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Golden Rivet | 10-12-2007 07:47 AM
LibertyDollar.org gold and silver from a numismatic perspective I have little or no experience of numismatics so I was wondering what opinions you guys have of the 'collector' gold and silver dollars etc being offered by the Liberty Dollar organization. Compared to their intrinsic value, the prices of the pieces on offer seem to be very high. How do you think these items will do in the future? Thanks in advance for your views.

CyberGold | 10-12-2007 09:39 AM
Re: LibertyDollar.org gold and silver from a numismatic perspective I find most online sellers to be over priced and then you have to agree with what they send you and possibly have to send it back. My advice is to pick a series you want to collect, read everything you can get your hands on, memorize the common dates, good dates and maybe even the key dates, learn to grade that series (very important) then visit lots of coin shows and dealers looking at their offeriings - cherrypick and deal on what you like. I think $5 gold might be an undervalued area to start, or $20 Liberty has a large selection to choose from, otherwise I would buy AU/MS Saints at bullion prices when I can find them. (got 20 not long ago for spot+25) Back inthe 60's kids grew up collecting stamps and coins, as had been the case for generations. I wonder just how many of the newer generations will be there to buy all the high end collections when they come to market? I pretty much stopped plugging album holes in the 80's , except for ASE's. Comparing a 'Coin Prices' rag from 1985 to one from 2007 I don't see much if any difference in the circulated and average collector grade prices. The high end MS63 up coins have done well but then they cost so much more, your betting that the few coins you choose will have a good market when your ready to sell. My small set of uncirculated old commerative halves hasn't done squat in the last 20+ years Personally I'll stick with more liquid bullion items since I already have a few numismatics I like or will buy if I can get at very good prices.

Golden Rivet | 10-12-2007 10:56 AM
Re: LibertyDollar.org gold and silver from a numismatic perspective Thanks for the comprehensive reply but I was referring to these people: https://www.libertydollar.org/ld/about/index.htm

Anty Ep | 10-12-2007 02:09 PM
Re: LibertyDollar.org gold and silver from a numismatic perspective There are better ways to spend your gold purchasing dollar than dumping it into the hands of a strange operation like this.

RealityCheck | 10-12-2007 05:44 PM
Re: LibertyDollar.org gold and silver from a numismatic perspective Quote:
Originally Posted by Anty Ep (Post 775681) There are better ways to spend your gold purchasing dollar than dumping it into the hands of a strange operation like this.
I agree, the liberty dollar is shady and deceptive. You can't spend those things anywhere, I don't care what anyone says. He is fleecing people with generic rounds for more then $6.00 over spot. The only way his operation would have any legitimacy in my eyes as a real currency is if people were able to redeem thier liberty dollars in return for FRN's whenever they wanted. Thats how all other currencies work, they can be exchanged for other currencies at some exchange rate. He claims his dollars are equal to FRN dollars, but he won't exchange them back for FRN's? His actions prove he knows they are not the same. His currency is a one way street, which makes it a sale of goods rather then currency. He is a huckster, I can't believe anyone falls for that crap. That said I would buy some of the copper Ron Paul rounds for $1.00 to give out to people, but i'm not going to because they have the libertydollar website and phone number on them. Last thing we need is Ron Paul face associated with a scam.

eyeofliberty | 10-12-2007 05:59 PM
Re: LibertyDollar.org gold and silver from a numismatic perspective I picked up 10 of the $1 Copper Liberty coins, with the intent of selling them on ebay eventually, hopefully for a tasty profit. Haven't listed them yet. It will be interesting to see what they go for...

daatx | 10-13-2007 01:19 AM
Re: LibertyDollar.org gold and silver from a numismatic perspective Quote:
Originally Posted by eyeofliberty (Post 776114) I picked up 10 of the $1 Copper Liberty coins, with the intent of selling them on ebay eventually, hopefully for a tasty profit. Haven't listed them yet. It will be interesting to see what they go for...
I ordered 100 ron paul copper dollars on July 5th haven't received them yet...when did you order them and receive them? I ordered another 100 just the other day...it says they're on back order...I hope I eventually get them... there's one on ebay now going for $10... http://cgi.ebay.com/COPPER-Liberty-O...QQcmdZViewItem

Golden Rivet | 10-13-2007 02:01 AM
Re: LibertyDollar.org gold and silver from a numismatic perspective Thanks for all of the replies. I appreciate your input.

CyberGold | 10-13-2007 09:30 AM
Re: LibertyDollar.org gold and silver from a numismatic perspective When you used the term 'numismatics' and 'collector gold & silver', I thought you were referring to old US coinage, not the ploy that web site is trying to promote. I have heard of Liberty dollars but link them to the Militia subculture. I have never seen one used.

