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ToBeSelfEvident | 09-25-2009 11:03 PM
1773 Spanish silver Unreal...my wife was showing our grandson some coins she had. I knew she had a handful of foreign coins but I'd never bothered to examine them. So she hands me this and says she found it 40 years ago on the beach at St. Augustine, FL after a big storm: http://imgur.com/m6SIJ.jpg She realized later that she should have gotten a metal detector and checked the whole area. It's a Spanish silver dollar - 8 Reales - the original "pieces of eight": http://www.australian-threepence.com...co-1786-8r.jpg Funny thing is, the original coin contained 27 grams of 0.913% silver. The one she handed me was so worn (the reverse side is totally worn smooth) that it only weighed 5.7g! My wife amazes me. She also found a message in a bottle, washed up on the beach at Cumberland Island, GA.

Professur | 09-25-2009 11:30 PM
Re: 1773 Spanish silver :fap: :fap: :fap:

didgmike | 09-25-2009 11:42 PM
Re: 1773 Spanish silver Quote:
Originally Posted by ToBeSelfEvident (Post 1940826) the original coin contained 27 grams of 0.913% silver. The one she handed me was so worn (the reverse side is totally worn smooth) that it only weighed 5.7g! .
I suggest you maybe have a 2 or 4 real vs an 8 real? 21+gram weight loss sounds a bit too extreme. Is it about the size of a dime or quarter or dollar?

Tallships | 09-25-2009 11:51 PM
Re: 1773 Spanish silver I bought 2 of these a few years back, and they are supposedly now worth 3x what I paid for them. They were advertised as shipwreck coins.

esoteric | 09-26-2009 08:26 AM
Re: 1773 Spanish silver i also have one from 1782........also wondered how much money they are worth???? also you lost 75% of the weight from wear?? I find that really hard to believe.

ToBeSelfEvident | 09-26-2009 09:11 AM
Re: 1773 Spanish silver It's a full-size coin, a little smaller than a 1oz Eagle. It is worn so badly it's thinner than a dime. The thing had probably been in the ocean for 200 years.

gopher29 | 09-28-2009 06:50 PM
Re: 1773 Spanish silver Quote:
Originally Posted by ToBeSelfEvident (Post 1941200) It's a full-size coin, a little smaller than a 1oz Eagle. It is worn so badly it's thinner than a dime. The thing had probably been in the ocean for 200 years.
Is that the coin she found depicted in your post? That piece is quite worn but should weigh in at a lot more than 5.7 grams if it is indeed genuine.

gopher29 | 09-28-2009 06:53 PM
Re: 1773 Spanish silver Also, that coin doesn't look like it has been in the ocean for centuries either. It's not encrusted or anything. Have you taken it to a dealer for authentication?

HistoryStudent | 09-28-2009 07:13 PM
Re: 1773 Spanish silver Congratulations. I believe YOU. Send it into NGC. HS

shortstack | 09-28-2009 07:17 PM
Re: 1773 Spanish silver Quote:
Originally Posted by ToBeSelfEvident (Post 1941200) It's a full-size coin, a little smaller than a 1oz Eagle. It is worn so badly it's thinner than a dime. The thing had probably been in the ocean for 200 years.
I think we all would agree that sand and water, combined with ocean currents and tides, would have low to no affect on the coin, so there must be some other reason why this coin has been worn down so much.

ToBeSelfEvident | 09-28-2009 08:31 PM
Re: 1773 Spanish silver Here's the reverse side: http://imgur.com/V9M62.jpg

