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- - Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? (http://goldismoney.info/forums/showthread.php?t=233469)

clashcityrocker | 02-07-2008 02:44 PM
Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? I'd like to hear thoughts about the pros & cons of owning 90% silver coins, say, as opposed to SAEs, 1 or 10 ounce silver bars, rounds, etc. Now I know that 90% is just about the cheapest way to purchase silver with prices being slightly above and often below spot. But the coins seem to me to be somewhat of a hassle to deal with. To be sure, they're better than FRNs but in the context of owning silver I contend that there is a built in disadvantage to them due to... 1. Volume/Size. One bag of 90% silver ($1000 face value; 712-715 ounces) weighs about 56 pounds ($500 or about 356 ounces is of course 28 pounds, etc.). This also goes to storage issues. 2. Saving 90% to perhaps use for barter some day? Calculating it all out is doable to be sure, but not always simple. Case in point. Pre-1965 Silver Washington quarters contain .18084 ounces of silver. Franklin half dollars contain .36169 ounces of silver. Roosevelt dimes contain .07234 ounces of silver. I think you see where I'm going with this. These are hardly round number amounts. Someone wants to trade you an item or service for 10 ounces of silver and what do you give them in return as far as 90% goes? It can be calculated out to come close but it goes back to my point of being a bit more difficult to deal with (as opposed to owning rounds, SAEs, bars). Would like to hear some thoughts from everyone on this, pro & con. Thanks!

Lackluster | 02-07-2008 02:50 PM
Re: Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? Yes.

eyeofliberty | 02-07-2008 03:01 PM
Re: Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? Yes. All my silver is in 90%, SAEs, 10 oz. bars, and Libertads. Cool tool: http://www.silverandgoldaremoney.com/

DrillAndFill | 02-07-2008 03:01 PM
Re: Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? 90% is fine, as is just about any form of silver. Much of the objection to it stems from the prices dealers pay you when you sell, which are usually under spot. Of course, you can also buy it under spot, which points to a fundamental, but sometimes overlooked fact: it's the spread that counts. To get this spread, you must buy and sell from large, big-city dealers; the buy prices offered by local dealers are often insulting. If you prefer to sell face-to-face, and don't live near CMI or Apmex, 90% could be a problem. If you're fine with shipping when you sell, buy all the 90% you want. I bought some bags at around $9.20 a couple of years ago, and sold a couple recently. The increase tracked the price of silver, minus about a 3% spread. There is never a question of authenticity when selling 90%. Sell transactions usually take minutes. The advantage of 90% over Eagles, rounds, and ingots is that it trades at or below spot. If I had bought, say, Eagles a couple of years ago, I would have paid around $1.50 per ounce above spot, and if I sold them today, I would get spot + $1.50, minus a 3% spread. Notice that I would have made money on the silver, but not on the $1.50 premium, so I would have effectively loaned $1.50 to the dealer for a few years at 0% interest. If premiums increase in proportion to spot, I'd do better, but so far they have not. For above-spot forms of silver, the premium has to increase for you to do as well as with a form that sells near spot: in rounds and ingots, this has happened, but not with Eagles. That said, I'll probably pick up some Eagles soon, and I love ingots as well. The bags are a pain to move around and stash. Even the half bags are hard on the back and knees. Full bags are murder.

DrillAndFill | 02-07-2008 03:06 PM
Re: Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? Another thing: 90% is not as fashionable as other forms of silver right now, but that has not usually been the case, and it could get more popular again. You will encounter some FUD, gnashing of teeth, and wailing about 90% here and there. None of that means anything, because dealers and refineries like it just fine.

justabeginner | 02-07-2008 03:13 PM
Re: Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? I own zero 90% coins. I concentrate on SAE's and some 10 oz and smaller bars.

narco | 02-07-2008 03:26 PM
Re: Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? I have some pre 1946 UK silver .50 coinage that I paid slightly under spot price for. The thing I don't like is that they are so damn ugly and worn out in comparison to a shiney roll of new .999 eagles or maples. :rant: Either way, its the weight that counts so its cool no matter what form the bullion is in.

abrokencircle | 02-07-2008 03:32 PM
Re: Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? I don't own any 90% silver either. Just 10oz bars and SAE. I might one day get a small bag of 90%, but it isn't all that appealing to me, nor do I have the storage space for it.