eyeofliberty | 10-13-2007 09:30 AM
Re: LibertyDollar.org gold and silver from a numismatic perspective Quote:
Originally Posted by daatx (Post 776849) I ordered 100 ron paul copper dollars on July 5th haven't received them yet...when did you order them and receive them? I ordered another 100 just the other day...it says they're on back order...I hope I eventually get them... there's one on ebay now going for $10...
I ordered mine back in May (or was it March?), and received them last month. Yeah, I saw that one at $10 on ebay. Gave me high hopes! :D

eyeofliberty | 10-13-2007 09:43 AM
Re: LibertyDollar.org gold and silver from a numismatic perspective Quote:
Originally Posted by CyberGold (Post 777030) When you used the term 'numismatics' and 'collector gold & silver', I thought you were referring to old US coinage, not the ploy that web site is trying to promote. I have heard of Liberty dollars but link them to the Militia subculture. I have never seen one used.
I am a (non-active) Liberty Associate. The Liberty Dollar gets a bad rep around here ($20 for an ounce of silver! :shocked_ma:), but I still like the concept. I am not a member of the "Militia subculture", I think that's a bit of a stretch. I have spent a lot of them in the past, and people love to get them in exchange for goods and services. I have always been careful not to mis-represent them as U.S. currency, and given people a choice between them and U.S. fiat. Nine times out of 10 they choose the Libertys. In my experience, people that receive them, keep them, because they think they're really cool. While they do offer some proof-type issues, I believe, Liberty Dollars are really intended to be circulated, not numismatic pieces.

Bimetallist | 10-13-2007 02:29 PM
Re: LibertyDollar.org gold and silver from a numismatic perspective I just ordered 25 Ron Paul coppers.

daatx | 10-14-2007 01:27 AM
Re: LibertyDollar.org gold and silver from a numismatic perspective Quote:
Originally Posted by eyeofliberty (Post 777043) I am a (non-active) Liberty Associate. The Liberty Dollar gets a bad rep around here ($20 for an ounce of silver! :shocked_ma:), but I still like the concept. I am not a member of the "Militia subculture", I think that's a bit of a stretch. I have spent a lot of them in the past, and people love to get them in exchange for goods and services. I have always been careful not to mis-represent them as U.S. currency, and given people a choice between them and U.S. fiat. Nine times out of 10 they choose the Libertys. In my experience, people that receive them, keep them, because they think they're really cool. While they do offer some proof-type issues, I believe, Liberty Dollars are really intended to be circulated, not numismatic pieces.
yeah, $20 is a little outrageous for an ounce of silver. i bought 20 of them from apmex a few months ago for about $15 each just for the heck of it.

AlwaysWrite | 10-15-2007 06:25 PM
Re: LibertyDollar.org gold and silver from a numismatic perspective I've picked a couple up because they are pretty, collectible rounds, in my opinion.

Golden Rivet | 11-15-2007 04:36 PM
Re: LibertyDollar.org gold and silver from a numismatic perspective Has anybody's view changed in light of recent events?

Raccoon | 11-16-2007 01:27 AM
Re: LibertyDollar.org gold and silver from a numismatic perspective I've been getting these liberty dollars in my APMEX orders of "mixed generic rounds" which a paid a slight premium over spot for. They seem to be valued on par with "Baby's first Christmas" and "John Deere 2001".

Golden Rivet | 11-16-2007 08:00 AM
Re: LibertyDollar.org gold and silver from a numismatic perspective The 'recent events' I was thinking of are this: http://goldismoney.info/forums/showthread.php?t=200920 and this: http://goldismoney.info/forums/showthread.php?t=201070

Anty Ep | 11-16-2007 08:45 AM
Re: LibertyDollar.org gold and silver from a numismatic perspective Quote:
Originally Posted by Golden Rivet (Post 775013) How do you think these items will do in the future? Thanks in advance for your views.
since they stand a major chance of being confiscated as evidence of the crime of uttered coinage, they are an unwise investment, unless you are ia good hand at the black market game.

Golden Rivet | 11-16-2007 09:13 AM
Re: LibertyDollar.org gold and silver from a numismatic perspective Confiscated? Maybe if the holder is US based and/or he or she hasn't already got rid of it/them :wink:

Anty Ep | 11-16-2007 09:27 AM
Re: LibertyDollar.org gold and silver from a numismatic perspective Quote:
Originally Posted by Golden Rivet (Post 832843) Confiscated? Maybe if the holder is US based and/or he or she hasn't already got rid of it/them :wink:
up until now vendors were re-selling them with other rounds. I think this was a bad practice but that was not uncommon. Now I believe it will become uncommon. Any bullion vendor with a brain will not buy LDs unless they are planning on melting them down. If I were offering money for LDs I would only pay cash in person and take a major discount off the melt value. Like at least 75%. You might say, well that's almost what the markdown would be if the stuff were hot. Yep! You got it. LDs are now not that different than stolen merchandise. A prudent vendor does not endanger his whole operation by buying and selling hot goods. Those that do have to get a major price accomodation for taking the risk. Risk takers can make a lot of money and they can also get burned.

AlwaysWrite | 11-16-2007 01:05 PM
Re: LibertyDollar.org gold and silver from a numismatic perspective Ah, I hadn't seen the article about their operation being raided. I wouldn't worry too too much about having them - I doubt they'll become illegal to own or black market. What might become illegal (depending on how the court battle draws out) is trying to exchange them as $20 - as opposed to their inherent silver value. I don't think anyone would stop bullion dealers from selling them as an ounce of silver for spot + $X. Who knows - they may become collectible if there aren't many around and they aren't making any more. EDIT: I see them going for $35 and up on eBay...........

Tallships | 11-16-2007 05:54 PM
Re: LibertyDollar.org gold and silver from a numismatic perspective Several months ago, I inquired several times with my local numismatic dealer about getting ahold of some of these just for historic value. He had never heard of them.

RossL | 11-16-2007 08:08 PM
Re: LibertyDollar.org gold and silver from a numismatic perspective no numismatic value. I don't have any. Never bought one and I'm not going to buy any now. These things were always worth melt value and nothing more.

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