Tallships | 09-28-2009 08:41 PM
Re: 1773 Spanish silver Spanish dollar From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia (Redirected from Spanish milled dollar) Jump to: navigation, search <!-- start content --> "Pieces of eight" redirects here. For the album, see Pieces of Eight. <table align="right"> <tbody><tr> <td style="text-align: center; font-size: 139%; line-height: 1.2em; width: 250px; padding-left: 0.75em;">Spanish dollars </td> </tr> <tr> <td> <table style="border: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 1em; background: rgb(249, 249, 249) none repeat scroll 0% 0%; border-collapse: collapse; -moz-background-clip: -moz-initial; -moz-background-origin: -moz-initial; -moz-background-inline-policy: -moz-initial; clear: right;" align="right"> <tbody><tr> <th colspan="2" style="padding: 2px; width: 246px;">Silver 8 real coin of Philip V of Spain, 1739</th> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2" style="border: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding: 0px;">http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...lip_V_Coin.jpg</td> </tr> <tr style="font-size: 85%; vertical-align: top;"> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding: 2px; width: 121px; line-height: 1.5em;">Obverse <small>VTRAQVE VNUM M[EXICANUS] 1739 "Both (are) one, Mexico [City Mint], 1739" Displays two hemispheres of a world map, crowned between the Pillars of Hercules adorned with the PLVS VLTR[A] motto.</small>.</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding: 2px 1px 2px 2px; width: 121px; line-height: 1.5em;">Reverse <small>PHILIP[PUS] V D[EI] G[RATIA] HISPAN[IARUM] ET IND[IARUM] REX "Philip V, by the Grace of God, King of the Spains and the Indies" Displays the arms of Castile and Le�n with Granada in base and an inescutcheon of Anjou.</small></td> </tr> </tbody></table> </td> </tr> <tr> <td> <table style="border: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 1em; background: rgb(249, 249, 249) none repeat scroll 0% 0%; border-collapse: collapse; -moz-background-clip: -moz-initial; -moz-background-origin: -moz-initial; -moz-background-inline-policy: -moz-initial; clear: right;" align="right"> <tbody><tr> <th colspan="2" style="padding: 2px; width: 246px;">Silver 8 real coin of Ferdinand VI of Spain, 1753</th> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2" style="border: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding: 0px;">http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...nd_VI_Coin.jpg</td> </tr> <tr style="font-size: 85%; vertical-align: top;"> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding: 2px; width: 121px; line-height: 1.5em;">Obverse <small>VTRAQVE VNUM M[EXICAUNS] 1753 M "Both (are) one, Mexico [City Mint], 1753." Displays two hemispheres of a world map, crowned between the Pillars of Hercules adorned with the PLVS VLT[R]A motto.</small>.</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding: 2px 1px 2px 2px; width: 121px; line-height: 1.5em;">Reverse <small>FERD[INA]ND[US] VI D[EI] G[RATIA] HISPAN[IARUM] ET IND[IARUM] REX "Ferdinand VI, by the Grace of God, King of the Spains and the Indies" Displays the arms of Castile and Le�n with Granada in base and an inescutcheon of Anjou.</small></td> </tr> </tbody></table> </td> </tr> <tr> <td> <table style="border: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 1em; background: rgb(249, 249, 249) none repeat scroll 0% 0%; border-collapse: collapse; -moz-background-clip: -moz-initial; -moz-background-origin: -moz-initial; -moz-background-inline-policy: -moz-initial; clear: right;" align="right"> <tbody><tr> <th colspan="2" style="padding: 2px; width: 246px;">Silver 8 real coin of Charles III of Spain, 1776</th> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2" style="border: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding: 0px;">http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...s_III_Coin.jpg</td> </tr> <tr style="font-size: 85%; vertical-align: top;"> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding: 2px; width: 121px; line-height: 1.5em;">Obverse <small>CAROLUS III DEI GRATIA 1776 "Charles III by the Grace of God, 1776" Right profile of Charles III in toga with laurel wreath.</small>.</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding: 2px 1px 2px 2px; width: 121px; line-height: 1.5em;">Reverse <small>HISPAN[IARUM] ET IND[IARUM] REX M[EXICANUS] 8 R[EALES] F M "King of the Spains and the Indies, Mexico [City Mint], 8 reales" Crowned Spanish arms between the Pillars of Hercules adorned with PLVS VLTRA motto.</small></td> </tr> </tbody></table> </td> </tr> <tr> <td> <table style="border: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 1em; background: rgb(249, 249, 249) none repeat scroll 0% 0%; border-collapse: collapse; -moz-background-clip: -moz-initial; -moz-background-origin: -moz-initial; -moz-background-inline-policy: -moz-initial; clear: right;" align="right"> <tbody><tr> <th colspan="2" style="padding: 2px; width: 246px;">Silver 8 real coin of King Charles IV of Spain, 1806</th> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2" style="border: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding: 0px;">http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...os_IV_Coin.jpg</td> </tr> <tr style="font-size: 85%; vertical-align: top;"> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding: 2px; width: 121px; line-height: 1.5em;">Obverse <small>CAROLUS IIII DEI GRATIA 1806 "Charles IV by the Grace of God, 1806." Right profile of Charles III in soldier's dress with laurel wreath. It was under the reign of this monarch that the last series of Spanish dollars were struck before the United States Mint began the U.S. silver dollar in 1794.