Canadian-guerilla | 02-07-2008 03:58 PM
Re: Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? half of my silver stash is silver dollars, quarters, and dimes and i have small silver just for the purpose of bartering/trading after TSHTF

yukoncornelius | 02-07-2008 04:03 PM
Re: Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? For some reason I love the 1964 Kennedy halves. I have $1000 face at the moment and will be buying more soon. I do have many other kinds of silver but I can't stop buying those darn 90% Kennedy's. My wife says I should seek some help. :D

Bill843 | 02-07-2008 04:26 PM
Re: Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? I think if you are in the US, owning 90% silver US coins would seem to be a pretty good idea to me, just for the bartering aspect in dire times. Not for investment in good times; the spreads aren't good. They are already familiar to middle-age and older people (something you cannot say much of silver bullion) so they will be much more widely accepted. Plus, they are usually worn and tarnished, so they look authentic--something that bright & sharp newly-minted bullion does not do. -end-

goldminer | 02-07-2008 05:22 PM
Re: Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? Determining the value of a lot of "average" circulated 90% coins is very simple. In those days the coins were REAL money so the amount of silver they contained was linear. To wit: a quarter had 2.5 times the amount of silver as a dime, and a half-dollar had 2 times as much silver as a quarter and 5 times as much silver as a dime. Melt value of a one dollar face-value lot of these coins is determined by multiplying current spot in USD x .715. i.e. current spot is US $16.50 x .715 = $11.80 for a one dollar face-value lot of dimes, quarters, or halves...or any combintation thereof. Said another way, a lot of 90% coins at $16.50 spot, trades at 11.8 times face value. The value of the silver in an $14.30 face-value lot of these coins at $16.50 spot is 11.8 x $14.30 = $168.74.

Twisted Avatar | 02-07-2008 06:16 PM
Re: Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? Lots of good feedback and great points to consider... You should definatey hold 90% just for insurance purposes if thing get harsh....people will recognize 90% very soon after TSHT type event because people will learn VERY QUICK what has vaule and what dosent. as for the ugly factor....I personally shine all of mines and save ones that I am told could be valuable.... shining them is a form of meditation for me. Bottom line you should hold your silver in MULTIPLE FORMS that way you cant loose...... T

Weatherman | 02-07-2008 06:45 PM
Re: Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? Quote:
Originally Posted by DrillAndFill (Post 957664) There is never a question of authenticity when selling 90%.
This is a key point. I think that we are only at the beginning of a massive amount of counterfeit and fraudulent metal production as prices increase. If it costs the crook a dollar or two to make a quality fake of a coin or bar, then anything gold will become suspect, and so will all silver in 1 oz. or larger sizes. In that untrusting environment, 90% will prosper, and could become the medium of choice among unsophisticated investors.

eat_beef | 02-07-2008 07:29 PM
Re: Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? Quote:
Originally Posted by Twisted Avatar (Post 957979) Bottom line you should hold your silver in MULTIPLE FORMS that way you cant loose...... T
Umm, if you have everything you're gauranteed to have the worst form (IE, LOSE).:bear_w00t:

Highbanker | 02-07-2008 09:16 PM
Re: Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? Yes to the above....except to the .999 elites... 90% is a GREAT value...always will be....and I agree that the Kennedy halves are the way to go....If 90% ever begins to trade at weight rather than face....the Kennedys are the LEAST worn and heaviest of all. More silver for the buck...

Awoke | 02-08-2008 06:01 AM
Re: Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? Great thread. Where can you find out specific silver content of each coin, based on the year and the type? I've looked around on the net, but no luck.

