pictures, Andy. You've got a really nice place out there.

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