</small>.</td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding: 2px 1px 2px 2px; width: 121px; line-height: 1.5em;">Reverse <small>HISPAN[IARUM] ET IND[IARUM] REX M[EXICANUS] 8 R[EALES] T H"King of the Spains and the Indies, Mexico [City Mint], 8 Reales." Crowned Spanish arms between the Pillars of Hercules adorned with PLVS VLTRA motto.</small></td> </tr> </tbody></table> </td> </tr> <tr> <td> <table style="border: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); margin: 0pt 0pt 0pt 1em; background: rgb(249, 249, 249) none repeat scroll 0% 0%; border-collapse: collapse; -moz-background-clip: -moz-initial; -moz-background-origin: -moz-initial; -moz-background-inline-policy: -moz-initial; clear: right;" align="right"> <tbody><tr> <th colspan="2" style="padding: 2px; width: 246px;">Silver 8 real coin of Ferdinand VII of Spain, 1821</th> </tr> <tr> <td colspan="2" style="border: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding: 0px;">http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedi...d_VII_Coin.jpg</td> </tr> <tr style="font-size: 85%; vertical-align: top;"> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding: 2px; width: 121px; line-height: 1.5em;">Obverse <small>FERDIN[ANDUS] VII DEI GRATIA 1821"Ferdinand VII by the Grace of God, 1821." Right profile of Ferdinand VII with cloak and laurel wreath.</small></td> <td style="border: 1px solid rgb(204, 204, 204); padding: 2px 1px 2px 2px; width: 121px; line-height: 1.5em;">Reverse <small>HISPAN[IARUM] ET IND[IARUM] REX M[EXICANUS] 8 R[EALES] I I"King of the Spains and the Indies, Mexico [City Mint], 8 reales." Crowned Spanish arms between the Pillars of Hercules adorned with PLVS VLTRA motto.</small></td> </tr> </tbody></table> </td> </tr> </tbody></table> The Spanish dollar (also known as the piece of eight, the real de a ocho or the eight-real coin) is a silver coin, worth eight reales, that was minted in the Spanish Empire after a Spanish currency reform in 1497. It was legal tender in the United States until an Act of the United States Congress discontinued the practice in 1857. Because it was widely used in Europe, the Americas, and the Far East, it became the first world currency by the late 18th century. Many existing currencies, such as the Canadian dollar, United States dollar, and the Chinese yuan, as well as currencies in Latin America and the Philippine peso, were initially based on the Spanish dollar and other 8-reales coins. The term peso was used in Spanish to refer to this denomination, and it became the basis for many of the currencies in the former Spanish colonies, including the Argentine, Bolivian, Chilean, Colombian, Costa Rican, Cuban, Dominican, Ecuadorian, Guatemalan, Honduran, Mexican, Nicaraguan, Paraguayan, Philippine, Puerto Rican, Peruvian, Salvadoran, Uruguayan, and Venezuelan pesos. <table id="toc" class="toc"> <tbody><tr> <td> Contents [hide] 1 History 1.1 Spain 1.2 Mexico 1.3 Ireland and British colonies 1.4 United States 2 In fiction 2.1 Fictional portrayals 3 See also 4 References 5 External links </td> </tr> </tbody></table> <script type="text/javascript"> //<![CDATA[ if (window.showTocToggle) { var tocShowText = "show"; var tocHideText = "hide"; showTocToggle(); } //]]> </script> [edit] History [edit] Spain After the introduction of the Guldengroschen in Austria in 1486, the concept of a large silver coin with high purity (sometimes known as "specie" coinage) eventually spread throughout the rest of Europe. Monetary reform in Spain brought about the introduction of an 8-reales coin in 1497. In the following centuries, and into the 19th century, the coin was minted with several different designs at various mints in Spain, having gained wide acceptance beyond Spain's borders. In the 19th century, the coin's denomination was changed to 20 reales (based on 20 reales de vell�n) and finally 2 escudos. Spain's adoption of the peseta and its joining the Latin Monetary Union meant the effective end for the last vestiges of the Spanish dollar in Spain itself. However, the 5-pesetas coin was slightly smaller and lighter but was also of high purity (90%) silver. In the 1990s, commemorative 2000-pesetas coins were minted, similar in size and weight to the 8 reales and also with high fineness. [edit] Mexico Following independence in 1821, Mexican coinage of silver reales and gold escudos followed that of Spanish lines until decimalization and the introduction of the peso. The Mexican 8-reales coin (eventually becoming a 1-peso coin) continued to be a popular international trading coin throughout the 19th century. After 1918, the peso was reduced in size and finesse, with further reductions in the 1940s and 1950s. However, 2- (1921), 5- (1947) and 10- (1955) peso coins were minted during the same period, similar in size and finesse to the old peso. [edit] Ireland and British colonies The