Canadian-guerilla | 02-08-2008 06:21 AM
Re: Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? . http://www.coinflation.com/silver_coin_values.html

Twisted Avatar | 02-08-2008 06:24 AM
Re: Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? Quote:
Originally Posted by Wakeness (Post 958719) Great thread. Where can you find out specific silver content of each coin, based on the year and the type? I've looked around on the net, but no luck.
Very helpful site http://www.coinflation.com/ T

Atahualpa | 02-08-2008 09:19 AM
Re: Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? My favorite 90% are Franklin halves, they were never anything but 90% and they are substantial, with very little wear for circulated coinage. When I bought mine, they were $50 more per bag than other 90%. It's hard to go wrong with 90%...yet, they are not very impressive to newcomers, especially Roosevelt dimes and Washington quarters. Silver Eagles or silver dollars always get people's attention.

eat_beef | 02-08-2008 09:25 AM
Re: Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? +1 on the Kennedys being best because of weight. When silver spikes 90% will trade by weight rather than face value. Kennedys are normally the heaviest/least worn. To figure the silver content per coin, do like was mentioned above. .715 oz per $1 face value. .715 is an average, I've had coins which weighed from .72+ to .68, depending on age/wear. The storage thing is a non issue. If you can't find a place to store an extra 30%, you're not trying.:no_ma:

Twisted Avatar | 02-08-2008 09:54 AM
Re: Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? what is all this talk about weight??......... I never knew this about kennedys?? Do they weigh more than a peace dollar(my fav) or morgan?? Only challenge with kennedys is that you have to check the date. But I am very intrested in this weight thing...... T

eat_beef | 02-08-2008 10:03 AM
Re: Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? Kennedys are HALF Dollars. So no, they don't weigh as much as a full Dollar. Also, Silver Dollars were minted heavier than fractionals. The "extra" weight we're talking about is not extra at all, it's just that the Kennedys were only in circulation for a year before folks started hoarding them (Gershom's Law), therefore they recieved less wear, and weigh closer to the weight at which they were minted. BTW, you don't have to look at dates, turn them on their side and look for the copper (or lack thereof). I can recognize them faster this way than checking to see if they're Kennedy/Franklin/WL.

Turner-son | 02-08-2008 10:12 AM
Re: Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? Quote:
Originally Posted by eat_beef (Post 958973) Kennedys are HALF Dollars. So no, they don't weigh as much as a full Dollar. Also, Silver Dollars were minted heavier than fractionals. The "extra" weight we're talking about is not extra at all, it's just that the Kennedys were only in circulation for a year before folks started hoarding them (Gershom's Law), therefore they recieved less wear, and weigh closer to the weight at which they were minted. BTW, you don't have to look at dates, turn them on their side and look for the copper (or lack thereof). I can recognize them faster this way than checking to see if they're Kennedy/Franklin/WL.
Only the 1964 Kennedys are 90% silver of course (the older halves are as well). Also, 1965-1970, plus assorted proofs are 40% silver. So, looking at the sides doesn't actually guarantee a 90% silver coin (could be 40%). Also, 1964 Kennedys were actually minted all the way into 1967, just back dated, so they were in circulation for more than one year. Still, as you said, they are your best bet when looking for the least wear.

Twisted Avatar | 02-08-2008 10:17 AM
Re: Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? Oh ..I never knew that.......that is some really good info to have... thanks for the share...... T

eat_beef | 02-08-2008 10:27 AM
Re: Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? Turner Son, you're right, I forget that these basics need to be covered for the newbs. Twisted, please don't take this wrong, but you don't seem to know much. You might try to read and learn before offering your advice, as you might lead others astray. I'm not trying to flame you, but you are basically flaming yourself via your own posts.:wink:

Twisted Avatar | 02-08-2008 10:36 AM
Re: Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? Quote:
Originally Posted by eat_beef (Post 959011) Turner Son, you're right, I forget that these basics need to be covered for the newbs. Twisted, please don't take this wrong, but you don't seem to know much. You might try to read and learn before offering your advice, as you might lead others astray. I'm not trying to flame you, but you are basically flaming yourself via your own posts.:wink:
Well taken......and noted T

Big_Rob | 02-08-2008 10:39 AM
Re: Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? 90% is a cheap way to bump up your ounce count. Think about it, 10 dollars face is roughly 7.1 ounces At Apmex, for $124.84 you can buy $10 face of 90% Compare that to: $133.91 for 7 2008 Canadian Maple Leafs $132.37 for 7 American Silver Eagles (their choice on the year) The only thing that is cheaper than the 90% is their generic .999 rounds where 7 ounces would be $123.90 And from what Ive heard is dealers still give you shit about generic rounds

yukoncornelius | 02-08-2008 10:59 AM
Re: Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? Please do not invest in 1964 Kennedy halves. They are garbage. There is actually no silver in them at all. :wink: Plus I plan on owning them all someday. :s9:

xinkid | 02-08-2008 12:33 PM
Re: Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? Quote:
Originally Posted by Big_Rob (Post 959026) The only thing that is cheaper than the 90% is their generic .999 rounds where 7 ounces would be $123.90 And from what Ive heard is dealers still give you shit about generic rounds
Maybe you should talk to some dealers first instead of hearing about it second-hand. ;) A local dealer I know pointed me to them without even mentioning the 90% coins they also have. They sell and buy the .999 generic rounds for a pretty reasonable spread.

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Gold & Silver Forum - Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea?

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- Gold - Silver - Coins - Numismatics (http://goldismoney.info/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=51)
- - Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? (http://goldismoney.info/forums/showthread.php?t=233469)

Big_Rob | 02-08-2008 02:11 PM
Re: Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? Quote:
Originally Posted by xinkid (Post 959199) Maybe you should talk to some dealers first instead of hearing about it second-hand. ;) A local dealer I know pointed me to them without even mentioning the 90% coins they also have. They sell and buy the .999 generic rounds for a pretty reasonable spread.
I should have said not as well known generic rounds

Awoke | 02-08-2008 04:12 PM
Re: Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? Thanks for the coin links, fellas! (Twisted and Canadian) So all this talk about silver coins... and noting the price difference for premium coins..... Would we not be just as well off buyng Kitco 1 oz waffers? They're cheaper, as far as I understand it, and still a troy oz of .999 Thoughts?

des00s | 02-08-2008 04:15 PM
Re: Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? I hate 90%.

Floyd | 02-08-2008 04:57 PM
Re: Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? Wakeness what are these "waffers" you speak of ?

budfox | 02-08-2008 04:58 PM
Re: Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? Owning anything silver is good...................

sliver | 02-08-2008 07:19 PM
Re: Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? Quote:
Originally Posted by clashcityrocker (Post 957642) 2. Saving 90% to perhaps use for barter some day? Calculating it all out is doable to be sure, but not always simple. Case in point. Pre-1965 Silver Washington quarters contain .18084 ounces of silver. Franklin half dollars contain .36169 ounces of silver. Roosevelt dimes contain .07234 ounces of silver. I think you see where I'm going with this. These are hardly round number amounts. Someone wants to trade you an item or service for 10 ounces of silver and what do you give them in return as far as 90% goes?
$1.50 in 90% is very close to 1 troy oz silver. I think that will be the exchange rate.

Jack London | 02-08-2008 08:03 PM
Re: Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? I'll add 2 pennies. I think 90% is a good way to own physical silver. In fact I would even say get it first. But I wouldn't say stay only in 90%. Get a variety of silver. One ounce rounds from any major government are good. Well known private companies, most specifically Engelhard, would be next. Change sizes, get some rounds and some small bars too. The basic idea is to get a variety of tradable forms of silver bullion, at a low premium. I don't know what the best way to own silver will be in the future, except that it should be physical. (Of course I have none. Sold long ago, at a loss.) So get a mix and relax.