term cob, for a piece of eight or a Spanish-American dollar, was used in Ireland and the British colonies during the period when Spanish-American gold and silver coins were irregularly shaped and crudely struck. [edit] United States The Coinage Act of 1792 created the United States Mint, but the first U.S. dollars were not as popular as the Spanish dollars, which were heavier and were made of finer silver. An eight-real coin nominally weighed 550.209 Spanish grains, which is 423.900 troy/avoirdupois grains (0.883125 troy ounce or 27.468 grams), .93055 fine: so contained 0.821791 troy ounce (25.560 grams) fine silver. Its weight and purity varied significantly between mints and over the centuries. In contrast, the Coinage Act of 1792 specified that the U.S. dollar would contain 371 4/16 grain (24.1 g) pure or 416 grain (27.0 g) standard silver. The coins had a nominal value of eight reales ("royals"). Before the American Revolution, owing to British mercantilist policies, there was a chronic shortage of British currency in Britain's colonies. Trade was often conducted with Spanish dollars. Spanish coinage was legal tender in the United States until an Act of Congress discontinued the practice in 1857. The pricing of equities on U.S. stock exchanges in 1/8-dollar denominations persisted until the New York Stock Exchange converted first to pricing in sixteenths of a dollar on June 24, 1997, and shortly after that, to decimal pricing. Long tied to the lore of piracy, "pieces of eight" were manufactured in the Americas and transported in bulk back to Spain (to pay for wars and various other things), making them a very tempting target for seagoing pirates. Some pirates were among the richest people in the world. The Manila Galleon transported Mexican silver to Manila in Spanish Philippines, where it would be exchanged for Philippine and Chinese goods, since silver was the only foreign commodity China would take. In Oriental trade, Spanish dollars were often stamped with Chinese characters known as "chop marks" which indicate that particular coin had been assayed by a well-known merchant and determined to be genuine. Thanks to the vast silver deposits that were found in Mexico (for example, at Taxco and Zacatecas) and Potos� in modern-day Bolivia, and to silver from Spain's possessions throughout the Americas, mints in Mexico and Peru also began to strike the coin. Millions of Spanish dollars were minted over the course of several centuries. They were among the most widely circulating coins of the colonial period in the Americas, and were still in use in North America and in South-East Asia in the 19th century. They had a value of one dollar when circulating in the United States. The coin is roughly equivalent to the silver thaler issued in Bohemia and elsewhere since 1517. The German name "thaler" (pronounced "tah-ler" � and "dahler" in Low German) became dollar in French and English. [edit] In fiction In modern pop culture and fiction, "Pieces of Eight" are most often associated with the popular notion of pirates. [edit] Fictional portrayals In Robert Louis Stevenson's Treasure Island, Long John Silver's parrot had apparently been trained to cry out, "Pieces of eight!" This use tied the coin (and parrots) to fictional depictions of pirates. In Terry Pratchett's Going Postal, Reacher Gilt's parrot cries out "twelve and a half percent!" as a parody of Long John Silver's parrot. In Yohoho! Puzzle Pirates pieces of eight are the primary in-game currency. In Pirates of the Caribbean: At World's End the Pirate Lords must meet together by presenting the "Nine Pieces of Eight", since these Pieces were used to seal the goddess Calypso in her human form by the first Brethren Court. As the Pirate Lords were, at the time of sealing Calypso into her human form, too poor to offer real Spanish dollars, they opted to use personal talismans instead. "Pieces of Eight" is the name of a novelty pirate store outside of the Pirates of the Caribbean ride in Disneyland. In RuneScape pieces of eight are a reward for a pirate-themed minigame called "Trouble Brewing" and can be used to purchase special pirate attire.<sup id="cite_ref-0" class="reference">[1]</sup> In the Amiga and PC pirate-themed adventure game series, Monkey Island, the traded currency is the piece of eight. In Neal Stephenson's The Baroque Cycle numismatics, gold and Pieces of eight are an integral part of the plot. In the second volume The Confusion there is also a subtle reference to the fact that a Piece of eight is composed of 8 "bits" (it is thus a sort of "byte" and a unit of information transfer). Pieces of Eight is the title of a pirate themed coin game by Atlas Games.<sup id="cite_ref-1" class="reference">[2]</sup>[1] Pieces of Eight is the title of a 1978 studio album by the American rock band Styx. It is also the title track of this album. In "The Mystery of Monkey Island" by Lucasarts the common currency is also pieces of eight.

argentos | 09-28-2009 09:38 PM
Re: 1773 Spanish silver That was very interesting, Tallships. :yes:

mamboni | 09-29-2009 12:16 AM
Re: 1773 Spanish silver Quote:
Originally Posted by ToBeSelfEvident (Post 1945216) Here's the reverse side: http://imgur.com/V9M62.jpg
Errr...iksnay on NGC.:signs14:

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