Highbanker | 02-08-2008 08:55 PM
Re: Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? Just a note... the 40% Kennedy halves DO NOT have a copper "stripe"...From the edge they look the same as the pre-65s...They are not clad....they are made from an alloy of 40%silver....1965-1969 are 40% I personally do not like 40% kennedys...they are too heavy and you can pull a muscle or something when you tote them...stick to 64s...

madfranks | 02-08-2008 09:02 PM
Re: Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? 90% is good for playing poker with. Instead of the crappy plastic chips, bust out a chest of old silver dimes, quarters, halves and dollars. Much more fun to play with. Just make sure you get it all back at the end of the night. :wink:

acquila | 02-09-2008 03:41 PM
Re: Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? Quote:
Originally Posted by Highbanker (Post 959998) Just a note... the 40% Kennedy halves DO NOT have a copper "stripe"...From the edge they look the same as the pre-65s...They are not clad....they are made from an alloy of 40%silver....1965-1969 are 40% I personally do not like 40% kennedys...they are too heavy and you can pull a muscle or something when you tote them...stick to 64s...
Not true. The Kennedy halves are called "clad" because they are clad in a silver outer layer, composed of 80% silver and 20% copper. The inside "wafer" is composed of 21% silver and 79% copper. Overall, the composition is 40% silver and 60% copper but there are three different layers that form the final coin itself. The copper stripe is definitely visible... I suppose on some it may not be as obvious, but on others the stripe of imitation silver is glaringly obvious. I have bags of these worthless coins and the stripe is quite obvious on most. Although they still have a couple grams of silver in them, but 60% copper is fairly high and I have been offered as low as 60% of their spot price when I've tried to sell them, so I still consider them fairly worthless coins and would much rather have any other form of silver than clad Kennedys. Almost as bad as war nickels.....

Awoke | 02-09-2008 06:59 PM
Re: Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? Quote:
Originally Posted by Floyd (Post 959656) Wakeness what are these "waffers" you speak of ?
They are like small bullion bars, made by PM producers. They are one troy ounce of .9999 silver, just like an SAE of a maple. You can get them for weddings, birthdays, etc, but you can get them cheaper directly from a PM dealer, as far as I understand it. http://rcmgift.spiserver2.com/img_li..._image_417.jpg http://rcmgift.spiserver2.com/img_li..._image_412.jpg

BaaBaaBaa | 02-09-2008 07:29 PM
Re: Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? I remember back right before 2000.(The world was going to end in 2000) Bags of 90% silver where selling at a large premium. Does anyone remember how much? Anyway if you are buying silver for when TSHTF then 90% silver coins are the way to go.

BaaBaaBaa | 02-09-2008 07:53 PM
Re: Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? Junk silver traded at a 40% premium right before 2000. http://www.pcgs.com/articles/article1246.chtml Quote:
Junk Silver Bags at 40% Premium Y2K buying has also driven up the price of $1000 face-value bags of pre-1965 silver dimes, quarters, and half dollars. These normally low-grade circulated coins are 90% silver, and are often called "junk silver" to differentiate them from bullion coins such as Silver Eagles, which are guaranteed by the Mint to be 99.9% pure silver. Each bag contains 715 oz of silver and normally sells for around the spot price of silver times its silver content, which would currently be $5.10 x 715, or $3646 (90% Silver Bags were sold at $4,338.96 as of 8/10/99). Y2K-related buying has pushed the price of these bags to $5100, a 40% premium. Junk silver bags are not scarce and do not interest collectors. If nothing much happens on January 1, 2000, investors in these bags are likely to have a major headache even if they didn't drink on New Year's Eve.

Twisted Avatar | 05-24-2008 11:40 AM
Re: Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? Quote:
Originally Posted by budfox (Post 959663) Owning anything silver is good...................
yup T

CajunCoin | 05-24-2008 11:55 AM
Re: Is owning 90% silver coins a good idea? Bullion form of silver is very easy to counterfiet and copy. The general population doesn't even know how to weigh a round much less if the round is VALID. Now COIN SILVER is easily reconizable and has reference guides and standards. Which would you want in a SHTF situation. COIN wins every time. I will trade my rounds for your silver.

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